General Music Chat

Very cool. Check this one out, the California Guitar Trio doing "Bohemian Rhapsody".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNNcMDZn2Qk

I never liked the song "Bohemian Rhapsody," however, they did a good job at it.

By the way, how do the strings on acoustics work? I have I think some kind of nickel or brass strings on my acoustic. But some people use steel and other types I believe.

What is the difference?

Guitaranatomy,

Check out Cruz's version solo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZ9jrBg4 ... re=related

Jimmy the Ca Trio is great but this guy does it all by himself. Its hard for me to imagine how many hours it would take to get this song down.

Cruz blows me away more than any guitarist Ive seen in a long time. He has a killer version of Dream On.

I have another question, you guys have been playing a long time, when you go to play Jimi Hendrix's or Stevie Ray Vaughan's stuff is it hard for you? As a beginner of course for me it is very hard, I can work my way through it, but it takes time. I consider myself an intermediate guitar player, to an extent.

Thus, I figured since most of you have been playing 20+ years the complexity must appear different to you.

Peace out, GuitarAnatomy.

GA,

Yes it's hard. In fact I can't play some of that stuff. Don't forget we all have our own styles and they do not lend themselves to certain other players styles. At least that is how it is for me.

I was working on the solo for SATO by Ozzy/Randy Rhodes last night and I couldn't believe how much trouble I was having with it. Randy played really weird compared to how I play, so it is quite difficutlt for me.

One of my weaknesses is that I have never been good at learning other peoples stuff. In 30 years I don't think I know one cover tune the whole way through. My attitude has always been why learn some one elses stuff when I can write my own. This does have it's pros and cons since I would probably be a better player. The other the side of the coin is that by learning others stuff I think it detracts from your own style.

GA,

I'll chime in here also. Ive played in all sorts of situations thru the years, but I have always played a lot of covers. WHY you ask? I love original music as much as the next guy but I have found that I rarely get paid playing originals so I have kept up my covers. Lately Ive been prepping for a New Years Eve gig and going over a lot of old music. I consider myself a hack guitarist, which means I can emulate the styles of different players. On cover songs I try to get the basic changes of the songs down and rythym nuances. But when it comes to solos I do my own thing. I will cop the style of the guitarist. Jimmy Page is all sloppy sounding to me, I can sound like that. Billy Gibbons plays slide and pinch harmonics and I can play like that. Van Halen does the classical thing with tapping and pull offs, I can do that. When I get to a solo section of a song I just take off, most of the songs I can remember the general stucture of the solos and I guess I use that as a framework for what Im doing. I have 3 or 4 basic solos in my bag of tricks that sound good and I just change the keys to suit the song if I cant remember what the original song did. I guess theu the years I have developed my own style of playing by doing this. In covers I realize that I have to nail the basic rythyms of the songs but when it comes solo time I do my own thing and it may be different everytime I play a song.

SRV songs are all about intensity and really digging into the guitar when you play. Realize what equipment he uses, strat fender twin sound with a tube screamer. On my Mesa and Les Paul I go to a clean channel, front pickup and tube screamer to get his sound. Have I ever learned his songs note for note, No but I can fake it well enough for anyone but the other musician out there listening. Im at a point I can play most of the sounds I hear in my head and I would suggest to you to head in that direction. I would encourage playing acoustically on an electric, if you can make it sound good there it will sound good on an amp.

Wegman,

One of the songs that the group Im playin with wants to do is Crazy Train, so I cheated and went online and got the tabs for the solo. Ive played this song a thousand times and never knew the solo. The funny thing is the solo Rhoads does is actually easier to play than what Ive always done on this song. Rhoads was one of the masters of his genre, I would love to hear what he would be doing today if he was still with us.

Wegman,
I would love to hear what he would be doing today if he was still with us.

Isn't that the truth.

He played really weird. At least for me. His phrasing is very strange. He would run a scale and then throw in a weird note in a strange place. I have trouble with doing the fingerings. I have to unlearn what I have learned to play Rhodes stuff.

Dimeola is much easier for me or Petrucci then Rhodes. Even Van Halen doesn't give me as much trouble.

