General Music Chat

List here the behaviors that piss you off the most and what action(s) do you take to rectify the situation?

1). Constantly late or misses rehearsals. Action- Replace member
2). Late or arrives at gigs right at start of first set. Action-Replace member
3). Unless they have a physical handicap, members MUST help haul and set up equipment. If not action- replace member
4) Dictating song selection thus not allowing another member's input. Action-Replace member or find a new band.
5) Not sharing gig pay equally unless agreed upon up front. Action- find a new band
6) Members who insist on doing cover tunes exactly like the record. Action-Tell them to take some ex-lax otherwise their sh*t will turn into a diamond.
7) Members who refuse to work on one of your original tunes when you always work on their original tunes. Action- Pack my sh*t and leave EVERY time it happens.
Members who nitpick about your playing. Action- Tell them the only opinions that counts are the audience. If the audience reacts positively to the song then the member should shut the fu*k up.
9) Drinking or playing high or buzzed, gigs or rehearsals. Action-I don't and I consider music a job. I don't put up with it but you might.
10) Member's whose significant other interferes with the band's business too often. Action-If their significant other doesn't stop interfering then that member leaves or YOU leave.
11) My policy on song selection, all members get to choose both covers and their own originals. Audience decides what songs to keep AWLaYs. No dictatorship unless agreed to up front.

This is all very subjective of course. Everybdy has different wants/needs. Only you can decide what you can or cannot tolerate. It's best not to hold something in if it's bothering you. Get it out on the table, in the open. If a situation continues to make you uncomfortable then you need to take one action or another. Music should be all good. For me life's too short to put up with B.S. I usually just move on....

Not learning material before practice (when we get together it is for fine tuning not to learn) not fixing their equipment there is nothing more that I hate than when a person keeps showing up with the same piece of equipment that is broke. A person with a better than everybody else attitude.

Bob, musically I enjoy playing at the level we are playing. Everyband has a DIVA personallity. I played in so many bands looking for the right fit in 2009 and 2010. After learning songs constantly for 2 years. I would find a band learn their 50 songs then folks REAL personality would start to show. Then I would put in a notice and start all over again. This started after Cruise Control (a band I ran) broke up. I just couldn't find the right bunch to play with. I started to look inward thinking I am just not excepting people's quirks. I found a good band but they made me wait 4 months before calling to give me the job. About 3 months in with Trial By Fire the lead singer put in notice. I am like, you guys made me wait 4 months and then the singer quits. During that 4 month wait I met these guy's and we jammed and it worked! I put in a notice with TBF and joined this band. After a while the diva started popping out of a certan member. He wants to start the gigs late and we play until 2:am most gigs. We are supposed to start at 9:30 and quit at 1:30. I know its only 30 minutes but I have over an hours drive to get home and the sound man, and drummer were complaining also while loading out last Sat. I mentioned it. I called the leader of the band last night to discuss new songs that we are learning and mentioned it again. His reply was "we will stop at that time if the club lets us". I told him what normal hrs. are and the hrs. that the places we play advertise. Basically he insinuated I hadn't been in bands good enough that they wanted us to keep playing! That was offensive to me. I like these guy's but am getting the impression they are a little arrogant! The DIVA has us wait until his wife gets to the gig to start and she is ALWAYS late! He also leaves the stage in the middle of a set to go pee. When the singer leaves the stage we break into Beer Drinkers and Hell Raisers the DIVA hates that song. I told him everytime he leaves the stage we are going to play that song LOL! He complains about the video's we post "saying we can do better" what he really means is when he drinks he gets a little off pitch I told him that maybe he should not drink as much that would solve the pitch problem and the urge to urinate! He replied I am not going to quit drinking! Hell if it was up to him we would never get any video posted. Also a while back we posted some video from a gig he called and said his wife saw herself and demanded we take it down!
I have come to the conclusion if I am going to play with PEOPLE I am going to HAVE to except their quirks. The way I see it is I am 53 and probably won't be doing this in 10 years and that time will go by fast. I want to play with good players. For now I am going to give this project another year. If nothing changes sadly I will have to move on!

It's been a long time since I had as much fun
as I did yesterday recording a song. I played
the bass, piano guitar, vocals, ran the drum
machine, and wrote the song. Today more overdubs
using the same musician, we get along so well,
and made a fine recording.

