General Music Chat

To me whatever you passion is original or covers should be respected by fellow musicians.

Theres no right or wrong answer, as TN says follow your passion!

Bingo

I'm just wondering why I'm reading yet another originals vs cover post.

OH yeah ... I was eating some noodles praying UPS would somehow mysteriously show up with my new gear before the band gets here tonight so we can rehearse our originals and covers

looks like we covered both sides of the coin thank guys..WILLNTHEWAY

If I am to be honest...I don't do covers normally, because frankly, I'm terrified of messing them up.. I'm not even sure I have the musical skill to do covers... But, There are some songs that are so compelling to me, that' I'll learn them anyway... (Only to discover I didn't quite get the chords right)... But I cant muster the passion for songs that don't seriously resonate with me. I have to say I truly respect and admire the cover artists... Its a skill and art all unto itself... My hats off to you guys who can do covers...

I must say that looking back through the years of music I would never have been able to do a origional without learning "some" cover tunes first.

I have always woundered if cavemen/women ever sang.

I?m all about doing original stuff. I think one of the things that encourages it is that I have a horrible voice. So whenever I feel the need for expression, it has to come off the keys. Chords left, vocals right.

I must say that looking back through the years of music I would never have been able to do a origional without learning "some" cover tunes first.

I have always woundered if cavemen/women ever sang.

Yep I agree... I forgot mention that... I do learn parts of lots of songs to see how they are constructed.... But when one says cover...I'm thinking in terms of Taking a list of well published songs and learning them A-Z and then performing them routinely

thoughts on the subject..WILLNTHEWAY

Learning covers is foreign and uncomfortable to me.
I guess I started off rather in reverse of how most musicians do.
Fortunately for me when JERICHO MARCH does covers we are not attempting to sound like an original act.
Our goal is to "own" the covers, if you will pardon the expression.

Question...Why are most musicians obsessed with recreating other peoples songs instead of creating thier own music..Why do cover bands never seem to make thier own sound? Would leonardo cover a michael angelo painting

Good thread by the way! I have experienced this question before. It was brought up at my first class in Musicianship 101 when I attended music school here in Chicago.

The approach to answering this question is to get into the essential definition of "What is an Artist" and "What is a Musician."

I think some people have varying definitions of what an Artist or musician is. IMO a musician has to have a good functioning grasp of Music Theory. Also, a musician should have a mastery of one instrument. A musician should have a capacity to work with other musicians in a professional level. This means the musician has no problem performing other peoples composition. A person who writes beautiful and popular music without having the above attributes per se, fits more into the definition of an artist. A musician can be an artist but an artist can't be a musician. A musician is skilled with the absolutes in music = Sightreading, Improvising, Composition, Pedagogy, Transposition, History and PERFORMANCE.

Excerpt from article by Chris Juergensen:

I'll start with the artist. The artist plays for himself for the most part. His objective as an artist is to please his own artistic hunger. He strives for artistic elegance. Don't get me wrong, this is not necessarily a bad thing for me and you. It's great. Artists make life for the rest of us better. Artists create art. I have Picasso hanging on my wall, not something a graphic designer drew that I found in a magazine. The problem with being an artist is it's rough to make ends meet. Artists are generally only brilliant at their own music or working with artists that fall into the same category as themselves. Artists constantly study art. That's the reason it's hard to make a living. The artist is always striving to create better art. He creates art with such high standards, the average Joe has a hard time understanding it. The artist is so involved in creating art that he often creates a gap between himself and the masses. I'm not saying all artists are broke but it's a gamble.


The musician is a different animal all together. The musician is a hired gun. Although he may have musical preferences, he isn't picky about what he plays to pay the rent. While the artist may be particular about what he has to play to get paid, the musician will play anything. He is well versed in all styles and can mimic various players. These types of players make good studio musicians, session players and teachers. They usually do all these things. Like the artist, the musician is always working on learning new skills. The only problem with the musician is that he tends to find himself artistically frustrated. Let's face it, deep down inside, we all really want to be the artist. We want our music to live on after we're gone. We want someone, after we die, to send one of our CDs off into deep space so some alien can find it in a million years and say, "Them earthlings wrote the most glorious music in the galaxy."


Which would you rather be; the artist or the musician? Remember the phrases; "the starving artist" and "the struggling musician." I personally would rather struggle as a musician while I commit myself to creating art. I think the best way to live a satisfying life as a guitarist is to dedicate your life to both of these ambitions. Most guitarists get themselves in trouble by focusing on only one of the two. Most of the money I have made in the business as a player came from playing other peoples tunes, not from my own CD sales. But to be honest, releasing my own CDs is way more rewarding (mentally, not financially). Doing both makes my career well balanced. One feeds the other.

