General Music Chat

In the immortal words of Brother Dave Gardner (remember his comedy albums from the '60's?), "Let's make everything legal. That way, there wouldn't be any crime."
I smoked pot for years and don't have anything against it. I just kinda grew out of it. Everybody's story is different. Mine's probably about average. I never toked until I was out of high school and, in my case, that's probably a good thing. But, shortly after I was introduced to Mary Jane, and really enjoyed it. $10 to $15 and oz. back then. And, yeah, it lead to harder drugs in a round about way. I enjoyed partying so much that I tried a lot of things that my friends turned me onto. In that light, you could say that friendship leads to harder drugs. They weren't getting me hooked so that they could make money on me like real drug dealers, we just all enjoyed partying together and were in the mood to try different things. Never put a needle in my arm, never got addicted to anything. Partied for years, but, like I said, just grew out of it. Every once in a while, I'll still take a toke or two (that's all it takes anymore), maybe twice a year, and I have to be in the right mood to do it. I turn down probably 100 times as much as I actually do. This pertains to all drugs, alcohol included. I don't do them "just because it's there" as is the case with lots of people. Legalizing it wouldn't affect me one way or another. But, I do think it should be made legal, just because that would save us the tax money being spent on keeping casual users in prison. And the good Rev has a point about foreign drug cartels making all the money to support terrorism, instead of American farmers having a new cash crop to help their families and the American economy. And I don't mean just growing it for the pot heads, but the fact that so many useful items can be produced from hemp. George Washington Carver's new peanut. As far as legalizing it making it such a common item that people would take it for granted and actually use it less, we wouldn't know that until 20 or so years down the road after it has been legalized. At first pot smokers would go wild with their newly found freedom to toke, but that would wear off someday. Like kids driving cars right after achieving their license, they usually push it to the limits early on, but after the new wears off, they settle back a bit. I'm not saying stop the war on drugs, just make it a war on truly dangerous drugs. Of course that would, in reality, include a lot of "legal" drugs that are on the market today. They have warnings of all the bad things they can do, including death. Can anyone honestly say that pot is more dangerous than those?
Just look at Italy and France and other countries where children are allowed to drink a little wine with their meals. There moms send them with an empty jug to the winery or liquor store (or the equivalent) to pick up wine for the homes. Most of those kids don't even think about stopping and having a drink on the way home, because they don't have to. They don't have to hide it, therefore, the exciting danger factor doesn't come into play. Here in America, kids get someone older to buy for them, then they drink the whole bottle because they can't take it home and certainly don't waste it.
I think someday pot would be like this if it gets legalized, but that's just my opinion.

Im sorry Rev, I too run business's. We have a drug free workforce in action. One of my other companys years ago we had some guys that smoked pot. They cost more than the employees who didnt. These people missed more work than non pot smokers, they f**k up more sh*t and cost the company more than non pot smokers.

I dont need your propaganda. I speak from my viewpoint I really dont give a sh*t who or what you do. You are in a minority and will never make it legal. If you happen to get busted, what will that cost you and your family and your business's. I dont know what business you are in but unless you run a head shop or something along that line I would imagine most of your customers would not approve of your advocacy. If you dont believe me put a pot leaf in your local paper for your ads and see what happens. Im sure your life is just peachy with pot, but you need to tell the whole truth, not just your side of the coin.

I have a friend going thru this and it aint pretty. I see friends who go home after work light up and veg out on the couch and do nothing. Ive seen musicians squander their talent over smoking pot. It became a priority. I have another friend who got caught in a drug test and may lose his job of 30 yrs and benefits and retirement over it. Ive gone to bat for him in court as a character witness. Ive had drug addictions in my family and friends and most of them I know for a fact started with pot. Why cause years ago I was doing it to with these same folks that are now having some major problems.

My point in this is that we have younger less wise musicians that come on this site and see your post and think its cool. I should do that. If you are a true musican you should get your high from playing music. I just want fellow musicians to make their own choice based on real life experiences not just some sh*t you guys throw out there to support yourself. If your honest with yourself you know what Im talking about but your too damn thick headed to admit it.

I know Im stepping on some toes on this site from fellow musicians on this site that I respect. Sorry for that I know you all have to make your choice in these matters and I respect that. Its your life, but for every action there is a reaction.

I feel as Paul does that someone should not keep their mouth shut and say something against this.

You guys have a great day.

I am in agreement with JW123 on all points.

Rev.Mike, you say you have a family, businesses, house, that you smoke pot, and are responsible.

These are mutually exclusive ideas.

You have a family and smoke pot and are responsible?

NO you are not responsible. You are risking your families stability and security EVERY TIME you buy or grow or use.

That makes you selfish and your judgment is clouded by your "need" to "relax".

Other people don't need it to relax or cope. It is through continued use that you come to rely on it to "get normal".

