General Music Chat

Didn't put it up, but every song writes out different,
what's some of the different methods you songwriters
have used.

With this new song I decided I wanted to do it in the
Key of A, so for a change I studied the various steps,
of the scale in A, and seen that F#, G#, and C# are in
the scale so I tried to incorporate these notes (and chords)
into this tune. After studying the tonal relationships, I sat
down at the piano and started playing a A chord and tryed
to fit the # chords in, and throw some words against the
chords. Usually I always compose on guitar but have started
composing on piano in the last 2 years, what do you compose on?

So I get the A chord and pound around on the piano, and try to
find a song floating around. So I start with A, then progress to B,
then to E, then back to A, there's the verse. Now the chorus, step
out of the last A in the verse to the F#(not looking for a minor sound
so I don't use the F#m, just F#), then to the G#, then back to the E,
the music is almost wrote add some words and a melody to the chord
progression.

What % of your songs have a bridge? Songwriting seems so structured
what do you do to break out of the mold of the same old progressions,
and the same old themes.

If you are stuck in those patterns, it is because you choose to be.
Remember, you are starting with a blank slate and You choose
everything. To grow as a writer you must choose to go where you are
UNcomfortable and make it happen there. Listen closely to music and
hear the minutia within.[/b]

WHAT KIND OF SONG IS THAT ?

If you were using A major, B major and E major in your first progression, you were actually in the key of E there.
There's nothing wrong with using 'theory' and chord prgressions in keys, but they can limit you - however, the way the ear is trained on hearing these makes a differenc and when playing in a key, one chord will lead you to the next one easily.

When I'm writing, 99.9% of the time I already have lyrics written, so I'll pick up a guitar and start noodling with different progressions and sounds, sometimes capo-ing, which can give a different sound to a regular chord progression played on open strings.
IF I find myself getting into a song writing rut, I'll switch to the keyboard, or do a drop-D tuning, or just pickup anotehr guitar.

Some songs have bridges, some don't, they work to break up a multiple-repeating pattern (like verse-chorus-verse-chorus-verse-chorus). Don't have a bridge? Throw a lead in!

This is where everyone goes he crazy


Well I have a fictional character Of myself In my head that carries a sword and moves pretty fast on his feet he randomly gets in a lot of battles and sometimes he's ambushed and he may have to save a mo fo or 2 I'm really just writing the background music to his epic situations my style maybe the same but since every situation feels different my music expression will change throughout the song

I'm still a 10 year old ninja x men power rangers samurai I just let my adult self express it in my music

Xhadow, that is awesome! That is creativity at it's finest, and a great way to write. I personally work similarly to MikeB...usually having some kind of lyrical context.

Lynard, push yourself to do something different in order to break out of the mold. Try different tunings, capo placements, tones and especially progressions.

Also, that's the same issue I've always had with theory-in regards to being a creative hindrance. I've learned more about it over the years, and I am glad that I have, but too often the knowledge is dangerous...Meaning that, instead of playing what you "hear", musicians using theory tend to play what is "correct".

"This song has the chords G and C, so I have to follow them with D."

Now, instead of creating, the songwriter is basically just following someone else's directions.

I don't know if any of that makes sense...

As far as bridges go, it really depends on the song for me. %-wise, I would say probably 30% of my songs have bridges. Then again, some songs only have two parts while others have MANY. I have one progressive song (unrecorded) that has (at last count) 28 different sections...

I have one progressive song (unrecorded) that has (at last count) 28 different sections...

That's 1 verse, 1 chorus and 26 bridges!

Here's the latest song I have completed.

My styles keep flip-flopping, this is a mellow-schlocky pop song, so if you're a hard rocker, don't bother!

http://youtu.be/ze2SeZ3lmfo

Lynard, I think writing on a piano, or at least mapping out a song on the piano is a great way to go.
I wish I could do it without fumbling around for hours.

Interesting responses.

Mike if were in the Key of A, B is the 2nd(subtonic), and
E is the %th (the dominant)

Well I played around with this song and added a outro,
of A, B, D.

This song started out in the Key of A, on piano, then
the lyrics emerged, and I felt they were more important
in the song than the musical structure. Whenever I add
guitar to a piano composed song it seems the results are
always fantastic(to Me).

The song now is called "See the Stars Stare", a love song,
something I'm not the best at, but it's been fun.

I agree K-Mo, it just seems like 95% of the songs follow
a set structure, the patterns of past music. It's tough to
be creative, I'll keep trying.

Mike Hamilton, this is a song that is growing everyday, one day
hoping to get out and be sung and performed.

GuitarMike, I find you starting with the lyrics strange to me,
even tho I've done it on rare occassions, seems anything I
write will be rewritten many, many times, alot of times both
lyrically and musically. Just looking to do something different,
then verse, choruse verse, chorus, bridge, or lead break, verse,
chorus, I don't know what just thinking out loud.

gtzip, I'll say that learning to play piano has
helped my guitar playing immeasurably.
I've been playing piano about 2 years, and
it really helps to bring all the music theory
into perspective. I mean come on there's
only 7 notes, and they're laid out in order on
the piano, learn the locations of the notes on
the keyboard and the rest is target practice.

And after 2 weeks working on it, I'm going to
sh#tcan it into the cull pile. It had a really good
chorus, maybe I can use it somewhere else.
I got a lot of parts out of that song but not a
composition I'm satisfied with.

Start today recording a new song, going to start
composing on guitar 1st, got a riff I'd like to make
work. Might even record an old song I've written,on paper.

I don't consider them wrote anymore till I've got the
music, lyrics, guitar parts, drum parts, bass parts, and
piano parts at least crudely laid down in 1s and 0s.

Lynard, I think writing on a piano, or at least mapping out a song on the piano is a great way to go.
I wish I could do it without fumbling around for hours.

You either fumble around on a piano until you get the keys portion complete or you completely forget the keys and use the guitar line like a rythmn figure and write the tune using the guitar line as the melodic base of the tune.

(The piano method is easy, the other method makes you write the tune and have it ready by the time you are ready to record. Either method works well but the inclusion of the piano opens more creative doors than not.)


The thing I like the best about the piano is that more often than not, I'll know how the piece sounds but I won't know the structure of it. The piano dictates that when it's piece is playable, the melodic structure is more or less finished with exception(s).

I.E. If you are struggling with a break and the piano part is done, you already know what the basic root/progression is etc.

I may be struggling with a part that is A-Fm-D-E7. I may have been playing it but didn't know it.

With the inclusion of the piano, I get the simple version of it. I might then know it's A-Fm-D-E7 and all I have to do is work with the variation(s) to get the correct line.

Instead of A-Fm-D-E7, I may need A-Fm-D-Open E7 instead of the barre chord version, point is that it gets easier to decipher what real mathematical/musical relationship is going on for you to be able to manipulate.

Lynard, what I do sometimes is make "ghost chords", I dont know the musical langauge to describe it other than I may play one or two or three notes of a chord, instead of playing a full chord.

Look at the chords you are using and sometimes you can use a piece of a transition chord, without the root within the other chords you are playing, and use the bass to signal the root of the chord you are using.

I hope that makes sense

Makes sense Jw "ghost chords" if you don't play
3 notes, a triad, you aren't playing a chord, your
implying a chord. Jw when I transition I almost
always look for pieces of the scale close.

Mr Scott I'm aguitar player who has been playing
piano for about 2 years now. Learning piano is the
best thing I've done to improve my overall musicianship.