General Music Chat

If you could change one aspect of the gig booking process, what would it be? In other words what's the biggest pain in the *** for booking gigs, in your humble words.

I'm trying to complete one of my quote topics so feel free to share.


Cheers

Gig

The biggest pain, hum that would be playing the gig! I personally love the chase trying to get the gig more than the playing. I guess I should have been a manager, but theres nothing more satisfing than getting that gig that I thought I wouldnt get. Its all in the chase.


Ha Ha, I would say negotiating the price. Locally we have a couple of corporate clubs, meaning that one company owns 7-8 local live music venues. These are good music clubs cause all of them feature music 3-5 nights a week. They have a lock on some bands in the area. We are playing one a couple of times simply to get at the built in audience and some of our audience has requested that we play there. But these guys have decided to cut what was already a cut rate for gigs. We are getting $300 and have to play a thursday night to get a sat night gig the month after. The manager told me that as one of their bands we would be on some sort of probation for 6 monthes and then at the end of that time they would probably give us a $50 a night pay raise. But the word from other bands recently in their loop is that they are cutting the pay back. I asked the manager what is top pay and he said $500. I know a couple of the better drawing bands that play there and theyve confirmed this price. I have procured a couple of outside sponsors for gigs who I call on when we get in these situations, to supplement our pay. One is a car dealership and with his economy Im scared I will lose his involvement before long. I dont know how or why decent cover bands even play gigs for $300 a night. In our case we have band members coming from 3 other counties and when I add up everyones gas just to be there weve already burned $120. Then they dont have a tab for the band, we have to pay full price for food and drinks, which will burn another $70-100 dollars. In the end we may clear 80-100 dollars off the bars pay, split 5 ways thats 20 dollars for 4 hrs of gig time, 3 hrs of getting there and setting up time, or basically 8 hrs. That means we are making around $2.50 an hour for our time. Now as stated before in my bands case we will make more from outside support than from the clubs support, so Im not that worried about it. We need the club on our resume and also are trying to get their patrons to follow our band which shouldnt be hard since all the other bands playing there kinda of have a crappy attitude cause they arent making enough to be there.

So to answer the question again, when you are asked how much you charge, thats the crappiest part. You dont want to lose a gig over $50 bucks but you dont want to leave anything on the table. In my area the typical pay for a band is $400 or some give you $100 a man. Strangely we are getting calls from some really small places and they arent balking at paying $650 a night, whereas the big clubs dont want to pay.

I dislike the business aspect of music. I just want to show up, get paid and get laid. Too bad that's not the real world. I guess the hardest part in booking gigs is breaking through the cliques and people barriers. There are circuits here (like everywhere) where a rotation of bands dominate the booking. Breaking into that little circle is the challenge. First you have to actually hang out at the venues, get to know the decision makers and and maybe even schmooze them a little. This is why agents were invented.

thx a lot JW!

great input as always. Man you're probably one of my most quoted musicians.

taking a different approach and trying not to repeat others-

I'd say one of the really hard parts is also knowing when the band is "ready" to gig. Added to that, everyone in the band agreeing on the being ready, as well as agreeing on the gigs (assuming bars). I've played bars for the sake of my band in the past that I really wouldn't have booked, or even considered booking.

Also when bandmates book "free" gigs, it tends to piss everyone off and cause tension.

So I guess the short answer is:
"Everyone in the band being on the same page about the bookings"

There's too many bands trying to gig in few too places. There's too many bands willing to play for next to nothing or nothing. I'm too blunt when trying to get gigs. Here's our demo, here's what we need in terms of dollars, yeah or nay? I don't want to say anything negative on venue owners but the only thing that matters to them is how much can they make and how little can they pay. It's what the economy will bear right now. The system of musician's financial renumeration in this country needs a radical overhaul. I'm making the same money or less than I did in the early eighties. Hey people did you ever hear of INFLATION? Everything COSTS A LITTLE MORE NOW. It's time to start paying us a little more, can you pay us at least minimum wage? I guess you get my drift, the BIGGEST PAIN in booking gigs is dealing with bar owners who have you by the jewels knowing that the best bands in town are already playing there for peanuts. Nuff said...

