United States

CF's right about one thing - I AM frustrated & angry, & I'm not alone.

No your not! but you won't hear that on the media (state TV) because they want everyone to think that we are but a few fringe radicals trying to stir up trouble, even though we are just regular people who are aware of and pissed off by what they are doing. Even our state representatives are raising a stink about it but again, you won't hear that on the media either!

here is a group of police & military personnel that wont obey any unconstitutional federal orders!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzadNTI2bec

And this is how you talk to law enforcement when they try to violate your CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irYJVn2k6zU

and the truth of what the globalists are up to:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8bbrXnYJOo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovVU9ou2rBs

www.myspace.com/blunderingeye
www.myspace.com/445175001
http://ezfolk.com/audio/bands/6039/

"my dog is a bitch"

Hey Phil.
No mate I'm largely in agreement with a lot of what has been said. I guess it really depends on what other skills you have and how you have been affected that will sway your viewpoint?

I'm highly qualified in two trades, very knowledgeable in another and have another skill on the back burner not counting music. Outsourcing comes in many forms, not least hiring illegals which is outsourcing too.

I still have no new work at present, things are really tough and today we are supposed to hear about SEVERE job losses. I say buy American, work American. Yup I'm a Brit but I also have a lot of common sense and drive an American Car.

Hey, I'm open to opposing views if you have the facts to back it up...I'm just looking at what I'm seeing & coming to conclusions based on it all.

Speak up, Chippy, & I'll listen.

CF's right about one thing - I AM frustrated & angry, & I'm not alone.

It's not so unusual for "transplants" from around the globe to "get it".
Many Americans are all too caught up in the cradle to grave mentality.
Fake hair, fake nails, fake boobs, fake tans, life revolves around their cell phone types will never "get it". When the bubble bursts they will just be a food source for the survivors. (No I dont mean that literally)
All one need do is read diares from post WW Europe to know of what I speak. And some think it cant happen here. Sorry folks we are not that special.

It's not so unusual for "transplants" from around the globe to "get it".
Many Americans are all too caught up in the cradle to grave mentality.
Fake hair, fake nails, fake boobs, fake tans, life revolves around their cell phone types will never "get it". When the bubble bursts they will just be a food source for the survivors. (No I dont mean that literally)
All one need do is read diares from post WW Europe to know of what I speak. And some think it cant happen here. Sorry folks we are not that special.

Americans dont know anything because we have state TV.! The few that look only get the truth from other unrestricted sources on the web like www.infowars.com and www.prisonplanet.com and radio programs like coast to coast am. In 1990 when 100 banks failed in Colorado, the federal gov put a media block at the state borders preventing anyone from learning of it in order to retrieve their money from those institutions. They made sure that that money stayed with the banks; how many of those bankers went to jail... 1. how many kept all of their wealth... all of em! Who's making the rules... International Bankers!

www.myspace.com/blunderingeye
www.myspace.com/445175001
http://ezfolk.com/audio/bands/6039/

"my dog is a bitch"

so far 14 states have signed a pact to ignore any orders form the federal government that are unconstitutional and stop giving any tax money to the federal government and dissolve it!
That's what we can do. without "our" money they can do nothing!!!

A pointless and stupid endeavor. The first thing that would happen after the government dissolved and anarchy broke out is that people would clamor for stability, protection and peace, so they'd form a new government...

Don't think for one second that this country (or any country really) could operate for one day without a government body that had real power. You think being out of work is bad? Try anarchy. You haven't seen anything yet. Think about the L.A. riots 15 years ago. Now imagine that nationwide, in every city across the U.S. You want to live without a stable and strong government? Move to the Gaza Strip and get a taste of life when every moment of every day is lived in fear.

You can't solve the problems of government by ignoring it and cutting off the funding. That's not even the wrong way to solve the problem; that is no solution at all.

Your taxes pay for important infrastructure elements, like the US Military, FBI, counter-terrorist units, federal courts, prosecutors, etc. At the core level, the government exists to simply and effectively protect you from dangers within the US and without, so that you don't have to worry about that crap. Thus, you are free to pursue happiness and deal with the smaller matters of your own everyday life. Like figuring out how to pay rent.

