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#250293 by DainNobody
Wed Nov 18, 2015 3:45 pm
my selling experience at fee-bay tells me people will by the junkiest crap there is and always leaves me scratching my head wondering what they are going to do with that?.. so, without having to look at all the fine print associated with opening a selling account at amazon, could somebody kindly tell me, what portion of the 99 cents for selling a tune at amazon as a download does amazon keep?.. versus streaming a download which I know is minuscule.. somebody earlier had said a hit song made $5,000.00 or thereabouts? that does not seem like much money and not worth the effort and fees associated..for a hit song anyway
#250300 by GuitarMikeB
Wed Nov 18, 2015 9:32 pm
How are you getting the downloads on Amazon - through Tunecore? If so, then check with them on payoff. With CDBaby, you get 90% of the money from their site, but I don't know what the cut is from outside marketplaces.
I just uploaded my new album to CDBaby last night, waiting for everything to get "approved".

Up until a year or so ago, Amazon, through their CreateSpace service, offered downloads in addition to 'print-to-order' CDs. They had a sliding scale, you could set your d/l price at one of 3 levels, and pay off was about 2/3 the sell price.

People buying crap on fleabay - or at garage sales, etc doesn't mean squat when it comes to selling music - different customer base.
#250301 by DainNobody
Wed Nov 18, 2015 9:44 pm
thanks Mike, but aren't the people that are really listening to and buying music using streaming services rather than downloading a song/tune? and doesn't that pay much less? something like 2 cents a song or something?..and how does a guy/gal keep those pirate sites from giving you music away for free.. makes me wonder how Led Zeppelin could keep their music off the internet for sale for many years.. maybe they had/have a great legal team helping ensure that, and I do remember Taylor Swift complaining recently about Spotify, as well as our own BandMixe's Ted bitchin' about it.. earlier today I was reading about Universal Music Group's CEO (Graing) (who had a Mercury Records executive murdered in the Paris terror attack) saying he was going to do more for artists under the Universal Music Group's banner
#250332 by GuitarMikeB
Thu Nov 19, 2015 2:06 pm
'Streaming' is not buying - but that's what's happening with a lot/most people these days - they are streamng their music and not actually buying anything.
Yeah, the payout per stream is small - less than 2/10 of a cent per stream. ($0.0016) So 300,000 stream-plays of your song will get you about $480.
There's nothing you can do about pirate sites that offer your music for free. Keep the completed tunes off Soundcloud (which seems to be a major target for these pirates). Send the sites 'cease and desist' messages when you find them.
Warner Brothers Records is a dog for hunting down songs they own - post a video on youtube using a Neil Young song and see how quickly you get an email about the music being taken down. LZ probably had a team doing the same thing.
As Ted has said, you're never going to make much money selling your songs online. If you play shows, selling CDs (or download cards) will get you more sales - but even then, only expect 1 in 20 people to be interested, and either you do the sales yourself at the end of the show (or during breaks) or you have to find a volunteer to be the merch person for you. So at the end of a 200-audience show, you sell 10 CDs @ $10 each - profit of $6 each, so $60 total. Hopefully you put more in your pocket playing the show, the $60 is *bonus* money.
Last edited by GuitarMikeB on Thu Nov 19, 2015 9:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
#250389 by GuitarMikeB
Fri Nov 20, 2015 1:38 pm
RUI Musik wrote:There's really only real reason to put your music online or make CDs. Promotion. You will not make any money unless you're a major act.


And if you just want to get your music 'out there'.
#250404 by t-Roy and The Smoking Section
Fri Nov 20, 2015 6:12 pm
RUI Musik wrote:There's really only real reason to put your music online or make CDs. Promotion. You will not make any money unless you're a major act.



Not true....unless you consider me a major act?

It is a good way to promote if you're a new band...and most major label bands wouldn't see a financial reward until their 3rd or 4th album, but the secret to being successful in sales for the music biz now is longevity and a back-catalogue. You have to produce a lot of music to get a reputation.

To survive today you have to think like a business man and act like an artist.

Any businessman will tell you that there is always the risk of an initial investment required to produce a product that people would consider buying. Since 1998, I've written/recorded/produced original content for 12 CDs and appear on more than a dozen compilations. Most of those I self-funded, sometimes with help from people who trust me to deliver. I've built a fan base of people who are anticipating the next CD & tour; because I've been consistent about producing new content over the last 15 years. Anyone can do it, but if it were easy everyone would be doing it already.

Sold more than 1k in CDs last Saturday night in Kansas City, and have been averaging more than $500 in merch sales per gig since my last release came in June. The "secret" is that I produce high-quality recordings of music that no one else is making. It's a small audience compared to someone like Taylor Swift, but I'm serving a niche that is under-served, and that audience is therefore going to buy anything that comes out. Learned that lesson about narrow-marketing from Jerry Abbot in my days as video producer for Pantera, when they went from mainstream rock to hard-core.

Every gig is an excuse to set up a store in the venue. You want to have as many products to sell as you can gather. On a driving tour I will also carry VR glasses, books, t-shirts, LPs, etc...but you can be creative and carry cups, jewelry, whatever. Just as in any business, offer something that people will buy and you'll accumulate loyal customers. If you can keep producing something for them to buy, you'll establish a profitable company.

If you're playing cover songs in a bar then you're competing against beer & whiskey. You will likely lose that battle, :lol: but if you can find a venue where people go JUST to listen to the music, you'll have an audience of people who will want a souvenir after they have enjoyed the artist.

Streaming is the modern version of radio airplay but easier to obtain. Consider it an advertisement that gets people talking about you. My only gripe against streaming is that I have to abide by a deal that Spotify made with the same major labels who have always ripped off artists. They want ALL of an album to be made free on demand, if I want ANY of the songs to be made available. The "on demand" part is what makes this different than radio of yesteryear.

So a couple of years ago, I decided to tour my new album(s) for a couple of months before I release them for streaming. That strategy has come to be known as "windowing" and many of the major labels are doing it now. That means for a couple of months when it first comes out the only way to hear it on demand is to own the music/disk.

I seem to average about $100 a month from Tunecore for two CDs I have with them. Not a single penny from CD Baby for another CD (which sells great at concerts and is in the 3rd pressing), and practically nothing from Symphonic so far on the newest one. That means Tunecore is the only one who actually gets results. They are also the most expensive but more than pays for itself, whereas I can't say the same for CDBaby or Symphonic.
#250413 by GuitarMikeB
Fri Nov 20, 2015 9:49 pm
Ted - I'm guessing Tunecare works for you (as compared to CDBaby) because of the international distribution/availability?
#250459 by t-Roy and The Smoking Section
Sat Nov 21, 2015 5:39 pm
GuitarMikeB wrote:Ted - I'm guessing Tunecare works for you (as compared to CDBaby) because of the international distribution/availability?



They seem to be selling more and keeping up with the streams better...everywhere.

I've had nothing but problems with CDBaby customer service. I talk to people who aren't listening. And to have ZERO sales on a CD (for a year) that "live" fans love so much it is in it's third pressing??? Not a penny in streaming revenue either...I'm hidden to the world on CDBaby.

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