General Music Chat

I totally forgot the Grannys were on right after it was announced on TV.

I'm not into lip-syncing and watching people with excessive amounts of plastic surgery.

Shoot, watching Karioke would be far more entertaining.

Did Kanye WEst have the nerve to show up?

The young musicians and actors that win awards are probably the very same kids Larry King was busted for pimping 15 years ago and these old fart big wigs running Hollywood are the ones that were paying for them.

Beyonce gets 6 Grammies?
She doesn't even play an instrument to write her music.
I no longer watch television because of these people, they're trash. It's nothing more than an elitist social club where no talents and pretty faces get praised and take credit for the work of an army of people.

They keep bringing in these young kids like Taylor and Beyonce who are marketed as these wonderful Christians with amazing talent. Simple fact is they're wealthy or rich and success is bought and handed to them not earned.
Musicianship is a skill that can't be handed to you and writing a hit song is a talent derived from that skill.
I see none of that with these awards handed out.

Madonna, a good singer? A good songwriter?

No, on both counts.

Madonna is a GREAT entertainer. I'll give you that.

But she is one of the worst female vocalists that ever touched a microphone.

Christina Aguilera? Exceptional singer.

Taylor Swift? Not a very good singer... Just average, vocally. But she is a good songwriter. for as young as she is. Without the songwriting though, she'd just be bubble gum.

Taylor Swift? Not a very good singer... Just average, vocally. But she is a good songwriter. for as young as she is. Without the songwriting though, she'd just be bubble gum.

I didn't know if anyone else, watching or hearing her sing, noticed that she really is not a great singer. A few times during her performance at the Grammy's, it sounded like she was off key. I think the "general puplic" took a liking to her by the fact of how she got noticed to begin with. Cinderella story anyone? Will she be able to keep it up through the long haul, i.e. longevity? Time will tell. She is still young, and hopefully, she is putting her money away in a safe place for when she is no longer the "new" darling.

Just my thoughts.

Yes Robin a lot of people noticed she's not a very good singer. She might have been nervous, but if she wasn't young and cute no one would pay any attention.

Madonna slept her way into the business, well known fact.

Christina Aguilera's voice is good but not great. She bottlenecks her throat to compensate for a huge lack of range overlooked due to her lavish runs and soulful exaggerations...and naive fan base.
Most overrated singer of my generation hands down.

Taylor Swift is a rich kid bought into the business.
Her stock broker father relocated their family when she was 12 to Nashville specifically so she could pursue music. Rented her a stage at the local shopping mall regularly so she could perform.

Lady GaGa-another wealthy kid bought success.

The same is going on with rock bands, numetal bands etc. and acting as well.
Entertainment has finally degraded into a snob industry that more and more outsiders will be unable to earn a living in unless it's in production.

I see an industry overrun by narcissists that love attention and will do about anything a producer, agent or manager tells them if it means fame and fortune. So, we get entertainers like Beyonce Knowles who is a fair singer and dancer but can't even play an instrument to write her own music winning 6 grannies.

Jonny,

I kind of agree with you about Beyonce, although I don't know why being a songwriter has to be a prerequisite to win some grammys. But you are right... although I think she is a reasonably decent singer. But she sings everything in her head voice, which annoys me greatly. No real depth or richness to her voice.

We disagree about Christina. She has a great set of pipes. Not everybody has the range of a Kate Bush or Barbara Streisand.

I never bought into the Christina/Britney argument. There is no argument. Christina is a real singer, and Britney is a Barbie Doll who can sing in tune for the most part. Britney's face is more symetrical. So she got the most attention. It's image as a replacement for talent.

Give me the real vocalist any day.

Whew.. I thought I was the only one not buying into Taylor Swift's vocal talents. She seems like a nice person, but I just don't see a whole lot of vocal talent there. I could swear she loses pitch at times, and doesn't seem to belt out anything. I'm not so sure she would even win an American Idol had she tried out for it before her success.

Jonny,

I kind of agree with you about Beyonce, although I don't know why being a songwriter has to be a prerequisite to win some grammys. But you are right... although I think she is a reasonably decent singer. But she sings everything in her head voice, which annoys me greatly. No real depth or richness to her voice.

We disagree about Christina. She has a great set of pipes. Not everybody has the range of a Kate Bush or Barbara Streisand.