Times are tough for a lot of people. And there's no simple and easy reason for it, just like there's no simple and easy solution. To think that is to ignore the complexity of the world around you, and to ignore the realities of the world around you.

Anyway... these kinds of discussions always frustrate me. Average people think with average minds, and see things simply, unable to take in all the variables and see the impacts of what they say if such ludicrous ambitions were actually put to practice.

You want to change the world for the better? Start with yourself and those around you, who you can affect in a positive way. If you raise your kids, for instance, to not be lying, money-grubbing bastards, then maybe they won't grow up to be the CEO of the next Enron.

I may be thinking with an average mind, but it doesn't look like rocket science to me.

If you have a problem with jobs being out-sourced, make it too expensive to do so.

If you have a problem with illegal aliens taking jobs from your ppl, make the ppl who hire them into criminals, & punish them roughly enough that others won't follow in their footsteps.

If you have ppl stealing from other ppl, punish them, & force them to pay back that which they stole.

The more complex you make these problems, the more loopholes ppl will find & use against other ppl, to the detriment of us all. That's why we're in this mess.

Now that is common sense!
Are you running this year Phil?

I may be thinking with an average mind, but it doesn't look like rocket science to me.

If you have a problem with jobs being out-sourced, make it too expensive to do so.

If you have a problem with illegal aliens taking jobs from your ppl, make the ppl who hire them into criminals, & punish them roughly enough that others won't follow in their footsteps.

If you have ppl stealing from other ppl, punish them, & force them to pay back that which they stole.

The more complex you make these problems, the more loopholes ppl will find & use against other ppl, to the detriment of us all. That's why we're in this mess.

I may be thinking with an average mind, but it doesn't look like rocket science to me.

That's because you aren't seeing the whole picture (and I don't mean that in a personal-attack kind of way; I like you Philby)

As a musician, your hands are often your lifeblood. So take a moment and look at your hand. Looks pretty simple, doesn't it?

But anyone with a degree in medical science or a wide knowledge of anatomy will tell you there's more to it than meets the eye. How does it work? Not so simply. A complex interaction between your brain (a seemingly unrelated body part), electrical signals, your muscles, nerves, bones, skin, blood and ligaments make it work.

But any 5-year-old can you draw you a simple picture of a hand.

If you have a problem with jobs being out-sourced, make it too expensive to do so.

And how does that solve the problem? Think it through. Completely. Beginning to end.

Capitalism can't survive without profit. What happens when you make it "expensive" to outsource jobs? When companies see their profits threatened, they don't just move jobs overseas, they move the whole company overseas.

The world is a capitalistic one. If America were to become a socialist society overnight, we'd lose millions of jobs as companies pulled up stakes and went elsewhere. Entrepreneurs will just move to Singapore instead (which, incidentally, is what happened to all the good stem cell researchers when the Bush administration banned government funded research)

You can't "punish" a company in a capitalistic society for making a profit. You can tax them, but even then, if you tax too much they'll go elsewhere. Punishment runs contrary to how capitalism works.

You have to think the problem through.

If you have a problem with illegal aliens taking jobs from your ppl, make the ppl who hire them into criminals, & punish them roughly enough that others won't follow in their footsteps.

This is what I'm talking about - not seeing the whole picture. You're ignoring all of the factors that make illegal immigrants relevant.

Ask yourself, why do immigrants come across the border to take these jobs? And what jobs are they? And why aren't American workers taking these jobs? Do you really think there are people who are hiring immigrants over an equally qualified American? Dream on. All things equal, an employer will hire an American because there's no risk involved.

Immigrants come over to take these jobs because Americans won't do them.

For instance, whose going to pick crops when you outlaw illegal immigrants? Farmers can't get regular Americans to do those jobs at the wages they pay. And most farmers can't afford to pay the kinds of wages that entitled Americans believe they deserve. Its' a catch-22.

So your solution is to "punish" the farmers? Brilliant, because now you've just put an entire farm into foreclosure. The farmer goes to jail, the immigrants go out of work, and the unemployed Americans still have nothing.