Great points, J. I have to say that music has neve been about the money for me-if that was the case, I would have quit years ago. The cash I've generated from CD sales is probably pretty close to being equal to the money I've made playing covers (neither one being much...lol).
Particularly recently, I've had some difficulties in band situations concerning this issue. In one instance, I was working with a guitarist, who, like myself, was more interested in the creative end of music. However, when it came time to lay out our sets, we couldn't agree on anything... . the main issue there was that he wanted to play covers, viewing it as a "necessary evil"-in order to book gigs. I have my own theories on that, and suffice it to say that I understand I am probably in the minority in this. I don't believe covers are necessary to book. I think producing (and keeping the attention of) an audience is what is necessary. I firmly believe that a club owner doesn't give a rat's a$$ what you play, as long as it keeps his customers happy and in the mood to spend more money.
Anyway, common ground could not be reached and we split.
I'm fortunate enough, from an artistic perspective, that my particular style is intented to be audience-friendly for the most part (think circus with clowns and elephants rather than freak show with pierced bodies and bondage apparatuses). That being said, there is a still a massive wall to overcome-audiences are less willing to stay for a well crafted original than they are for a lame version of "Sweet Home Alabama". The "gap", as J referred to it, remains.
In my current project, we have 36 songs, of which there are 5 covers. The covers are specifically chosen not only for energy flow, but to maintain a connection with the audience. The point being that the choice to play covers is made for a distinct purpose, rather than just "playing what the audience wants" or "we have to play them to get gigs".

There was a point in all of that somewhere...

There was a point in all of that somewhere...

Your point was well received! lol

YES and YES! I would love to make my living through Originals! I congratulate you on your success because you have found that elusive goal of making a living by doing what you love most.

By the way, the last part of my original post was from a snippet from an article.

I actually make the most money with guitar lessons.

a music thread! I'll post a slightly different different perspective on why learning covers is better than not, if you are able.

emulation = learning
the fastest road to learning in my experience. Prior to learning covers, I spent all my practice time doing scales and patterns to a metrinome. snore. great for hand coordination, but lacking in getting the brain working. Then I tried writing songs, and would get lost in song structure. I know there's an intro, hook, verse, chorus, verse, bridge, some foolery and a solo in there somewhere, but man o'live... once you get into writing the song, it's a never ending battle completing it, because none of the parts ever feel "complete!".

ability to entertain at parties
Ever been to a party with other musicians? Or flying solo? With other musicians, if they say "hey, let's jam!.", you can do just that. If you don't know any covers, you end up saying "um, I don't know any covers, but I wrote one?" okay... so you spend an hour learning a song at the party so you can play it?...

covers are ready-made. Had I said "I know these 25 covers", chances are, instant fun! And all those people at the party will likely know them and be able to participate - sing along! dance, whatever.

Great guage of musical ability for yourself
when interviewing a potential band member, or even knowing what your own abilities and limitations are. When I started learning covers, I realized there are a ton of licks, riffs and chord progressions I wouldn't have likely never learned because I was under the impression that if I heard them on the radio, surely I must know them! But unless you try them, you're poorly mistaken when it comes time to implement them.

Covers are a good guage of potential band member ability
Interviewing a guitarist? A bass player? a drummer? They didn't really come prepared to learn your songs, but they assure they can learn and play the song! The person's there, you scheduled him/her - so you may as well give that person a chance on the off chance they're not pulling your leg. I know, they broke the golden rule "come to the audition prepared to play", but let's just say you met him on the street and he fed you a believable line and you're interested. You can test the musician out with

"Let's warm up with [insert a cover song every musician should know]".


Just a few reasons that came to mind when reading this thread.

Personally, my ability as a guitarist/singers has really grown by doing covers. I've learned what I can and can't play/sing in a live situation doing other's materials. It really helped me with self-introspection on where I'm at musically, and what it takes to learn someone else's original song from start to finish - all the nuances you don't think about until you're forced to play them included.


Chris

Chris

Your point is well made. There is however another side too it: on those rare magic moments you hook up with some guys who just hit it like you hit it and something special occurs.

There is always twelve bar blues / rock stuff. If they can't do something interesting with it, put down your axe and go get another drink. They aren't going to cut it with a cover, either.

JSantas

You have so nailed it. I write a lot of songs but since I started really studying music my goal is to become a musician. I want to get back to how my mentor challenged me years ago: "Are you instrumentalist, or are you a musician?"

Talbot

JSantas

You have so nailed it. I write a lot of songs but since I started really studying music my goal is to become a musician. I want to get back to how my mentor challenged me years ago: "Are you instrumentalist, or are you a musician?"

Talbot

Cool man! Good luck on that and never lose your artistic side. What I really mean, is don't lose your creative side. I had a phase when I concentrated too much on music theory and structure, that it started to stifle my creativity with rigid habits. lol took me a while to "unlearn."

The bottom line is there is a balance. Artist and Musician.