I'm cool with this band.

Bob, musically I enjoy playing at the level we are playing. Everyband has a DIVA personallity. I played in so many bands looking for the right fit in 2009 and 2010. After learning songs constantly for 2 years. I would find a band learn their 50 songs then folks REAL personality would start to show. Then I would put in a notice and start all over again. This started after Cruise Control (a band I ran) broke up. I just couldn't find the right bunch to play with. I started to look inward thinking I am just not excepting people's quirks. I found a good band but they made me wait 4 months before calling to give me the job. About 3 months in with Trial By Fire the lead singer put in notice. I am like, you guys made me wait 4 months and then the singer quits. During that 4 month wait I met these guy's and we jammed and it worked! I put in a notice with TBF and joined this band. After a while the diva started popping out of a certan member. He wants to start the gigs late and we play until 2:am most gigs. We are supposed to start at 9:30 and quit at 1:30. I know its only 30 minutes but I have over an hours drive to get home and the sound man, and drummer were complaining also while loading out last Sat. I mentioned it. I called the leader of the band last night to discuss new songs that we are learning and mentioned it again. His reply was "we will stop at that time if the club lets us". I told him what normal hrs. are and the hrs. that the places we play advertise. Basically he insinuated I hadn't been in bands good enough that they wanted us to keep playing! That was offensive to me. I like these guy's but am getting the impression they are a little arrogant! The DIVA has us wait until his wife gets to the gig to start and she is ALWAYS late! He also leaves the stage in the middle of a set to go pee. When the singer leaves the stage we break into Beer Drinkers and Hell Raisers the DIVA hates that song. I told him everytime he leaves the stage we are going to play that song LOL! He complains about the video's we post "saying we can do better" what he really means is when he drinks he gets a little off pitch I told him that maybe he should not drink as much that would solve the pitch problem and the urge to urinate! He replied I am not going to quit drinking! Hell if it was up to him we would never get any video posted. Also a while back we posted some video from a gig he called and said his wife saw herself and demanded we take it down!
I have come to the conclusion if I am going to play with PEOPLE I am going to HAVE to except their quirks. The way I see it is I am 53 and probably won't be doing this in 10 years and that time will go by fast. I want to play with good players. For now I am going to give this project another year. If nothing changes sadly I will have to move on!

This seems like classic LSD. Lead Singers Disease. lol.... To be a vocalist and get up and use your voice as an instrument takes a lot of confidence. Todd Owens, (My last lead singer), had said it is 80% mental, and he was a damn good lead singer, and showman. Drinking helps some people to loosen up, you know... the liquid courage effect. Obviously, too much will cause pitch problems, and loss of highs in anyone persons voice.

There was one thing that he always did though, he showed respect and humbleness when he needed too. He never let the fact he was the voice of the band go to his head. Although, he had a very high self esteem.

Ego can be a horrible thing. You can take it too far.


On the other hand, there are demands that a club may have, and if you didn't set up the gig personally, you don't really know what the stipulations are.

Todd set up a lot of our gigs too, and he ran the show with that venue, because he was the contact. He relay to us the rules of each performance, when we were playing, how much we were getting paid, and I did the same if I got the gig.

So if you have some restrictions to your availability, then you should make that apparent before hand to everyone in the project. That might help with awareness.

If it not something they are willing to work with, then perhaps they don't respect you enough, or value you as a musician.

A lot of people make this mistake with musicians that have a humble personality. It is easy to walk over them without even knowing it. I don't think they are at fault, or are being malicious, I am guessing they aren't aware of how valuable you really are.

As far as the videos, they tell the truth, and maybe he wants to polish up the set, and is most likely not impressed with his own performance.


I say the best thing to do is get everyone together SOBER, and talk this out.

I wish you the best of luck,

Damn!

I guess Im the lucky one here, in the Aint Yo Mama band everyone pulls thier weight, yea sometimes someone is a little late for setup, but at the end of the night everyone pitches in, we had a sound guy for a couple of years and it would take close to 2 hours to tear down, we started doing this ourselves and we get things torn down in 45 minutes.