Nobody wins.

If you have ppl stealing from other ppl, punish them, & force them to pay back that which they stole.

Theft is already a crime. Of course, if you dissolve the government, good luck prosecuting the criminals and getting your money back.

The more complex you make these problems, the more loopholes ppl will find & use against other ppl, to the detriment of us all. That's why we're in this mess.

We're in this mess for a lot of different reasons. Simplifying things doesn't solve the problems. And short term, short-sighted solutions only make things worse.

You have to have a larger perspective on this stuff, and you have to be willing to think long term to get to actual, real solutions. You also have to have some patience, because these problems are complex enough and big enough that no solution is going to happen overnight. There are no magic bullets here.

The world is a rapidly changing place. It is also, like it or not, a capitalistic one. Money is its lifeblood. You have to be willing to deal with it in those terms. You have to accept the ever-changing nature of the world, and the capitalistic nature of it, and work within those bounds to get what you want.

The best thing we can do, as Americans, is learn from the mistakes of others (and this really works for anyone). The lending markets made a huge mistake. The buyers overextended themselves and reached for more than they were capable of handling. The government didn't regulate the lenders. The lenders were driven to loan money to risky buyers. Everyone - EVERYONE - had a part in this. You can't just simply blame one quadrant and call it good.

What we have to do is learn from this mistake and take steps to make sure it doesn't happen again.

Same thing happend with Enron. They were allowed to utilize questionable accounting practices to artificially inflate their stock prices. We now have Sarbanes-Oxley regulations to guard against that.

Railing against job losses won't solve problems.

You can't solve the problems of government by ignoring it and cutting off the funding. That's not even the wrong way to solve the problem; that is no solution at all.

Your taxes pay for important infrastructure elements, like the US Military, FBI, counter-terrorist units, federal courts, prosecutors, etc. At the core level, the government exists to simply and effectively protect you from dangers within the US and without, so that you don't have to worry about that crap.

By the people, of the people, for the people. I guess these words don't mean anything anymore. Does the government protect us for our good or for their own good because they need our tax money to operate. Yeah, we need a good strong government but this one is too powerful and self centered. They don't give a sh*t about us as people anymore. CF, you talk a good argument and seem to know a good bit. If you had been around with these arguments before 1776, we'd all still be Brits, right Chippy?

Nah.

Look at NYC today. Another few helpless people shot and killed for nothing except losing a job.

Perhaps there will be no say at all and things will follow a course that is ever increasing?

People need to talk more!

Your trying to attach reasonable rational thinking to problems that are nearly all quick fixes. Great Idea! do you really think that the people in control are that stupid that they cannot see and fix the problems "we" suffer from?
They know exactly what they are doing, and one of them is using information, or in most cases disinformation to herd people into the directions that they want them to go. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out either. Or a political scientist either!
Propaganda is their most used and most valuable tool... divide and conquer baby! First they scare everyone with fake crime wars , drug wars, gas crisis ect. ect. Then they come in as our savior, when they created all o the problems for just that purpose.
You might want to actually look at that Info I gave you, then make a judgment!
I used to listen to this stuff for the fun of it. It was fascinating but I thought they were all whacko intellectuals. But after one government document after another, military officer after, congressman after documented insider after another, well you better start paying attention!

I prefer weathermen. They seem to know it all.
Any case I think we all know the score right? (No pun intended).

Peeps gotta talk more, get on, life's way too short without making it shorter and there is a whole Galaxy out there waiting for us to go see if we have the will as a race?

What is happening now is very sad in every country.

Colorsfade sees the necessity of a governing body and I agree but... read on please.




A system or a government is just as good as the people implementing it, so when advocating the necessity of a governing body it’s important to underline the necessity of an efficient, honest and impartial government, as things are now our government is anything but.

I for one I’m frustrated by the fact that our foreign policies for decades have been dictated by foreign lobby (one in particular I’m not going to mention it ) This little shytty country is the reason why we are at war with 2 countries not to mention the terroristic attacks on US soil, the unbridled support for said country resulted in almost worldwide dislike for the US government for blindly supporting the criminal expansionistic policy of this shytty country.