I do, however, know alot of people that need to carry a cooler of beer on those trips...

There you go again. It's another case of the 45 mph crash being "good" in your eyes because the 65 mph crash is worse.

Do you really expect me to all the sudden think potheads who smoke and drive are ok just because alcoholics who drink and drive are worse?

You are blinded by your addiction. You are typical of potheads who love it and then rationalize everything else about it.

^ x 2

Why cause years ago I was doing it to with these same folks that are now having some major problems.

So, JW, you were in the same place as those people, but you didn't stay on that road. Good for you! (and I really mean that). You chose a wiser path for yourself, where lots (maybe most) of the people don't. I'd say you probably experienced a self awareness, and saw the things (not just drugs) that were interfering with your goals, and side stepped them. And THAT is the main problem with most people. They just go with the flow and don't have that self awareness, or just won't be truthful with themselves about it. But not everyone is made from the same mold. I think the Rev could actually be at his best even when he's high. I have known some people like that. Hendrix may not have been the musician that he was if not for experimenting with drugs. Nugent may not be the musician he is if he HAD done drugs. Everyone is going to make their own choices, right or wrong.

My point in this is that we have younger less wise musicians that come on this site and see your post and think its cool. I should do that. If you are a true musican you should get your high from playing music. I just want fellow musicians to make their own choice based on real life experiences not just some sh*t you guys throw out there to support yourself. If your honest with yourself you know what Im talking about but your too damn thick headed to admit it.

So, all you young musicians out there, live your life as you see fit. But don't lie to yourself about any of this. If you are going to smoke pot, but want to make it as a professional musician, look at it all logically. In some cases, pot may relax you and make you more comfortable with your playing. In other cases, it may affect your coordination and take away from your playing ability. Recognize the difference.
I'm not condoning or condemning it. I'm just saying recognize it for what it is. It changes your perspective on things because it is mind altering. And mind altering can be good or bad. If it takes away from your playing or performance, and you smoke it anyway, then you must not be very serious about being your best.

A dope head is just that a DOPE HEAD

Sorry this is just hitting real close to home to me these days. I ussually keep my mouth shut on these issues.

There is a huge cost monetarily, mentally and physically tied to pot use, but this imbecile Rev will never see it til he loses something.

See you in rehab dude

hey partner, your argument was much stronger b4 you started tossing insults. you make a great point that smoking and having a family is not responsible, but it's hard to get on that bus when you go from softly encouraging to blatantly being insulting. If you want to influence someone, it's probably best you don't call them a imbecile. u r out of line IMO.

I use marijuana, not your business. No one in my family suffers for it. I don't drink. I don't smoke cigarettes. I don't even drink coffee. I don't speed when I drive. I don't steal. I don't hurt others. Maybe you couldn't handle yourself responsibly when you used, but that is not me. Nor is it any of the people I know. You sit on your high horse about my pot smoking, but I'm sure you think its perfectly acceptable to have a few beers watching football, or a race. Why is that ok, but what I do is not? Just because you became a slave to a substance, does not mean everyone does. If I don't have the money for it, I just dont get it. If I am traveling, I dont need to take it. It is not a sure path to destruction for anyone. No substance is. It is ALWAYS a matter of responsible use. Beer kills, pot doesn't, but everyone on here seems to think that just because a bunch of beurocrats they openly bash and say are mindless on every other subject, agree with this because THEY cant handle themselves responsibly. That is TRUE ignorance.

I'll really surprise you now when I say I also don't thinking drinking beer is ok.

True ignorance or selfishness is using even though it endangers your family AND not admitting that FACT.

Not our business? It is when it's in your avatar retard. When you preach it literally you make it everyone's business.

You're thinking is so clouded you can't even debate.

Pot does kill too. One toke? No. But it does steal your life and motivation. Smoking and driving kills too. It is unnecessary and does lead many users to self destructive behaviors.

thats your opinion, however, 53% of americans have disagreed with you in open polls on major political scenes recently. Most americans now see weed as the least dangerous substance in comparison to the "legal" alternatives. Neanderpaul, my use doesn't take away anything from my family, we are very comfortable. It doesn't hurt them in any way, if it did, my wife would tell me. So, if you dont like it that is your right, but do not try to impose YOUR morality on ME. I openly display my beliefs, but do not force you to see my side, I just ask that if you don't agree, you don't resort to childish petty name calling. you make me sick...

Tell me Neaderpaul and JW, what bothers you more, the fact that I smoke pot, or the fact that I smoke pot AND make money in the music industry while you struggle to get people to hire you? Does it bother you that I get quarterly checks from ASCAP and BMI while someone like you just pays your yearly dues and gets nothing but the newsletter? Yeah, I think thats it.

Well, I've read that even mountain goats use. There's a certain plant they scrape off rocks with their teeth that actually gets them high.

