General Music Chat

I can't tell the difference between Disturbed and Nickelback to save my life.

WHAT!!??

I do agree that a LOT of modern metal bands are all sounding alike.. That is just a good thing though for new bands like ours, who has a unique sound to themselves.

Metal is FAR from dead though..

Volume has nothing to do with it... I've seen bands from every genre play too loud.

"Naw he's not dead, he's just restin!"

I think modern metal bands mostly all sound alike because everyone straps on a ESP loaded with EMGs, and cranks up a rectifier.
Then they compress the hell out of whatever they record.
BoooOOooring...

Metal is dead as we knew it, but it isn't dead.
Genres make comebacks, but they never come back exactly the same.

I don't think metal is dead, it's always been around since the first Sabbath album in 1970. (snip)

Jimmy,
I am aware of your never ending devotion to Sabbath, but I would have to say that, in my opinion, the genesis of heavy metal was laid down in the good ol' 60's. Some of the progenitors could be said to include,

The Doors - Listen to Robby's howlin' guitars on "When the Music's Over".

Alice Cooper - I was heavily into them in 68! Did you ever hear Glen
Buxton Rip it up on "Fields of Regret" from the "Pretties For You" album?

Robin Trower was playing with a Fat tone as far back as 66, with Procol Harem.

Don't forget about Jimi, 68 or there about.

Last but not least, the mother of all heavy trios, BLUE freakin' CHEER!

NOW we're
Howlin'!

Those bands definitely laid the groundwork, and don't forget Steppenwolf coined the phrase "heavy metal thunder" although they were talking about motorcycles. But the music of Sabbath changed things; it officially ended the hippie era, as much as Nirvana ended the hair metal of the 80's. They were a turning point, a fulcrum that also included the death of Hendrix and Jim Morrison. Sabbath is the godfather of heavy metal, just as Iggy Pop is the godfather of punk. Both heavily influenced my music.

Metal doesnt die it just lies aroud waiting for a new generation to evolve it further. WHen Korn/Limp Bizkit took it and ran with it they lost me with all the detuned stuff. Dropped D is about all I do or care to do. Some of the things I hear now just sound like mud to me.

Im with Jimmy, I think it goes back to Sabbath, although I have to hand it to Blue Cheer also. BLue Cheer played a little club in Memphis recently and a friend went and saw them. He said they were one of the loudest bands he ever saw in a club. These guys have been doing this since the 60s and I think it was the original members. Thats hardcore to me.

Musicians evolve, I think most of us start out punks with a few barr chords and attitude. Then it evolves to metal and learning to play solos. As a musician matures they move into other areas that involve a lot less distortion in their sound. But I dont think it ever leaves you it just lies there dormant waiting to come out and play.

But metal will never go away as long as young men pick up guitars and plug into loud amps.

Seems that everyone has done their mourning for our beloved metal... but what would it take to re-vamp it? I wonder, half out of pure curiosity, and half as a musician trying to do just that. Metal has been a ghost through the years, appearing in the mainstream whenever a great metal band came around and was just too good to ignore, then slipping back into the ether when they broke up or just plain got too old. Dragonforce, as I mentioned earlier, is heading in the right direction, but in the wrong year. Their sound is too old-school for modern metal heads, who still, let's face it, miss the crunch of bands like Pantera. (RIP Dimebag) We need another evolution of metal, and metal has evolved much over the years, to find new listeners, but the best parts have stayed the same. I guess the question is, where is metal to go next? It is all on us musicians to figure that out. Thoughts?

I'm kind of thinking that the new direction will be a mix of metalcore, hardcore, old-school thrash, and new-school dissodant chording (derived from free jazz). Metal has always been what I call a perfect combination of several genres that can be either complicated, technical, or simple depending on the musician's abilities and attributes at the time of recording. Heck; people used to say that "Shred's Dead", but that was never the case. It just took a break for a while and then resurfaced when more and more people became interested in the guitar. Sure metal is always going to be a "musicians" genre as a result of poor music programs in schools today that only open kids up to what the teachers feel necessary, itself as it's own genre will move on and on and evolve along the way unlike many other genres that remain the same old stagnant things that they have always been and will always be...