I never bought into the Christina/Britney argument. There is no argument. Christina is a real singer, and Britney is a Barbie Doll who can sing in tune for the most part. Britney's face is more symetrical. So she got the most attention. It's image as a replacement for talent.

Give me the real vocalist any day.

You're telling me you've never heard a local female soul singer with a better voice than Aguilera??

I've heard plenty and I'm not exactly in a mecca for singers in Cleveland.
Her voice is good but it's not great, I think you're just getting swept up in her glory runs and intense emotion. In terms of vocal quality though, her voice has some major weaknesses, it's her singing style that's winning fans.
She bottle necks her throat and goes into "the frog" to get into the ranges her voice can't hit when singing wide open. Any good vocalist knows what I'm talking about too.
Seriously, if you can't hear it, you're in the wrong business

While I greatly dislike Pink, her voice is much stronger. She hits full range without having to compromise the quality of her vocals. She's just a much better singer all around.

Beyonce's voice is fair but she's overrated.
She's cornered a market that white people can't in the same way, just a limitation of skin color. The same can be said of Taylor Swift.
It's not like the major labels will bring in someone to infringe on her fan base. The last thing they want to do is be at war with themselves. I go through dozens of band's pages on this site and Myspace music, the competition is REALLY strong these days. I hear dozens of musicians from all genres that have every quality necessary to be a mainstream success including the skill to write the hits but it's just not happening.

The industry is truly a mafia at this point that you need to be born into, buy into, sleep your way into or wine dine and dazzle the right people with your social graces.

What I dislike about Taylor is, the industry is attempting to use her to get country to crossover into the pop market and already used Miley Cyrus to get the ball rolling. As it is, both are just rich kids that were bought into the business. Entertainers that are successful due more to the years and money invested as well as being young rather than through their undeniable talent, skill and passion really turn me off.

It's the reason I dislike the Disney made kids so much.
They start out as these perfect CHRISTIAN kids and corner that market until their mid to late teens where they suddenly start marketing sleaze or, music, film and television catering to the oppressed Christians who can't really grow up.
Like Amanda Bynes and Hilary Duff's audience.

So to praise the likes of Beyonce, Aguilera, Swift, Timberlake etc. is a huge insult to someone like myself. I do more in a day than those kids do in a week.
They're literally turning in someone elses homework and taking credit for it. How someone can say they don't understand what song writing has to do with winning a granny is the dumbest fcking thing I've ever heard!

Singing is overrated, hundreds of millions of good singers out there.
But to write a great song, sing that song and be part of the creation process every step of the way...pop stars are frauds and do NONE of that!
They get songs offered to them and either contract the rights or they don't. I read about the process from time to time and sometimes one will reject a song and another will hear it and sign on to it.
In the end, they're just spoiled brats with mediocre talent, your lovely Aguilera included.

But, everyone believes what they're told these days. You read these bios for these kids and nobody questions them. For some, it's common knowledge that their parents are producers, writers, actors, politicians etc. and others, it's not.
I would still bet that most of these kids are the children of powerful people in the business and in many cases, it's withheld from public knowledge and always will be. They need the middle class over all other demographies to be successful. Meanwhile, none of them are middle class and never were. Nobody that's middle class can afford to ditch work a DOZEN and drive their kid across the country to an audition nor can they uproot their life just so their kid can cut an album or perform on a kids show.
That's genuinely what it takes if you're not in with the right people. DOZENS of auditions a month, month after month. I've worked in production. Someone walks in once, gets a huge gig as a teen or child well, they either got really lucky or, someone pulled strings even if they're oblivious to the fact. 90% of the time though, it's due to social ties or having family in the business. Having witnessed this first hand, it's how I know what a lie the business has become since the 90's.

So, I no longer watch much television or listen to commercial radio.
I listen to commercial free radio and college station which is where all the REAL musicians get exposure as well as websites like this and myspace music.
The Grannies are simply awards handed out by the record companies for making money. Show me ONE of these greedy asses actually making opportunity for the rest of us. It's just not happening and never will.

The Grammys are not a song-writing competition. There is no reason to expect them to be so. They are about the art of musical performance, supposedly.

Creativity has nothing to do with performance quality, in thier realm.