Song selection issues, what the hell is that? We just dont have it. We work up a new song, and play it at gigs, if it fits we keep it, if someone doesnt like doing it we drop it, cause it doesnt really matter to any of us.

All of us drink, and a couple do other things, but its never interfered with our performances, if anything when I was in the heat of my divorce I overdid it a few times, and they came and talked to me about it, not to kick me out, but since we are so close they were concerned about my wellbeing. I only messed up a couple of gigs and really not that bad, but I did overdue the booze a time or two, damn yager and folks handing it to me, I learned not to do anything but drink beer, and since then no issues.

I did sit in with a few groups the last year or so, and I found that lots of them had internal drama, like Haley said I would learn thier 40-50 songs and then at gigs someone in the group would start moaning I dont want to play this song, I always felt like well why didnt you tell me before i learned the damn thing then.

Anyway, I feel very lucky at the point in life I am to paly with the guys I do, we go way back, we are friends, we see eye to eye on the songs. Sure our singer is a bit of a prima donna, but hey so am I. But it just works, I hate the day when one of us decides not to do it anymore, in fact one of our longtime fans has told me many times, I dont expect you guys to quit until one of you dies. Being that we are all around 50 that may be soooner than later, but Im going to keep on rockin and enjoying the ride for however long it last.

I don't like folks staring at their shoes when they need to be paying attention to the song.
Everyone can take a lesson from James Brown

Brown demanded extreme discipline, perfection and precision from his musicians and dancers ? right down to when performers in his Revue showed up for rehearsals all the way to whether members wore the right "uniform" or "costume" for concert performances.

You gotta be on time. You gotta have your uniform. Your stuff's got to be intact. You gotta have the bow tie. You got to have it. You can't come up without the bow tie. You cannot come up without a cummerbund ... [The] patent leather shoes we were wearing at the time gotta be greased. You just gotta have this stuff. This is what [Brown expected] ... [Brown] bought the costumes. He bought the shoes. And if for some reason [the band member decided] to leave the group, [Brown told the person to] please leave my uniforms ....
?Maceo Parker

Brown also had a practice of directing, correcting and assessing fines on members of his band who broke his rules, such as wearing unshined shoes, dancing out of sync or showing up late on stage.

During some of his concert performances, Brown danced in front of his band with his back to the audience as he slid across the floor, flashing hand signals and splaying his pulsating fingers to the beat of the music. Although audiences thought Brown's dance routine was part of his act, this practice was actually his way of pointing to the offending member of his troupe who played or sang the wrong note or committed some other infraction. Brown used his splayed fingers and hand signals to alert the offending person of the fine that person must pay to him for breaking his rules

And you thought it was part of the act.

It's been a long time since I had as much fun
as I did yesterday recording a song. I played
the bass, piano guitar, vocals, ran the drum
machine, and wrote the song. Today more overdubs
using the same musician, we get along so well,
and made a fine recording.

I'm cool with this band.

HAHAHAHAH!!!! Somebody else gets to sing my song!
Man I love that issues that just disappear when you fly solo!

I'm gonna play Devils advocate here...

1). Constantly late or misses rehearsals. Action- Replace member

How does a guy like that even get into the band in the first place? Seriously, its partially the bands fault if such a person got there to begin with...

2). Late or arrives at gigs right at start of first set. Action-Replace member

Saw this happen the other night...The guy has a day job, and was late cause of a critical meeting at the job... Guess maybe the band should not hire people who have day jobs? (or should they understand that until the band schedule pays the rent and healthcare, the band is just gonna have to suck it up on those occasions...?

3). Unless they have a physical handicap, members MUST help haul and set up equipment. If not action- replace member

Most bands are not equal opportunity employers... I agree that all should pitch in and help with he big stuff, But is it fair to ask others to haul your own personal stuff? Where do yo draw the line...Just curious

4) Dictating song selection thus not allowing another member's input. Action-Replace member or find a new band.

Agreed.. I would personally embrace other song inputs (If I did covers) ...UNLESS somebody suggests that we do Osmond Brothers

5) Not sharing gig pay equally unless agreed upon up front. Action- find a new band

Yikes..again..How the heck would that happen in the first place? Wouldn't the compensation arrangements, wages/etc be established up front?