I'm hoping that there will be a return to the concept of melody. Fitting thrashing leads into a song is fine, but there needs to be a melodic line that the human ear can decipher, & often the melodic intent of the player is lost in the frantic attack of virtuousity & "too many notes," not to mention the overly distorted sounds that ppl prefer these days.

If you can make the melody clear while you're shredding & stuff, great, but for me, speed isn't everything there is to good music, nor is it the heart of metal, imo.

This is what it would take for me to recognize it as a viable music form again: understandable melody; singing that's recognizable, unique & understandable; all while keeping that hard edge to the music.

There isn't much of that in stuff that I've heard, lately. (I'm not saying it doesn't exist - if you're familiar with stuff that does have these ingredients, feel free to tell me about it.)

philbymon: Check out Symphony X or Mystic Prophecy if you haven't already. They seem to fit exactly into your description of what metal should be and as it turns out, they happen to be two of my personal favorites as well. My material (which I'll be putting some on my page here soon) is somewhat similar in that respect also. Someone made a comment about ESP's and EMG's and I had to laugh because it's all too true; they are overly distorted and lack tone and alot of those players hide behind effects, noise gates, ect. Not these guys or myself though. I've been primarily playing my Caparison Applehorn Horus HGS straight through the amp with absolutely no effects or crybaby. Now that's a good tone as well as Michael Romeo's from Symphony X. You may even like Nevermore as they fit that mold too.

Metal doesnt die it just lies aroud waiting for a new generation to evolve it further.

But metal will never go away as long as young men pick up guitars and plug into loud amps.

I think that sums it up perfectly.

I gotta go with philby on this one. I,m glad you posted this on this thread Philby. I could not put my finger on it. My feelings about the "new" Metal sounds but you hit the nail right into the metalic coffin. And I dont believe its just because I am old. Many of my younger associates have made simular comment, just not as well put and simply structured as philbymons post. Although shredding is an awsome technical skill often sonic sensation is traded for sheer speed. Quality for quantity of notes.
Seek balence of the powers, ye warriors of metal.

OPOM
Original Pioneers of Metal
Ludwig van Beethoven
Niccolò Paganini

Beethoven's Grosse Fugue is overrated for being the seminal point of modern music. I really think he wrote it specifically to piss off the Archbishop.

I think there is great metal and there us also metal that sucks. I think of all the music styles that are currently boomingand the ones that are still booming for decades, metal will probably survive and stay "in" most easily. metal really has so many different substyles, and as fior everything, there is great pop and sh*t pop and great rock and sh*t rock, and I think metal just really serves an expressive need of billion youngsters, and older-sters. I really f**k needed metalw hen I was 13 tru untill later years I start re-appreciating pop especially.
Metal serves a need, like food and water, that is why I think it will never die.
radio-stuff, grammy winning stuff is still often based on metal.
metal is closest to classical music indeed, I have agreed with that for years.
the only reason I don't sing metal myself is because I was born with a pop voice and the songs I write just happen to be poppy. I can't scratch my voice, unless I drink shitloads of yogurt, haha!!!!
punk-rock pop-rock folk rock country rock and.....metal!!!! really a significant musical field...doesn;t just merge into iit all like everything else mostly does ( country rock country pop pop punk etc etc...metal is just metal!!!! when it is well done, at least.........

Where do you get that metal is close to classical music? Honest question.

it's out there. It's just obscure. By the way, what's that you're holding next to your face in your picture? Just curious...

A guitar teacher I had for awhile was really pushing the ol' Pagannini, & I just couldn't get into it...it sounds so terrible when you play it slow, & that's what we all start with, right? (Admittedly, it was really cool fast, but so is Steve Morse...when you break down some of his stuff to play it slow - ICK!)

Racer X was one he swore was really based in classical, Irm. I dunno. Never listened to the stuff cuz it's just too fast for my slow little head.

Most of the really fast guys I see are just wailing through traditional scales, & I think that's where they get the idea that it's so "classical" in form...in reality, though, the scales are simply a starting point from which to develop melody, as Irm knows, I'm sure, & many others here as well.

And thank you, Shred...I'll look them up soonly...got some work to do today. Hope it's right in there.