Forget anything blues for me. One I can't stand the genre, so I play it very little. I also can't stand the sound. I know SRV was awesome but after about 30 seconds I have to turn it off. Can't handle it. Jimmy Page for the most part to me was slop city with some very bright moments. Over all I think for guitar playing he is over rated. For song writing and mood setting I believe he is one of the very best. Hendrix was great, but again most of it I can't take for more then a minute or so. One guy I do like and he is bluesy is David Gilmore of Pink Floyd. I think he is totally under rated and he even puts himself down but I think he is awesome. Alot of guys could learn from him. There is so much feeling and emotion in his playing. I have tried unsuccessfully to have the emotion and feeling of David Gilmore mixed with the speed and technical flair of Dimeola, Petrucci, VH etc. in my playing.

Like I said I come up way short but that is the plan anyway.

Well, what made me ask is that I am learning this new song. The new song is by A Perfect Circle, which if you are familiar with the band Tool you may have heard of. I am watching this guitarist play this song I am learning live, he has a great flow on that guitar neck, so I figure if he can do that I can try and do that. So I go to learn the song, especially since I like it. The beginning was odd for me because I am not use to it so it is a totally new pattern, which got me thinking about complexity in music and ability to play it.

I just learned the rhythm structure to a version of Little Wing that Kirk Hammett once did, it is not easy. It took me a while to do that and I still play it sloppy when trying to hold its rhythm. I have also taken a look at SRV's version, almost more complex. Hendrix's stuff takes me a while to learn any portion of, however, I tend to have it easier on the classical stuff than on his. I think what fries my brains on Hendrix and SRV are those arpeggiated barre chords, interchanged with hammer ons and pull offs.

I can solo over a piece of music that is bluesy, I can do that much. I have a good ear and for some reason I can just follow my fingers and get a good sound.

jw123,

I am learning to play what I hear in my head and I am not bad at it. I usually can do so fairly easily. I can also ear tab pieces by just thinking of the songs sound in my head, especially if it is an easy song. When it is too hard it becomes tricky. I tend to write off my head because I rather write my solos that way than sitting there examining the music theory of them bit for bit. I have to get a music theory book, then I will be better when it comes to that stuff. Right now I am not heavily concerned about it because it does not cramp me from playing the instrument.

I like covers as well, that is because I am not looking to go anywhere major with this whole thing. I rather do covers, which the audience prefers, than do the originals all the time since I am not looking for anything. However, if I was looking for something, I would do originals, at least some inside of a set of songs. When I cover a song I find it fun to change things around, especially if I do not feel like learning the real way a portion is played, mainly a solo that is.

Wegman, it is fascinating to hear you find it tricky, because I know you play some complex stuff. I guess you are right though, we all have our own styles and playing others styles is not always easy. I can play a portion of "Crazy Train," I was working on the solo to it the other night. It is not a hard solo, but the tabs suck and are wrong. Jimmy Page on the other hand, I like his sound although he is sloppy. But that sloppiness fits the music, which is the funny part. I listened to Al Di Meola the other day, he has a fascinating sound about him. In fact, I stole a small slither of one of his songs from him, lol. I was listening to the Egyptian Danza since I like the Middle Eastern sounds, and I pulled up the tablature and saw a piece I liked and snagged it. I sometimes, but rarely, do that, just grab a piece of a song I like and use it as a scale pattern to use in my solos. He is a complex guitarist and is rather fast at times.

On the other hand, Petrucci is too fast for my hands. I cannot keep up with him I do not think, plus he plays a lot of songs on 7 string guitars in deep tunings, I cannot copy them because of this. I will give you a fast guitarist who can blow fingers off, Michael Angelo Batio. I like his sound more than Malmsteen (Who is talented, but I hate his sound). Another fast shredder is Herman Li from Dragon Force, however, Dragon Force sucks as a band. Herman Li is rated very high, I saw him perform live on Youtube, he was horrible live, sloppy as sh*t. He is overated, but he can play rather quick for that matter.

So yeah, I am learning the most complex stuff I can at the moment. It always helps if I can get harder pieces down because it makes many around it look easy. Well, that is all I have to say, thanks for replying guys.

Peace out, GuitarAnatomy.

Well I find it flattering that you think my stuff is complex. To me it is academic.

I have a the Randy Rhodes music book with transcriptions done by Wolf Marshall who is one of the best in the business so they are accurate. Some of Randy's solos are not difficult. SATO is, for me anyway.