6) Members who insist on doing cover tunes exactly like the record. Action-Tell them to take some ex-lax otherwise their sh*t will turn into a diamond.

I totally disagree... There aint nothing worse than some jack ass that totally defiles a good song... and then tries to pass that off as "creative license"...Bull sh*t! If you want to be the BEST at what you do, I would think the first step to MEASURE UP to the existing bar...If you cant measure up, how are you gonna own and improve it... Sorry... But when it comes to cover bands, nothing beats a tight rendition of the existing material Case in point: Look at Neanderpaul and Jimmy Danger doing Badfinger "No matter what" ... They kicked its ass because first and foremost , they learned how its was originally done...THEN they owned it.. Its that simple.

7) Members who refuse to work on one of your original tunes when you always work on their original tunes. Action- Pack my sh*t and leave EVERY time it happens.

But what if your original material sucks? (And I'm not implying that yours does...) But What if the other guys material is way better... and what if the consensus in the band is that your material and song writing skills are not mature enough? Are you willing to exercise patience and focus toward your SW skills?

8) Members who nitpick about your playing. Action- Tell them the only opinions that counts are the audience. If the audience reacts positively to the song then the member should shut the fu*k up.

Myself, As a song writer, If you phrase out a bass lick that's patently inappropriate to the mood or orientation of the song, I'd be inclined to suggest a minor change on that lick. Would that be unreasonable?

9) Drinking or playing high or buzzed, gigs or rehearsals. Action-I don't and I consider music a job. I don't put up with it but you might.

Totally agree here... Drugs,. Pot Alchohol... Keep all that that separated from the Professional efforts of the band. Absolutely critical to me not to co-mingle the activities.

10) Member's whose significant other interferes with the band's business too often. Action-If their significant other doesn't stop interfering then that member leaves or YOU leave.

I partnered once with a UK bassist who always told me: "An den bring yer fookin birds to me sessions, right? I always responded , " 'owm i gonna do that mate? Ah con' even get 'em into me bedroom...? "

11) My policy on song selection, all members get to choose both covers and their own originals. Audience decides what songs to keep AWLaYs. No dictatorship unless agreed to up front.

What if the audience insists that you change your act to Pat Boone tunes?

I'm gonna play Devils advocate here...

1). Constantly late or misses rehearsals. Action- Replace member

How does a guy like that even get into the band in the first place? Seriously, its partially the bands fault if such a person got there to begin with...

I'm going to play devil's advocate with your devil's advocacy Paperdog. First I respect your opinion(s), but how many WORKING bands have you been in? I've been in too many, over a dozen. For no.1 above guys "like that" are the headliner/star of the band. When I was young I was excited just to gig. I was willing to put up with more B.S. than I do now.

2). Late or arrives at gigs right at start of first set. Action-Replace member

Saw this happen the other night...The guy has a day job, and was late cause of a critical meeting at the job... Guess maybe the band should not hire people who have day jobs? (or should they understand that until the band schedule pays the rent and healthcare, the band is just gonna have to suck it up on those occasions...?

A band is a business. If somebody can't prioritize an equal effort as the other members I'd just as soon find a replacement.

3). Unless they have a physical handicap, members MUST help haul and set up equipment. If not action- replace member

Most bands are not equal opportunity employers... I agree that all should pitch in and help with he big stuff, But is it fair to ask others to haul your own personal stuff? Where do yo draw the line...Just curious
I draw the line at wimpy but otherwise able-bodied people who continually don't offer to help set up and break down the equipment. My personal stuff weighs a ton and the least somebody can do is offer to help me with it.

4) Dictating song selection thus not allowing another member's input. Action-Replace member or find a new band.

Agreed.. I would personally embrace other song inputs (If I did covers) ...UNLESS somebody suggests that we do Osmond Brothers
If some band member wants to do an Osmond tune (not likely) and the audience enjoys it,then my opinion DOESN'T count.

5) Not sharing gig pay equally unless agreed upon up front. Action- find a new band

Yikes..again..How the heck would that happen in the first place? Wouldn't the compensation arrangements, wages/etc be established up front?
It does happen. I was in a band once where one of the other band members booked a gig and assumed he should get an extra cut. If we hired an agent that's one thing, but assuming is something else entirely.

