General Music Chat

you are not making sense.. your logic does not compute will robinson

Well don't you think the solution is not to buy GM cereals? I don't care what the government or the companies make. I don't care how they get it for I know, as a Christian, that God has everything under control. If you study the word of God you will find that it is God who allows the greedy to prosper.

I am not wealthy and I don't buy food that is over priced. Since the Bible teaches that it is God who prospers both the evil and the righteous I have no problem with what anyone makes. It is NOT MY BUSINESS, it is Gods business. And it is also Gods business to melt out judgment. It is of no consequence to me whether the regime distributes money to those who do not deserve it either. That is a test of their moral makeup not mine. I only need to live within the means that God has given to me.

There are a few things wrong with this, I think. First of all, if God ever takes a direct hand to the direction and outcome of our lives, then there is no judgement, at the end of times, that we are culpable for. Think about it: remove our ability to judge what is the best course of action, and we are left being puppets on a string that play out a giant-man-child's story-line, where he then commits the final power-trip on a rail-roaded campaign of goods, but also completely unnecessary bads.

IMO, this vision of God is far worse than the alternate view, that we are doing this to ourselves. Just because God (should he exist) knows everything that happens to our entire universe, and how it ultimately ends up, that doesn't mean that he takes ANY active control over our taking it to that end. As I said in another post: that would violate our fundamental laws for the ultimate good. That ultimate good is supposed to be what God is trying to preserve.

You sound like a very intelligent young person A, but the big problem is that you are questioning and opening the door for someone else to insert their values for the ultimate good. I would prefer to challenge a hitler... And not question God.

By the way it would be nice if you posted some music. That makes it easier to attain some credibility here.

You sound like a very intelligent young person A, but the big problem is that you are questioning and opening the door for someone else to insert their values for the ultimate good. I would prefer to challenge a hitler... And not question God.

Sorry, I supposed my intention was to say that, since Free Will was the basis and very reason for any preaching/ultimate judgement at the end of times, it was ultimately what was revered as the 'ultimate good', next to existence.

Still, this isn't about "challenging God". Free Will is not in place to 'challenge' anything. It is simply there so that we can all be agents of intentionality.

To say that God makes someone successful or impoverished is to say that God causes unemployment and disease. Where in reality, the cause is more than likely the fact that those people choose to be lazy and choose to keep poor hygiene. Of course, it could also be that a group of other people have chosen to step on those at the bottom of the ladder.

By the way it would be nice if you posted some music. That makes it easier to attain some credibility here.

I definitely shall! It's just difficult to find a location and the time to get a recording done. Still, my ability to play music shouldn't really impact whether or not my opinions are logically based, should it?

AelLayne,

No predestination or control going on here..... move along .....

Exo 9:12 But the LORD hardened the heart of Pharaoh, and he did not listen to them, as the LORD had spoken to Moses.
Rom 9:17 For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, "For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you, and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth."

No predestination or control going on here..... move along .....

Rom 8:28 And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose. For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.

Eph 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places, even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love he predestined us for adoption through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will, to the praise of his glorious grace, with which he has blessed us in the Beloved.

Jdg 13:4 Therefore be careful and drink no wine or strong drink, and eat nothing unclean, for behold, you shall conceive and bear a son. No razor shall come upon his head, for the child shall be a Nazirite to God from the womb, and he shall begin to save Israel from the hand of the Philistines."

No predestination here ....... move along........

Psa 22:10 On you was I cast from my birth, and from my mother's womb you have been my God.

Isa 44:1 "But now hear, O Jacob my servant, Israel whom I have chosen! Thus says the LORD who made you, who formed you from the womb and will help you: Fear not, O Jacob my servant, Jeshurun whom I have chosen.

Isa 49:1 Listen to me, O coastlands, and give attention, you peoples from afar. The LORD called me from the womb, from the body of my mother he named my name. He made my mouth like a sharp sword; in the shadow of his hand he hid me; he made me a polished arrow; in his quiver he hid me away. And he said to me, "You are my servant, Israel, in whom I will be glorified."


Pro 16:1 We humans make plans, but the LORD has the final word.

Pro 16:9 We make our own plans, but the LORD decides where we will go.

No Godly intervention in the lives of men here.... Anyone wonder how this potus got elected?

1Ki 22:19 And Micaiah said, "Therefore hear the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing beside him on his right hand and on his left; and the LORD said, 'Who will entice Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramoth-gilead?' And one said one thing, and another said another. Then a spirit came forward and stood before the LORD, saying, 'I will entice him.' And the LORD said to him, 'By what means?' And he said, 'I will go out, and will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.' And he said, 'You are to entice him, and you shall succeed; go out and do so.'