I can not say enough about Al Dimoela. He has so many sides to his playing and it is always technically perfect. Yes he makes mistakes from time to time and like the awesome performer he is you see him get a little smirk on his face like yea I messed up. That is why you are seeing me live, that's part of it. What I like about Dimeola is how he can play those super fast long scales up and down the length of the neck. Then he can do all kinds of dynamics and all on an acoustic guitar. He is the one player who I can say really influenced my playing years ago.

John Petrucci is just scary. Dimeloa IMO is better but Petrucci is an animal. What I like about Petrucci is he plays those super fast scales, all picked and they are crystal clear and clean. His knoweledge of theory is also beyond reproach. He is not as good on an acoustic though as Dimeola and thus why I say Dimeola is better. But, Petrucci does stuff on an electric that is simply amazing and studying both can't help but yield a great player.

IMO every guitar player should really immerse themselves in Dimeola and Petrucci's work if they really want to become excellent players. Yes there are a ton of great players out there but these two guys IMO encompass everything of what well rounded guitar player should be.

To me everyone else is watered down version of these guys. That's my opinion and I am entitled to it.

Well I find it flattering that you think my stuff is complex. To me it is academic.

I have a the Randy Rhodes music book with transcriptions done by Wolf Marshall who is one of the best in the business so they are accurate. Some of Randy's solos are not difficult. SATO is, for me anyway.

I can not say enough about Al Dimoela. He has so many sides to his playing and it is always technically perfect. Yes he makes mistakes from time to time and like the awesome performer he is you see him get a little smirk on his face like yea I messed up. That is why you are seeing me live, that's part of it. What I like about Dimeola is how he can play those super fast long scales up and down the length of the neck. Then he can do all kinds of dynamics and all on an acoustic guitar. He is the one player who I can say really influenced my playing years ago.

John Petrucci is just scary. Dimeloa IMO is better but Petrucci is an animal. What I like about Petrucci is he plays those super fast scales, all picked and they are crystal clear and clean. His knoweledge of theory is also beyond reproach. He is not as good on an acoustic though as Dimeola and thus why I say Dimeola is better. But, Petrucci does stuff on an electric that is simply amazing and studying both can't help but yield a great player.

IMO every guitar player should really immerse themselves in Dimeola and Petrucci's work if they really want to become excellent players. Yes there are a ton of great players out there but these two guys IMO encompass everything of what well rounded guitar player should be.

To me everyone else is watered down version of these guys. That's my opinion and I am entitled to it.

Yes, you are entitled to your opinion, lol. Petrucci is great and so is Di Meola, idolizing them can really turn out a strong guitar player. As well as idolizing SRV and Hendrix. The more complex the music, the more the chances are a more proficient guitarist will come out of those influences. Playing fast on an acoustic is not easy, I can do it, but it can really hurt the hands.

My main influence has always been Kirk Hammett, but he is not a complex guitarist. His stuff cannot be played by a beginner easily, but an intermediate guitarist can fairly easily just pick it up and learn it. But he has a sound that I appreciate, that is why I copy him. Then again there are a lot of guitarists I like to stylize myself after, I have a ton of influences. My primary influences are Middle Eastern sounds. So, when Irminsul showed me Farid Al Atrache, I was very happy. That guy has some fascinating pieces that I like the sound of, in fact it has made me want to play the "oud."

Petrucci does know his music theory well it appears and so does Joe Satriani, and of course Yngwie Malmsteen. My music theory is very rusty, but once more, since it does not effect my playing ability right now, I do not base off of it. I will learn it soon, and learn it as well as I can, but I do not want to be a guitarist who thinks he is no good because he does not know about that stuff. I am fairly confident in my writing sound, I like it. I write in many tunings, and I get the sound I am looking for. I am learning how to multi-finger tap with two hands, and I am learning to use a slide properly, as well as learning to play a lot faster (This will take time though).

I do not consider my own writings technical, but maybe they would be to some guitarists. I will let others judge when I can get a good amplifier and microphone, and then record them.

Peace out, GuitarAnatomy.

*He digs this post up from its deep and shallow grave*

Okay, that was exhausting.