While it's true that a truly creative new song will often win an award, it still comes down to the performance of the music that makes the difference in the televised awards show. That's why they give Grammys to your Beyonce's etc instead of the ppl who write the songs. There are awards for writing, too - Grammys, in fact, but that isn't what the PEOPLE care about, & those awards are not televised, they're simply mailed out to the composers. The same is true for the producers' works. It ain't no big thang.

No one cares who penned that huge hit. They care about the ppl up on stage.

Thus, being able to write a song or not has no bearing on whether you win that Grammy. It may be the dumbest thing you ever heard, but that's the way it IS.

You sound bitter when you speak of ppl buying thier way into the business, but you know what? If you had the chance to do the same, you would take it, just to get your music out there, because you think you're worth it. They prolly do, too, in spite of your criticisms. And once they've decided to go for it, 99% of these ppl work thier asses off to get in the limelight & stay there. I have HUGE respect for Madonna, for example, considering the thousands of hours of hard work she does to produce a quality performance for her fans. I don't care if she plooked donkeys to get there. She's working like hell to be there, & doing a more than adequate job of it.

I agree that Swift, Aguilara, etc, are not the best there is out there, if you'll admit that Eric Clapton, The Beatles, The Stones, Elvis & many others also had great impact playing COVER material. They also got Grammys when they were still doing covers of other composers' works. Not a damned thing wrong with that. If your arrangements, your voices, your instrumentations are better than everyone else's in your genre in the public's eye, you deserve a big award from the industry.

You want to make it all about composing? There's a million awards out tere for that, & damned few ppl care about them. The ppl care about the performers, & the Grammys give them to them.

He won for his version of "A Day In The Life". See the link for more info.

Thats awesome I thought he did that a few years ago, cause I saw him in Nashville and he played it. Im glad Beck got something.

Jimmy I dont know if youve seen it but I was looking on youtube for an acoustic version of Black Hole Sun and found CHris Cornell doing a cool version, but I also found Peter Frampton doing an instrumental version and then another with Chris guesting with Peter and his band. I think I remember you like SOundgarden so you might want to check that out. I dont have a link but it should be easy to find. Frampton is an awesome guitarist! Did he ever win a grammy? just curious

So to praise the likes of Beyonce, Aguilera, Swift, Timberlake etc. is a huge insult to someone like myself. I do more in a day than those kids do in a week.
They're literally turning in someone elses homework and taking credit for it. How someone can say they don't understand what song writing has to do with winning a granny is the dumbest fcking thing I've ever heard!


Jony thats pretty strong there to say you do more than some of them do in a day! My daughter was into Miley Cyrus for a while and I got to watch alot of her stuff and they work their asses off way more than you probably ever will in your whole life. Not that Im into the whole kiddie pop thing, but they do work on a show that would exhaust most of us on here to even try. Since when has popular music really had anything to do with a being a great musician or a great songwriting? Wake up Dude! The Grammys are about popular culture and what is going on at a certain time with popular culture, great vibrant music rarely gets its due there, why cause most people arent into great vibrant original music.

Well said .Phil

He won for his version of "A Day In The Life". See the link for more info.

Thats awesome I thought he did that a few years ago, cause I saw him in Nashville and he played it. Im glad Beck got something.

Jimmy I dont know if youve seen it but I was looking on youtube for an acoustic version of Black Hole Sun and found CHris Cornell doing a cool version, but I also found Peter Frampton doing an instrumental version and then another with Chris guesting with Peter and his band. I think I remember you like SOundgarden so you might want to check that out. I dont have a link but it should be easy to find. Frampton is an awesome guitarist! Did he ever win a grammy? just curious

My daughter is actually a huge Soundgarden/Pearl Jam fan. I'd like to see Cornell reform the band but we'll see.

I don't think Frampton ever won a grammy but he's got a few gold records

Jony thats pretty strong there to say you do more than some of them do in a day! My daughter was into Miley Cyrus for a while and I got to watch alot of her stuff and they work their asses off way more than you probably ever will in your whole life. Not that Im into the whole kiddie pop thing, but they do work on a show that would exhaust most of us on here to even try. Since when has popular music really had anything to do with a being a great musician or a great songwriting? Wake up Dude! The Grammys are about popular culture and what is going on at a certain time with popular culture, great vibrant music rarely gets its due there, why cause most people arent into great vibrant original music.

Thanks, I was trying to say something like that. Well spoken.