I understand free will and predestination and they do not conflict.
However, God does direct the steps of man. He keeps the feet of the Godly on the path. There are so many passages where men plan to do something and God redirects them. There are also passages where it is obvious that some were created for noble purposes and some for ignoble purposes.

so if a person claiming to be a U.S. citizen and he's white, but has lost his DOCUMENTATION proving he is a citizen is he illegal then? this hypothetical dude was born in Ohio in 1949 but has lost his birth certificate and does not have any utility billing statements lying around.. I get the feeling if he's white rather than brown, HALEY and GLENNY will call him a citizen cause of his color.. this is exactly why many Mexicans can't prove they are legal because they are UNDOCUMENTED but not necessarily illegal..

Eph 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places, even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love he predestined us for adoption through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will, to the praise of his glorious grace, with which he has blessed us in the Beloved.

I understand free will and predestination and they do not conflict.
However, God does direct the steps of man. He keeps the feet of the Godly on the path. There are so many passages where men plan to do something and God redirects them. There are also passages where it is obvious that some were created for noble purposes and some for ignoble purposes.

I'm not sure if you realize this, but you chose a verse with the very word "predestined" and followed those verses with "No predestination going on here".
Outside of that, there is no conflict between Free Will and Providence. There is EVERY conflict between Free Will and predestination/determination. The very nature of predestination implies an incompatibility with Free Will. The only thing above that you managed to show, by the quantity of verses you've made available, is that God ordered/beseech-ed/requested/or otherwise asked those servants to comply the way he wished. It was up to them to choose to follow that advice. They may have been told a certain outcome would come from it, but that doesn't mean they HAD to choose that path. That is the beauty of Free Will. If you deny that nature of Free Will, then there is no culpability for any evil we might choose to enact.

Regardless, the only reason why I am entertaining the idea of argumentation through the bible is because denial of that book as 'fact' would render all of its contents moot, to logic.

@Dane; There is no difference between being "undocumented" and illegal. Even if they were legal, simply having lost their documentation on hand, they would still be on file. A simply computer check could tell people who to incarcerate until things are cleared up, and who is probably just irresponsible.

If they are undocumented, they ARE illegal. That is because there is no documentation present/available to authorities, to verify the legality of their citizenship. It's absolutely NOTHING like leaving your driver's license at home, which you will still be fined for driving without. [/i]

You sound like a very intelligent young person A, but the big problem is that you are questioning and opening the door for someone else to insert their values for the ultimate good. I would prefer to challenge a hitler... And not question God.

Sorry, I supposed my intention was to say that, since Free Will was the basis and very reason for any preaching/ultimate judgement at the end of times, it was ultimately what was revered as the 'ultimate good', next to existence.

Still, this isn't about "challenging God". Free Will is not in place to 'challenge' anything. It is simply there so that we can all be agents of intentionality.

To say that God makes someone successful or impoverished is to say that God causes unemployment and disease. Where in reality, the cause is more than likely the fact that those people choose to be lazy and choose to keep poor hygiene. Of course, it could also be that a group of other people have chosen to step on those at the bottom of the ladder.

By the way it would be nice if you posted some music. That makes it easier to attain some credibility here.

I definitely shall! It's just difficult to find a location and the time to get a recording done. Still, my ability to play music shouldn't really impact whether or not my opinions are logically based, should it?

How refreshing... A young mind not descending into personal mud slinging but instead offering a tangible thought process. I like the line about another group of people choosing to step on others. Imposition of free will that usurps the not only the individuals rights, but the established law of the land that is meant to protect the rights of the individual... Even against a government that is advocating tyranny and anarchy.

As far as your music... There are some incredibly talented musicians, songwriters, and general talent that is off the board. I may not say it all the time, but some of the talent shared by many is AMAZING!!! We have so many unsung heroes here that at least 1/2 should be wealthy from their talents. I appreciate every one that goes out of their way to share.

so if a person claiming to be a U.S. citizen and he's white, but has lost his DOCUMENTATION proving he is a citizen is he illegal then? this hypothetical dude was born in Ohio in 1949 but has lost his birth certificate and does not have any utility billing statements lying around.. I get the feeling if he's white rather than brown, HALEY and GLENNY will call him a citizen cause of his color.. this is exactly why many Mexicans can't prove they are legal because they are UNDOCUMENTED but not necessarily illegal..