Now... I need help! Lol. I cannot figure something out, and since you guys are all great musicians maybe you can answer this question. Now I am going to make you all suffer and watch a video to answer this for me. I'm sorry, there is no other way for me to show it, lol. Okay, the link to Youtube below is to the song "Disposable Heroes" by Metallica:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=UKQjmc_9TQY

Watch Kirk Hammett at 0:33, he is playing those chords (I do not know the name) where it looks like this:

-------------------------
-------------------------
---------9---------------
---------x---------------
---------7---------------
-------------------------

Okay, so here is the true question. He has this very wide picking/strumming technique going on there with those chords, is it that he is accurately striking those three strings with that intensely wide picking/strumming technique, or is he striking all of the upper strings and just muting the low E with his thumb? Because when I go to strum like that, I cannot use such a wide strumming technique and avoid striking other strings accidentally.

I cannot figure it out worth of crap, lol.

Also, one more question, when people do that 8 finger tapping thing, where the guitar is practically played like a piano, how come it is to easy for them to get those notes to ring out by just using pressure with their right hand? Where as I go to do it and it is a dud note...

Well, thanks guys for taking a look at this for me. Very much appreciated.

Peace out, GuitarAnatomy.

Wegman,

That is a good solo. I have to say I wouldnt expect to hear you playing in that genre of music. Where are your principles man? Just kidding.

Thanks man.

I am more then just a one trick pony.

As far as the mix the guy I used to play with always had to be the star. I am lucky to be heard at all. LOL

The first take on that solo was much better and had far better tone. Of course he didn't record it.

I've been in situations where the other band mates were jealous over my approach / technique, taste or the audiences reaction to my my playing. I sympithize with ya.....been there too. Don't let their jealousies jade ya, you're a great guitarist

Guitaranatomy: I've been playing for 11 years and I've been through quite a bit with this whole guitar thing. My first influence was Kirk Hammett. I remember at one point thinking there was no better guitarist than Kirk. Kirk isn't a bad player by any means but that style quit appealing to me about 4 years after I was playing. I had started trying to pick up sweeping, advanced tapping methods, etc., etc. I know a lot of people say to start slow and it's very true but you know what? I never did anything slow. I have always been way too impatient to take the slow routine. Now, because of that, I can DEFINITELY tell that my playing is affected in certain ways and I have adapted to and compensated for those things. While I sometimes feel it attributes to uniqueness of style, it is also very limiting when I want to do certain things. For instance, I CANNOT do strict alternate picking to save my life. I can alternate pick between the inside of 2 adjacent strings just fine but to alternate pick between 2 adjacent strings on the outside is something I just cannot do. I've tried slowing down to work on it but I still lack that attention span. lol.

Anyway, I would say a great attribution to picking up the advanced techniques is to expose yourself to the guitarists who serve up the pinnacle of examples of them. For instance, if you want to learn sweeping, pay very close attention to guys like Shane Gibson, Rusty Cooley, Scott Mishoe, George Bellas, etc. All of those guys have instructional content and to be quite honest with you, dude... there's a certain point you come to where, you know... there's only so many options you have. None of them are easy and they're all going to take time, so you need to accept that there is no easy or quick road to this stuff. Yes, some people are more musically gifted than others but where you're sitting here looking for help, some other dude may be sitting there hashing away at Rusty Cooley exercise videos.

Check out this site: http://www.chopsfromhell.com/

Also, I've been a member of a musician community for about 8 years now on a site called Musician War. http://www.musicianwar.com/

It's 5 bucks a month but there is some of the best talent on the internet on that site; I'm talkin' about PRO guys. There's a live chat where we sit on there and jam back and forth with each other, a messageboard, and the main attraction to the site is the competition. You post a piece against someone else and people judge and vote on the pieces for about 3 days or so, a winner is determined, etc. That may be what you need.

You never know what may be the one thing that makes it all click for you but most of the advanced techniques I've worked on have just kinda... clicked one day. I remember I got SO frustrated when trying to learn how to sweep pick that I quit playing guitar COMPLETELY for a solid year. Then, I picked it back up and it was like an old friend and I was all of a sudden ready to begin the journey again. I've been going strong at it ever since. Far from perfection by any means, I still work very hard from time to time on my technique. I've become much more interested in intricate and catchy rhythms these days as opposed to the shredhead antics that have always appealed to me but that has all just been my personal progression.