There's too many bands trying to gig in few too places. There's too many bands willing to play for next to nothing or nothing. I'm too blunt when trying to get gigs. Here's our demo, here's what we need in terms of dollars, yeah or nay? I don't want to say anything negative on venue owners but the only thing that matters to them is how much can they make and how little can they pay. It's what the economy will bear right now. The system of musician's financial renumeration in this country needs a radical overhaul. I'm making the same money or less than I did in the early eighties. Hey people did you ever hear of INFLATION? Everything COSTS A LITTLE MORE NOW. It's time to start paying us a little more, can you pay us at least minimum wage? I guess you get my drift, the BIGGEST PAIN in booking gigs is dealing with bar owners who have you by the jewels knowing that the best bands in town are already playing there for peanuts. Nuff said...

Minnimum wage?!? Not just negotiating pay but doing it in a professional manner. Dealing with contracts and detrmining if a deposit should be paid or not? Then making sure that a receipt or invoice is given for the sake of filing taxes. It is tough recognizing that music business as well as performance, is work.

These days, I sit on my butt & get calls when ppl want me. I'm not aggressive about going out to play. I tell them what I want in terms of money, & if they counter that with something acceptable I'll play the gig. Otherwise, I'll stay with my day job. I've gotten too frustrated with the way things are to even deal with it anymore.

In the bands I play in, I leave it to other ppl, cuz my way of handling things just doesn't get the work these days. But I will not play a gig for less than $100 unless it's a benefit that I believe in, & the bands I work in know that, & accept it.

I guess that sorta makes me semi-retired, doesn't it? Well, I like it like this, & I don't get all angry & frustrated anymore, & I simply don't play gigs in places that have ticked me off in the negotiating process like this.

I still end up playing between 10 & 20 solo gigs a year, now, but that gets reduced every year I don't have that strong "go-gettumness" that I used to.

I'd like to play more often, sure, but it just isn't yet worth the hassle I used to put with anymore. If I want a gig I can usually dig one up, though, & that's a pretty good feeling.

two words:

Booking agent.

They get you into bigger venues and better paid. The extra $$ they make for us easily pays for the extra cost of using one.

next to nothing or nothing? Hmm what? oh yeah.. here ..

exposure.. god I hate that word.

Oh yeah, I've heard that excuse not to pay as well. "You'll get great exposure playing our club." Expose me to some proper renumeration and I'll play at your club. Later...

Like "philbymon" I won't play for under $100. Being a B3 player most of my gigs are pick-ups when artists are playing a larger venue and want a bigger show than their 3 pc. that they are touring with. I get around 20 gigs a year.

What I am seeing is a tuffer market as far as pay goes. I play in a lot of casino's and small clubs (cabaret types) that have to have music and have a $20 door cover, they pay well but the bar's are paying peanuts and I don't usaully play them anymore.

Ron

For me, it has been communication with the liaison, whoever it may be - the agent, the booker, the club owner.

I find that they are often selective in which questions they choose to respond to, and often their responses require a translator (i.e. they might as well be speaking in grunts because their english, grammar, spelling and odd syntax makes their e-mails largely illegible.

One thing I have learned over the years in the venues I book, is club owners almost always hire the wrong people to book they're bands. It takes a lot of patience to deal with these people, don't be a nag, club owners and managers can get in a habbit of saying no to you if you nag them. What I do is find a large amount of clubs and call ahead to find out when the person that books is going to be there and I show up with a promo pack introduce myself and our band and talk with them breifly and ask them if they are currently booking if not its on to the next place, you would be surprised how many will call you back later if you hit about 10 places a day once every couple of weeks after a while you will develope a repore with many of these owners and you won't have to drive around anymore. I turn down more gigs than we play. We used to play 6 to 8 gigs a month but now we have decided we only want to play 3 gigs a month, and about once a week I get a call from a club wanting us to play. It has taken me years to get to this point, if they can't get you it makes them want you more, set min. price and never play for free unless it is a benefit because when you play for free or to cheap it just drags us all down, being a musician is tough you practice your ass off spend all your money on gear just to have some nit tell you no it can be dishartening. Be patient and I have always said that the bands that find a way to stay together for the long haul usually are the bands that succeed I have opened for Head East, Badfinger, what was left of them anyway, played the side stage at the Cythia Woods Pavillion and played the smallest Dives and enjoyed them just as much. being a successful musician takes time hell if it were easy everyone would be doing it, also all the pains, bad gigs, good gigs no gigs and everything else that goes with being a musician will shape you into a success

Mine is having to tell all those big breasted chicks that swoon over me that I'm married