6) Members who insist on doing cover tunes exactly like the record. Action-Tell them to take some ex-lax otherwise their sh*t will turn into a diamond.

I totally disagree... There aint nothing worse than some jack ass that totally defiles a good song... and then tries to pass that off as "creative license"...Bull sh*t! If you want to be the BEST at what you do, I would think the first step to MEASURE UP to the existing bar...If you cant measure up, how are you gonna own and improve it... Sorry... But when it comes to cover bands, nothing beats a tight rendition of the existing material Case in point: Look at Neanderpaul and Jimmy Danger doing Badfinger "No matter what" ... They kicked its ass because first and foremost , they learned how its was originally done...THEN they owned it.. Its that simple.
I have 30 years gigging experience. I gave myself permission to interpret a cover song any way I like, I've EARNED that right. I don't "defile" any song to the point where it's unrecognizable. Personally I simply get tired of playing a song the same way every time, after time, after time. That's what karaoke is for, that's what jukeboxes are for. I am neither. I hear all the time how people like the way we do some of the covers OUR WAY.

7) Members who refuse to work on one of your original tunes when you always work on their original tunes. Action- Pack my sh*t and leave EVERY time it happens.

But what if your original material sucks? (And I'm not implying that yours does...) But What if the other guys material is way better... and what if the consensus in the band is that your material and song writing skills are not mature enough? Are you willing to exercise patience and focus toward your SW skills?
The only person(s) opinion that counts is the audience. I can't tell you how many songs I've played (covers or originals) that I thought suck and the audience loved it and VICE VERSA. You have strong opinions,sure, but trust me THEY don't count. Achey Breaky Heart is the SUCKIEST country song IMO ever, but Billy Ray Cyrus made a fortune off something that sucked. Let the audience decide, ESPECIALLY if your bandmate wants to try it.

8) Members who nitpick about your playing. Action- Tell them the only opinions that counts are the audience. If the audience reacts positively to the song then the member should shut the fu*k up.

Myself, As a song writer, If you phrase out a bass lick that's patently inappropriate to the mood or orientation of the song, I'd be inclined to suggest a minor change on that lick. Would that be unreasonable?
In rehearsing a tune I'm more than accessible/agreeable to change a bass-line. We get in front of an audience and the people love it, well I guess my part was good enough now, wasn't it.

9) Drinking or playing high or buzzed, gigs or rehearsals. Action-I don't and I consider music a job. I don't put up with it but you might.

Totally agree here... Drugs,. Pot Alchohol... Keep all that that separated from the Professional efforts of the band. Absolutely critical to me not to co-mingle the activities.
Agreed, nothing good comes with playing with addicts.

10) Member's whose significant other interferes with the band's business too often. Action-If their significant other doesn't stop interfering then that member leaves or YOU leave.

I partnered once with a UK bassist who always told me: "An den bring yer fookin birds to me sessions, right? I always responded , " 'owm i gonna do that mate? Ah con' even get 'em into me bedroom...? "

11) My policy on song selection, all members get to choose both covers and their own originals. Audience decides what songs to keep AWLaYs. No dictatorship unless agreed to up front.

What if the audience insists that you change your act to Pat Boone tunes?

1). Constantly late or misses rehearsals. Action- Replace member
How does a guy like that even get into the band in the first place? Seriously, its partially the bands fault if such a person got there to begin with...
I'm going to play devil's advocate with your devil's advocacy Paperdog. First I respect your opinion(s), but how many WORKING bands have you been in? I've been in too many, over a dozen. For no.1 above guys "like that" are the headliner/star of the band. When I was young I was excited just to gig. I was willing to put up with more B.S. than I do now.

I've been in none.. But I know for a fact that have worked with more professional, separate and independant 'Teams" than you have gigged with Bands . There is a common principle in team building... The-nare do-wells are screened out long before it comes to punctuality issues.. Whether the team is a band, a group of IT developers, a campaign org , or a hit squad...(I've not been part of a hit squad..) Regardless, based on my experience, I still contend Its the team's fault for dropping the ball on that.

2). Late or arrives at gigs right at start of first set. Action-Replace member
Saw this happen the other night...The guy has a day job, and was late cause of a critical meeting at the job... Guess maybe the band should not hire people who have day jobs? (or should they understand that until the band schedule pays the rent and healthcare, the band is just gonna have to suck it up on those occasions...?
A band is a business. If somebody can't prioritize an equal effort as the other members I'd just as soon find a replacement.