As for domestic issues everything is geared to favor business or corporations at the expanse of the citizens who have no elbow room for mistakes while scumbags like Bernard Madoff is allowed to rip off 50 billion over a period of decades with impunity, this is just one example there are countless corporate misdeeds which effected the lives of thousands of Americans, Enron, World Com the Keating five provide more examples.

Yes institutions are necessary but is seems to me these institutions are there to protect and facilitate corporate America which in itself is not wrong, but when institutions protect and condone corporate crimes then people like Philby have the right to bitch about it.

I’d advice everybody to do some research on our monetary system how it is set up and who runs it, briefly for those not familiar with it, once America operated on Gold standard system I.E. the money printed had to match the value of the gold in reserve, since the mid 30’s the monetary system was changed by a Bunch of bankers who eliminated the gold standard and replaced it with legal tender.

Under the Gold standard system the dollar bill stated that was issued by the treasury of the Unite States and had the full value of the dollar, today’s currency is not issued by the Government but rather the Federal reserve that in spite of the name” Federal” has no affiliation to the Us government at all, as matter of fact the Federal Reserve is a corporation
run by 10 Bankers totally independent with no oversight on the part of our government.

This is how it works: When the Us government need founds or currency, it places an order for a specific amount, in turn this private corporation called Federal Reserve prints the money and lands it to us or the our government for a fee, this means that we are constantly in dept with the Federal Reserve, the system or the Institution is designed to keep us forever in dept, to ensure that these monies gets paid back the bankers lobbied and successfully instituted the Income Tax system on the American people, in a way one can say that the IRS is the strong arm of this private corporation called Federal reserve.

There is a lot more to this but I’m going to stop here so not to bore readers.

Holy cow man. Read your freakin history.
It's not "getting worse".
People have always been evil. Ever since the great fall.
There are just more of us. And better communications.
Do you think Priests just started molesting boys in your lifetime?
To hear the TV jackasses talk, no one was ever killed before the invention of the gun.
The great American experiment has not failed us. We have failed it.
We took the easy way out. To busy running in our little hampster ball to pay attention to whom and what we elected.
How many of you have ever gone to a City Councel Meeting.
How about three in a row? Can you name your Mayor? Police Chief?
Can you name your county Sherriff, or Judge? Whom is the Leutentent Govenor of your state. Can you name your state representative, your senitor?
Time for all of us to get involved. Or Just bend over.

I'd like to jump into this poop pot of a conversation at this time.

I've been reading a lot of opinion and whinin' and I'm not about to give a solution to all the problems of the world as yet.

However....

Just for the record,I'm descended from European immigrants who came to North America for various reasons (mostly to do with issues dealing with intolerance, and-or economics). As far as I can trace my personal genealogy, most of my ancestors arived BEFORE there was a nation called The United States Of America. None the less, America is the world I was born and raised in, and I still believe in its ideals. One of the most important aspects of American life is the concept of Freedom, or Liberty, if you will. Sadly, I seldom see these terms spoken much, or taken seriously these days. Freedom is #1 in my book, but it's probably untenable without some bit of intelligence and common sense. Another important word is Tolerance. If you don't know what either of these terms mean, I strongly suggest you go look them up.

Whilst ol' Howlin's ire is up, I'd like to comment on a concern I have with "our government" on the national level at the moment.
I feel that there has been a serious breakdown in the system of "checks and balances" in recent times. I strongly suggest that all of my fellow minstrels who have the right to vote, thereby adding true force behind your whining voice into American affairs , look into this serious problem and act accordingly next election! Seems to me that its time to do a bit of "spring cleaning" in the old house and senate!

Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm gonna go vent my frustrations on the ol' piano, fry up some bacon and eggs, and then go do some work on my new house.(And thank God, and the forefathers, that I still have the Freedom to do so! )

later,
Howlin'

P.S.
My apologies for "going off" on this matter, but good 'ol Kilgore George' s comment about "taking action" aroused my Pennswoodsman's propensity toward revolution! (I like the way those Texans think)
HJ