Altered states aren't necessarilly bad, but they can be dangerous, even in the best of controlled situations. Ya never know when someone may depend on your quick reflexes to survive, like your child, or your significant other, or anyone at all.

In that respect, it's always best to have someone who's not using around to cover your butt when the unexpected occurs.

That point was really driven home to me one night.

I'd waited until the family was asleep, & decided to take a lil pill to take the edge off the day. (It matters not what the pill was - stick with me, here.)

Shortly after I'd popped the thing, my 16 yr old son came out of his bedroom covered with welts. It seems that the shrimp we'd had for dinner had triggered an allergic reaction, totally unexpected, since he'd eaten seafood all his life with no ill effects. I'd seen my dad go through anaphylectic shock, & this just triggered my adrenaline. I ushered him out to the car & rushed him to the hospital without even thinking about what I'd just taken.

it was well after midnight. Few cars on the road. I'm sure I did okay, cuz he'd have told me if I hadn't.

As we got there, they rushed him through the ER for some Benadryll, & when they were releasing him, I started to relax. That, of course, is when the pill kicked in, cuz my adrenaline had offset the effects until that moment.

As I drove home, it got me thinking, in spite of the effects of that lil downer I'd taken. I drove on the back roads, knowing that this didn't necessarilly make me any safer, but at least there was a lower chance of meeting any other drivers there.

I still could just kick myself in the ass for not telling my wife to drive him, but, being the control freak I guess I am, I was running on autopilot & just taking care of things like I always do. I never told my family about the danger I'd put my son in, but yeah, it bugged the sh*t out of me. Still does.

Since then, I'm far more careful about the things I take, where & when I take them, & I make as sure as I can that there is a responsible, trustworthy, sober person around. It STILL doesn't make it perfectly safe, & I know that.

In spite of all that, though, I firmly believe that, for most ppl, if not for all, altered states are somewhat necessary.

I know that statement will offend quite a few ppl, but on most subjects, I go back to thinking about what we really are. We are animals, no matter how we try to separate ourselves from nature, or strive to rise above that state of being. We cannot "rise above" our animal state, however. We are what we are, & there's no changing that. We have the same needs as all animals - food, water, shelter, family (since we are also mammals), & a sense of the "other." Nearly all mammals have the need to escape this particular "reality," to sense that "other." It's just another type of medicine for us, imho.

Many of us take it to extremes. Even some mountain goats will wear their teeth down to nubs trying to get that plant, hurting themselves in the process. Many of us don't. You can no more make gross generalizations about natural substance use than you can about personality types. Perhaps ALL such things are bad for some ppl, for some animals. For others, it's not only "okay," but necessary for good mental (or "spiritual," if you will) health. In spite of judeo/christian demands & traditions & admonitions, some ppl simply cannot live by faith alone, & truly need to feel that sense of the "other."

That being said - keep it safe as you possibly can, & stay away from the man-made processed crap just as you should stay away from the processed "foods."

That's just my take on it.

I feel very lucky that my son & I made it through my little life lesson safely, & without drawing the local police's attention, but I'm glad that I had that experience. It made me more aware of the possibility of things going wrong, & far less apt to repeat it.

lol Where is your pulpit>? Is he the only rev here? I bet fing not.

This is why I don't like govt. They think it's ok to impose their morals on you whether you like it or not.

I think the sun is beating on your brains..

Be it a hat or hair or a wig or wtfever you want, you better cover up your head before all that's left is a semblance of egg salad.

Have another drink, you know it's killing you faster than you thought.

And good luck with your businesses, you know you need to diversify, jackass. lol Something has to save ya.

If anyone ever needed rehab for pot, they should have just done themselves a favor and ate the lead, as they were way too pu**y to be able to go on with it all.

Well, I've read that even mountain goats use. There's a certain plant they scrape off rocks with their teeth that actually gets them high.

Altered states aren't necessarilly bad, but they can be dangerous, even in the best of controlled situations. Ya never know when someone may depend on your quick reflexes to survive, like your child, or your significant other, or anyone at all.

In that respect, it's always best to have someone who's not using around to cover your butt when the unexpected occurs.

That point was really driven home to me one night.

I'd waited until the family was asleep, & decided to take a lil pill to take the edge off the day. (It matters not what the pill was - stick with me, here.)

Shortly after I'd popped the thing, my 16 yr old son came out of his bedroom covered with welts. It seems that the shrimp we'd had for dinner had triggered an allergic reaction, totally unexpected, since he'd eaten seafood all his life with no ill effects. I'd seen my dad go through anaphylectic shock, & this just triggered my adrenaline. I ushered him out to the car & rushed him to the hospital without even thinking about what I'd just taken.

it was well after midnight. Few cars on the road. I'm sure I did okay, cuz he'd have told me if I hadn't.

