General Music Chat

I understand what has become of the churches. I am saddened by it.

But see?

Don't be sad. DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!

I don't believe in bitching about things and putting up with them. Let's change it! Let's improve it!

And don't misunderstand me. Paul is not stupid. He is quite intelligent and capable. It is the idea that God would be displeased by INSTRUMENTS that is stupid.

Whenever someone's beliefs get threatened, they fear you being a stumbling block to them holding onto that belief. I'm not trying to be a stumbling block, I'm hoping for help in liberating Christianity before it gets relegated to ineffectiveness.

There have been two major beacons of light in bringing this world into civility and guiding it towards a new age:

1) Christianity
2) The United States

And BOTH are under assault right now, possibly as has not been seen since their inceptions.

I am adding my time and talents to bolstering them both, and if more people do the same... who knows? Maybe we can do something about it!

I see you all celebrating (with the exception of craig, who didn't seem to care either way) that you chased this guy out of here because his methodology was different than yours, and Paul, you did it the same way Craig is doing to you.

Let us all take the planks out of our own eyes before we cast our glance to another.

Well, I certainly don't plead perfection. I have anger problems, emotional outbursts, etc...

But why do you say I am indifferent?

Are you talking about Rev. Mike (who I guess was Ace Entertainment in disguise according to someone here)

I pleaded with him not to leave.

You're not him under a new name are you?

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Just fightin' fire with fire. BobdoB...it works for some things, doesn't it?

Besides. a year of this blowhard is more than most ppl can stand. There are PAGES of his braggadio all over this forum, & it just gets so old.

I never claimed to be oh so very nice & humble & knowledgeable & all that other fine stuff. If I had, perhaps my "validity" would be in question. In my humble opinion, the man's own words speak volumes, & I apologise if my mockery & insults have disturbed you, but when someone keeps harping day after day on the same subject, & still gets nowhere, in spite of his "vast knowledge" on everything under the sun, & while he insults ppl left & right, I'm gonna tell him to stfu.

I truly doubt that he'll see anything other than the "fact" that I'm "bullying" him, to use his own words, but the info is there for him, if he should decide to see it. He DOES read an awful lot, according to him. It just might do him some good.

It sure felt good to get that stuff out there for him to see, though...

Have a nice day.

I am not reverend mike, but that is who I was speaking of. I am a protestant christian who probably watched the same shows on the history channel as that guy, but didn't take to the drug angle. I don't know what my methodology would be, but I am always looking for God in my life, but I dont find Him in any substance, even communion to me is symbolic, not cannabalism. I find it interesting that I came on this site because a friend recommended it, for music purposes, and although I have read some of the other posts, this was the only one I was moved to remark upon.

I am not reverend mike, but that is who I was speaking of. I am a protestant christian who probably watched the same shows on the history channel as that guy, but didn't take to the drug angle. I don't know what my methodology would be, but I am always looking for God in my life, but I dont find Him in any substance, even communion to me is symbolic, not cannabalism. I find it interesting that I came on this site because a friend recommended it, for music purposes, and although I have read some of the other posts, this was the only one I was moved to remark upon.

Well, I'm glad you're here and sharing.

And I appreciate your level-headedness. I know I am coming down hard on Paul, but it is not really Paul the person that has me up in arms, it is the mentality of the brand he belongs to. And they are only one of MANY.

I used to hold various leadership positions in a few Southern Baptist churches, and was invited to attend a Southern Baptist Convention one time.

It was heartbreaking.

I sat there as they praised a church which now had the most votes in the convention. Why did they have the most votes now? They had brought the most money into the convention that year. Whether they realized it or not, they had placed MONEY as a value over SPIRITUALITY.

I almost cried.

I thought: "What if some poor church in Harlem, had brought twice as many souls to the Lord, as any other church, and yet they didn't bring much money in, because they represented poor communities."

They should be the church with the most votes. Not the rich church.

But it is the same with the Christian Music Awards show. It has nothing to do with which songs are the most spiritual, which ones are the most biblical. Which ones were the most inspirational. They are no different than any secular music awards program. It is about popularity and the money behind Christian labels. Nothing spiritual about it.

God is going to judge these things.

Just wait.

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I understand your sadness on that issue Craig. The frustration you feel towards what you percieve as the wrong mentality is the very thing you despise. All of you. Craig, Paul, and all the others, you all believe you know the truth, yet none of you agree on what that truth is. Well, here is the truth for all of you:

None of you know the truth, and wont until God reveals it in His own time, All of you, however, are under the influence of the prince of this world, he who would devide and conquer God's people. Each of you is as guilty as the other in that you are closed minded to outside beliefs. Craig, don't even argue that point, if you were open to others beliefs, you would not argue every single point.

May an Open Mind and an Open Heart lead me unto the Lord - Me

Musical instruments in the Church? Is that what we're arguing about now?? Instruments in the church?!?! Thou shalt not dance, but sing. Thou shalt not drink, but dance. Thou shalt not sing, but it's ok to play musical instruments (or not) ?? ..or something.... f**k me// this sh*t is just.. too much Whatta load of crickiey .. sht.. Why doesnt everybody just make up their own little rule-books, go make colonies and live in them, like the f**k moonies?? Jeez!