If I got a family to feed and that meeting at my day job means the difference in my employment, ...unless the band can pay my rent and cover me, the band will just have to suck it up... And ya know what? A good team understands that , and does just that..as a show of support, which compels me to bust my ass that much harder for my team... and figure out a way to balance the priority in their favor. On the other hand if the team cant support that , then your right, its better to asta la vista...ya wouldn't need to ask me twice...

4) Dictating song selection thus not allowing another member's input. Action-Replace member or find a new band.
Agreed.. I would personally embrace other song inputs (If I did covers) ...UNLESS somebody suggests that we do Osmond Brothers
If some band member wants to do an Osmond tune (not likely) and the audience enjoys it,then my opinion DOESN'T count.

If that works for you... But when was the last time BB King did an Osmond song just cause the audiences wanted it... (loud Buzzer eheheheheheheheheheheheh....!!!!) That's whut ah thought....

7) Members who refuse to work on one of your original tunes when you always work on their original tunes. Action- Pack my sh*t and leave EVERY time it happens.
But what if your original material sucks? (And I'm not implying that yours does...) But What if the other guys material is way better... and what if the consensus in the band is that your material and song writing skills are not mature enough? Are you willing to exercise patience and focus toward your SW skills?

The only person(s) opinion that counts is the audience. I can't tell you how many songs I've played (covers or originals) that I thought suck and the audience loved it and VICE VERSA. You have strong opinions,sure, but trust me THEY don't count. Achey Breaky Heart is the SUCKIEST country song IMO ever, but Billy Ray Cyrus made a fortune off something that sucked. Let the audience decide, ESPECIALLY if your bandmate wants to try it.

I dunno Bob, the goal is to entertain audiences, to be sure...But when they start asking you to drop your drawers, and to fondle the pianist... are you gonna do that for your audience, cause their opinion counts so much more than the band's opinion? (Buzzzer eheheheheheehehheheheheheheheheheh!!!!!...) Ah thought not....

8)Members who nitpick about your playing. Action- Tell them the only opinions that counts are the audience. If the audience reacts positively to the song then the member should shut the fu*k up.
Myself, As a song writer, If you phrase out a bass lick that's patently inappropriate to the mood or orientation of the song, I'd be inclined to suggest a minor change on that lick. Would that be unreasonable?
In rehearsing a tune I'm more than accessible/agreeable to change a bass-line. We get in front of an audience and the people love it, well I guess my part was good enough now, wasn't it.

You don't have to gig for 30 years to realize that most audiences (after 9 Pm) wouldn't know the difference anyhow... Just saying, The audience at a bar scene is prolly not the best barometer to go by on decisions about material...

Simple reply.

Not being honest.....

Cheers.

Just saying, The audience at a bar scene is prolly not the best barometer to go by on decisions about material...

I wouldn't bet my career on it ... they are the one's paying for your product.

Just saying, The audience at a bar scene is prolly not the best barometer to go by on decisions about material...

I wouldn't bet my career on it ... they are the one's paying for your product.

They pay for that whether they like it or not... They pay for it whether they "get it" or not... In fact most bar audiences (after 3 beers, ) Dont really give a sh*t if you shout out " F*ck The Queen" while playing the Star-Spangled banner , Or "God Save the Queen" while Sonya and her wonder Dog do trampoline acts on the stage... The crowd rolls with it for the moment anyway... It don't mean they 'want' it or even asked for it. And it sure don't imply that you should always "have" that in your act.

People who go to bars usually wind up gettin get drunk, Laid... but most will SETTLE for getting 'amused' which is what most bands provide. Career? Nobody in their right mind plays a bar scene expecting "music appreciation" Its utterly retarded to expect it.

That's why I believe that the audience is not a good barometer for 'Decisions" on material... Let me qualify... I'm NOT talking about decision on covers. .... However, even if I were... Lets just say that A road-house blues singer will probably NEVER do a Paul Anka number in his act no matter HOW MUCH "that " audience wants it.. and he's be an artistic fool to waste his time trying to appease that audience.