As we got there, they rushed him through the ER for some Benadryll, & when they were releasing him, I started to relax. That, of course, is when the pill kicked in, cuz my adrenaline had offset the effects until that moment.

As I drove home, it got me thinking, in spite of the effects of that lil downer I'd taken. I drove on the back roads, knowing that this didn't necessarilly make me any safer, but at least there was a lower chance of meeting any other drivers there.

I still could just kick myself in the ass for not telling my wife to drive him, but, being the control freak I guess I am, I was running on autopilot & just taking care of things like I always do. I never told my family about the danger I'd put my son in, but yeah, it bugged the sh*t out of me. Still does.

Since then, I'm far more careful about the things I take, where & when I take them, & I make as sure as I can that there is a responsible, trustworthy, sober person around. It STILL doesn't make it perfectly safe, & I know that.

In spite of all that, though, I firmly believe that, for most ppl, if not for all, altered states are somewhat necessary.

I know that statement will offend quite a few ppl, but on most subjects, I go back to thinking about what we really are. We are animals, no matter how we try to separate ourselves from nature, or strive to rise above that state of being. We cannot "rise above" our animal state, however. We are what we are, & there's no changing that. We have the same needs as all animals - food, water, shelter, family (since we are also mammals), & a sense of the "other." Nearly all mammals have the need to escape this particular "reality," to sense that "other." It's just another type of medicine for us, imho.

Many of us take it to extremes. Even some mountain goats will wear their teeth down to nubs trying to get that plant, hurting themselves in the process. Many of us don't. You can no more make gross generalizations about natural substance use than you can about personality types. ALL such things are bad for some ppl, for some animals. For others, it's not only "okay," but necessary for good mental (or "spiritual," if you will) health. In spite of judeo/christian demands & traditions & admonitions, some ppl simply cannot live by faith alone, & truly need to feel that sense of the "other."

That being said - keep it safe as you possibly can, & stay away from the man-made processed crap just as you should stay away from the processed "foods."

That's just my take on it.

I feel very lucky that my son & I made it through my little life lesson safely, & without drawing the local police's attention, but I'm glad that I had that experience. It made me more aware of the possibility of things going wrong, & far less apt to repeat it.

very well said...

and I am very hyper and spastic when I don't use...always been a very overactive minded (too old to have been diagnosed adhd, but would have if I was a younger generation) so it is medicinal for me as well as recreational and spiritual. Cursed is my name by some for these beleifs...literally

.....................................

thats your opinion, however, 53% of americans have disagreed with you in open polls on major political scenes recently. Most americans now see weed as the least dangerous substance in comparison to the "legal" alternatives. Neanderpaul, my use doesn't take away anything from my family, we are very comfortable. It doesn't hurt them in any way, if it did, my wife would tell me. So, if you dont like it that is your right, but do not try to impose YOUR morality on ME. I openly display my beliefs, but do not force you to see my side, I just ask that if you don't agree, you don't resort to childish petty name calling. you make me sick...

Tell me Neaderpaul and JW, what bothers you more, the fact that I smoke pot, or the fact that I smoke pot AND make money in the music industry while you struggle to get people to hire you? Does it bother you that I get quarterly checks from ASCAP and BMI while someone like you just pays your yearly dues and gets nothing but the newsletter? Yeah, I think thats it.

it clearly has effected your ability to 'get' the point he's trying to make:
let me sum it up for you in a way you might be able to understand a bit better...
it is illegal (unless you are one of the few in ca or or that have a prescription) and when you get caught they will toss you in jail... this will take you away from your kids, they could take your house/car, your biz could be left unmanaged, they could fine you, and ultimately all of these things will effect your family. This makes you irresponsible. This could become my prob when your family goes on welfare.
again, make it legal and all these arguments go away... and we're left with only one argument: second hand smoke. I would bet hard cash that you smoke in the house...
take that away, and I could care less what you do. I'm fine w it. But don't do it in front of your kids. why? having sex is ok but you don't do that in front of your kids right? you shouldn't get drunk in front of them either.

Rev - the effects you describe when you don't imbibe are, in fact, indicators of some sort of addiction.

If you do, indeed, have ADHD, the smoke, while making you feel better while you're toking, will actually exacerbate your ADHD condition, creating the need for yet more smoke. The circle tightens around you until your entire life revolves around the substance.

It is not too late for that ADHD diagnosis, nor too late for treatment. Guess what the preferred treatment is? Extremely small doses of speed! This will help you to focus (it helps virtually ANYONE to focus, btw). Other treatments include non-speedy drugs, which I don't recommend any more than I do the speed, & behavioral therapy. There's also a cognizant approach, which makes the most sense to me. I hope you check it all out, cuz self-medicating a self-diagnosis just isn't the smartest thing to do.

Whatever - do remember that if you DO have ADHD, the pot makes it WORSE, not better, no matter how good & calm the stuff makes you feel.