I understand your sadness on that issue Craig. The frustration you feel towards what you percieve as the wrong mentality is the very thing you despise. All of you. Craig, Paul, and all the others, you all believe you know the truth, yet none of you agree on what that truth is.

Actually, I bet most of us agree on the most important issues:

1) Jesus is God
2) Jesus alone is the Savior and Messiah
3) Jesus was born of a virgin, died on a cross and was resurrected
4) Salvation is a free gift, available by grace through faith
5) Salvation is forever. You don't lose your salvation.

Well, here is the truth for all of you:

None of you know the truth, and wont until God reveals it in His own time, All of you, however, are under the influence of the prince of this world, he who would devide and conquer God's people. Each of you is as guilty as the other in that you are closed minded to outside beliefs. Craig, don't even argue that point, if you were open to others beliefs, you would not argue every single point.

Argue every point with whom?

I guarantee you, that I agree with most of the Christians here on the central issues of the faith. And yet, you will also find me in agreement with people here of other religions, and even atheists, depending on the issues.

You will find people on every side of every aisle here, condemn my opinion on some issue, only to praise my opinion on another one.

I am kind of proud of that, cause it tells me that I am not a slave to dogma, or group think. I work out every issue on it's own merits.

I think you are trying to box me in, but I don't think anyone here believes I fit into any box very neatly.
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I am reading through the forums, and I do see that you have a lot of good advice, solicited and otherwise, but one common thread in all your posts, you are certainly sure of yourself to the point of vanity. I do not like to criticize, but I do not mince words either

Damn, BobdoB! I do believe that that there was the nicest insult...er...observation I've ever read in here! Quite accurate, too!



Perhaps we should talk to BM. They should change this from the "general forum" to "the book of Craig."

I dont mince words either.
Read the truth / the only truth that matters below.

The best thing to result from religion is the beautiful music it inspired and was produced by the world's finest musicians. Were it not for religion it's possible the world would not have the wonderful music of Bach, Handel and many others.

The worst thing resulting from religion is the petty squabbling, boundless hate and senseless wars it has inspired. Everyone can't be right, and it's possible you're all wrong.

But it is the same with the Christian Music Awards show. It has nothing to do with which songs are the most spiritual, which ones are the most biblical. Which ones were the most inspirational. They are no different than any secular music awards program. It is about popularity and the money behind Christian labels. Nothing spiritual about it..

Exactly! I have been playing in a worship band at church for 4 1/2 months now. I am a hired musician there along with the bassist and the keyboardist. The drummer, backup singer and worship leader (acoustic guitar and vocals) are members of the church, but the worship leader is also paid for his services. We just reformed after losing a rhythm guitarist (electric) and his wife (who had been playing keyboards) because of a squabble between them and the worship leader. The guitarist and his wife are members of the church and super nice people and they still come to church every Sunday and are nice to all. They stepped down on their own for the good of the band, as they saw that as the only solution. The band still has some problems which pretty much stem from the worship leader being a bit of a prima donna. He seems to be using his position as a stepping stone and would really like to make it big in the worship music business. He's an alright guy, but you can see right through him on this. I've seen this happen before in other churches, and I've seen worship bands that do it for all the right reasons too. I remember when I was a kid and every Sunday morning while getting ready for church, Mom and Dad always had the TV on with religious music programs, one of their favorites was "The Blackwood Brothers" show. One year, there was a big scandal over the Gospel Music Awards. Turns out, the Blackwood Brothers had bribed some of the judges in order to win. What a letdown! But it just shows what fame and egos can do to anyone and Christians are just as vulnerable as others.
What I'm getting at here (in a round about way), is that the more professional the music becomes, the more it can take away from glorifying Christ, and that's what church is supposed to be about in the first place. So, while I'm not opposed at all to musical instruments in church, I don't think Neanderpaul's church is wrong for not wanting that temptation in their services. I don't know what you're thinking, harping on him about that. He's not saying, "I'm right and you're wrong." That's what YOU are saying. He's saying, "You worship your way and we'll worship our way, as long as we're worshipping God." That's NOT what you're saying. To me (and probably most Christians on here) Paul comes across as the most righteous, and you come along as the most self-righteous.

Christians are just as vulnerable as others.
This is true in all things considered.
We bee's just like anybody / everybody else, falable humans.
Thats why it really cracks me up when folk want to bash Christians by saying that we are hypocrites.

Well no shyt Sherlock !! How long did it take you to deduce that one?

Not kidding...

My way of worshiping god is better than your way
My church is better than your church
My GOD is better than your GOD .... ect.

Seen this playout way to many times ... Self-righteous

My way is not better than anyone's. I am just a man. But God's way, clear as a bell, is the only way I will worship. I don't have a church. There is one God.

Eph 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

I wasn't refering to you Paul ... you seem to be a mumble person ... unlike Craig

Well, here is the truth for all of you:

None of you know the truth, and wont until God reveals it in His own time, All of you, however, are under the influence of the prince of this world, he who would devide and conquer God's people. Each of you is as guilty as the other in that you are closed minded to outside beliefs. Craig, don't even argue that point, if you were open to others beliefs, you would not argue every single point.

john 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.