PALEEZE Dane? Really? Need I remind you I have family of Hispanic decent?
The color of ones skin has NOTHING TO DO WITH IT, NOTHING! You liberals throw out assumptions YOU KNOW are off. You do that to throw folks off topic in a FUTILE attempt to further your communist agenda! For the sake of YOUR ARGUMENT lets say YOUR white guy lost his birth certificate, I.D. and all identifying documentation. Last time I checked these United States WERE a country of laws. Reasonable law abiding folks make an attempt to get new copies of these documents. The law of the land is you must carry an I.D. on you at all times when in public. If YOUR white guy doesn't have his I.D. then he is breaking the law and subject to the penalties and punishment of such. The problem most REASONABLE folks have with illegal aliens is that they break the laws to get into this country, they break the law the ENTIRE TIME THEY ARE HERE SIMPLY BY BEING HERE ILLEGALLY! My step mom Consuelo would turn in her grave knowing that this government of these United States were letting a bunch of chickensh!t line cutters, cut in front of law abiding decent immigrants that come here and become LEGAL U.S. citizens and contribute to this great society like SHE DID!

you know, while I am toiling today trying to make a living, I will when taking my 3 ea. 15 minute coffee breaks do some investigation about the elusive illegal immigrant, and mostly I will be seeing what the numbers of these supposed illegals are based on Republican sponsored politicians.. yes, I will see what Boehner , Paul Ryan, and Ted Cruz say as to what the numbers of these illegals are and if there are discrepancies about the "count" amongst you honest Republicans you will be the first to know about these guys probably can't even give a true figure.. since I believe this illegal alien crap is way overblown.. they either have a work permit like Justin Bieber, or they have lost their paperwork, I had my DD215 (military document) stolen in a burgulary when I lived in Orlando, so I know paperwork can come up missing..

you know, while I am toiling today trying to make a living, I will when taking my 3 ea. 15 minute coffee breaks do some investigation about the elusive illegal immigrant, and mostly I will be seeing what the numbers of these supposed illegals are based on Republican sponsored politicians.. yes, I will see what Boehner , Paul Ryan, and Ted Cruz say as to what the numbers of these illegals are and if there are discrepancies about the "count" amongst you honest Republicans you will be the first to know about these guys probably can't even give a true figure.. since I believe this illegal alien crap is way overblown.. they either have a work permit like Justin Bieber, or they have lost their paperwork, I had my DD215 (military document) stolen in a burgulary when I lived in Orlando, so I know paperwork can come up missing..

You are funny Dane. What you folks around the country don't get is down here close to the border we are on the front lines of this invasion. I know them how they enter the country and have seen it FIRST HAND! I know it to be a fact while you Dane are speculating.

Dane is full of swarmy replies he has no real idea about.

ssdd

you know, while I am toiling today trying to make a living, I will when taking my 3 ea. 15 minute coffee breaks do some investigation about the elusive illegal immigrant, and mostly I will be seeing what the numbers of these supposed illegals are based on Republican sponsored politicians.. yes, I will see what Boehner , Paul Ryan, and Ted Cruz say as to what the numbers of these illegals are and if there are discrepancies about the "count" amongst you honest Republicans you will be the first to know about these guys probably can't even give a true figure.. since I believe this illegal alien crap is way overblown.. they either have a work permit like Justin Bieber, or they have lost their paperwork, I had my DD215 (military document) stolen in a burgulary when I lived in Orlando, so I know paperwork can come up missing..

You are funny Dane. What you folks around the country don't get is down here close to the border we are on the front lines of this invasion. I know them how they enter the country and have seen it FIRST HAND! I know it to be a fact while you Dane are speculating.

I thought you lived in Houston? that's quite aways from the borderline, so I don't believe that you have seen one actually crawl under the fence..

I work construction Mark. Houston is the place MILLIONS flock to for work. When you are doing the hiring and they show up by the THOUSANDS to apply and you see the use of every fake document imaginable you can calculate it from there. This ain't rocket science BOYS!

so if a person claiming to be a U.S. citizen and he's white, but has lost his DOCUMENTATION proving he is a citizen is he illegal then? this hypothetical dude was born in Ohio in 1949 but has lost his birth certificate and does not have any utility billing statements lying around.. I get the feeling if he's white rather than brown, HALEY and GLENNY will call him a citizen cause of his color.. this is exactly why many Mexicans can't prove they are legal because they are UNDOCUMENTED but not necessarily illegal..

Yes dane they are illegal because they are undocumented. WHY? because they are ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS, THAT HAVE BROKEN THE LAWS OF THE LAND. Why are they illegal immigrants? Because they are undocumented.

The worst part of this is having a government that is pushing to circumvent all the immigration laws and slap the average American with another tax bill or increase in the national debt. Did you even bother to read what Mr Haley just wrote... OR did you just jump to some universal conclusion that we are racists.