There will come a time when all the advice you're reaching for will start to overlap; different people will start saying things you've already heard from others and at that point, you will know what your choices are. From there, it's making a choice and sticking with it if you feel you have to make a choice. Some people are able to look at all of this from a limitless perspective and I am envious of them. Shawn Lane, Ron Thal, Guthrie Govan, Jody Fisher, George Bellas, Mattias Eklundh... so many great guitarists who are truly the pinnacle of what they do.

So, yes. I'd say look into as many guitarists as you can. From all the names I've mentioned so far to Brett Garsed, TJ Helmrich, Charly Sahona, Anthony Mazzella, Bob Zabek, the list just goes on and on. Check out these guys. I've been REALLY into this type of stuff for the past year or so now:

http://www.myspace.com/tesseract
http://www.myspace.com/iambulb
http://www.myspace.com/periphery
http://www.myspace.com/textures

Anyway, expand your horizons, man. If you're simply not interested in most of the aforementioned, I completely understand. There are many things I like now that I absolutely despised back in my Metallica/Megadeth/Pantera/Corrosion of Conformity days, so I completely get it but the more you can try to appreciate and expose yourself to, the quicker I believe you will make your journey happen for you in many regards. Of course, I speak from personal experience alone, but... good luck! If you're interested, I have a few lessons on YouTube where I show how to play a few insane licks. =)

http://www.youtube.com/phrailguitarist

For more musical endeavors of mine, check out my profile here on bandmix and see what you think. Best of luck to you, man.

-Stephen

PhrailGuitarist/Stephen, thanks for all of that advice man. It is really helpful, I will check it out later, right now after this long day my head is splitting open, I have a serious headache, lol. I might be able to play guitar without the amp, but with I would die, *Shrug*

Yeah, sweep picking, it sucks at times. But I am getting pretty good at it, it only took me about 2 months to get the basics down, like 3-4 string sweeps. Then moving onto more complex sweeps has taken me longer. Lke this one for instance:


----------------------------------20--
----------------------------18--------
-----------------------15-------------
------------------19------------------
------------17------------------------
-------15-----------------------------

That one stumps me sometimes because of the weird placement of the fingers, but when I am really warmed up or in a low tuning (less string tension), I can nail it.

I can do 3-5 string sweeps pretty much, I am still perfecting the 5 string ones. The 6 string sweep above is one of a couple I try to do, they are hard. Sweeping is not the biggest thing for me, I would say speed training is.

Also, no worries, I am one of the worst alternative pickers ever. My friend I jam with was like "Man you need to alternative pick," because all I do is straight down picking. Actually, I can play very fast with just down strokes, which is confusing I think to some people, lol. I can do alternative picking a lot better now than about 2 weeks ago, I have been working on it a ton. I still get lost with it though, especially when skipping many strings at once.

Kirk Hammett is my favorite guitarist, but I know he is not as complex as many others. I bet you though, anything, he could destroy all of these guitarists that we think are good. I get the feeling with him that he hides his abilities, because once in a while you see strange things come out of his playing. Like recently he has begun using slap guitar techniques and back then he would use sweep picks. It is like he does not incorporate it into his style, but yet you know he is highly capable of doing it. I mean he has been playing 30 years man, lol. That should make him good in itself.

As for me, I am perfecting myself at all time. I write a lot of pretty arpeggiated pieces, lol. I like them a lot, very good at rhythm, I just need work on my soloing.

Guitar means a lot to me, I play it all the time, it keeps me calm. I am very impatient though, so you are not alone. I want to speed passed everything. I try to work my way through stuff as fast as possible, lol.

Actually, I get the feeling I am rather advanced compared to most people who have been playing 1 year and 10 months (Almost 11 now I think). So basically about 2 years, but for that little time in I have learned a lot.

Peace out, GuitarAnatomy.


EDIT: Hey man, I just got a chance to check out some of your stuff. You are extremely good, very smooth and clean sounding, as well as insanely fast. What is funny is your writing style on your cleaner stuff reminds me of mine a bit. I write a lot of clean stuff on guitar. My riffs that are heavy are different sounding though, when I get some new gear and audio equipment (someday in 4 years, lmao) I will upload them. I will post as I go along looking through the stuff you recommended, thanks again.