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Sin is subjective? Hmmm...

However, if there is an almighty God, He gets to make that call. Thus sin would be objective in that case. I wonder what Descartes would say about that?

Talbot

So basically we're in agreement. But I'm with Etu, sin is a matter of perception. I operate more out of the law of karma or balance.
But you're right, the uninformed will be suckered out of their cold hard cash by these companies.

Yet here's the issue, the industry is locking up ALL opportunities. Pretty soon, even club owners will want to use avenues like Sonicbids to force bands into competing just for playing slots. Of course, we can balk and say we won't do it, but then there'll be no places to play.

On a positive note though, I'm seeing how I can just create my own avenue. I'm really so finished with the music industry. Now, I'm just performing on my terms. I already know that I'm not going to have any mainstream fame, so I'm like Bob in that respect. Still it's annoying though.

Chaeya

I was thinking... The paradigm of night clubs could get tossed in favor of other venues. For example, get a permit (35 bucks ) from the city and throw a block party. Invite your public through radio ad...get the ad for free cause you wanna do it for a charity.. and so on...
At the end of the day, nightclubs are licensed to serve liquor...everything else is a gamble anyway... The club owners operate on the assumption that the public "has" to drink... They fail to realize that people want to to drink and dance and rock out and so on... The can get all that at a block party or essentially any place, anyhow without a club.

You're so giving me an idea.

Chaeya

You're so giving me an idea.

Chaeya

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So I open up my e-mail this morning and I have an email from Bandmix stating "Bandmix Recommends Music X-ray" - I deleted it of course, but I wonder if this thread had anything to do with it?

Chaeya

I got the same e-mail a few days ago. Being curious, I signed up, and now I have another message saying that there may be a market for one of our songs. I will report back with the results.

I got the same e-mail a few days ago. Being curious, I signed up, and now I have another message saying that there may be a market for one of our songs. I will report back with the results.

Three of my songs each got between 2 and 5 hits at $3.00 to $10.00 to submit. Sorry but they are not gettin' one dime from me. One of the songs "If I don't have you" has a free submit so I am gonna go ahead and try that one.

Thank God for people like Fisherman Bob. My motivation is the same as his - I make music because I enjoy creating & listening to it. If anyone else likes my stuff, great (though they should probably seek psychological help or get their hearing tested). I think the problem with the Music Industry in general is that they tend to send a guy in a suit into Berklee and pick 4 kids with cool haircuts and say "You, you, and you. You're gonna form a band. Here's the name. I'll pay you for 2 albums, then you can fake a fight, stay together, whatever. I want your sound to be EXACLY like ___ (insert currently trendy band name here). 2 ballads, 2 fast songs, and a coule of fillers. Here are the chords. Now go create something original!"

As promised, I'm reporting back on my experience so far. I created a focus group of 25 people (first one is free) and so far 7 people have rated our song "Doghouse". Four people chose not to leave a comment, one said "Fun!", another said "This raawks" and another said that unless we are going for comedy the lyrics were the worst he ever heard. Well yeah, comedy is a big part of what we do, but how would he know that from listening to one song? Statistically the song is rated better than 32% of the music submitted to X-Ray.

As promised, I'm reporting back on my experience so far. I created a focus group of 25 people (first one is free) and so far 7 people have rated our song "Doghouse". Four people chose not to leave a comment, one said "Fun!", another said "This raawks" and another said that unless we are going for comedy the lyrics were the worst he ever heard. Well yeah, comedy is a big part of what we do, but how would he know that from listening to one song? Statistically the song is rated better than 32% of the music submitted to X-Ray.

See, this is why I hate those freaking sites... On one hand... If we need a barometer to tell us where our progress lies... Theres all these chuckle-heads that crawl out of the woodwork and blast the songs.. but on another hand... they are the lowest common denominator...and if they can't be pleased, it gives us an idea of a direction to shift toward (or away from) ... Either way, it sucks for the musicians... And you can be assured that most, if not all consumers of music (i.e the bouncing bimbos and their flat-footed dagwoods) don't have a single clue about what it takes to assemble a song that grabs an audience by the balls.

It doesn't really tell us anything we don't already know; some people "get" us and others don't. We designed the band to be that way; we don't want to appeal to everyone. 50% of what we are is our live show; without the visual aspect it's difficult to understand what we're going after. Our next project MUST be a DVD.

I think the problem with the Music Industry in general is that they tend to send a guy in a suit into Berklee and pick 4 kids with cool haircuts and say "You, you, and you. You're gonna form a band. Here's the name. I'll pay you for 2 albums, then you can fake a fight, stay together, whatever. I want your sound to be EXACLY like ___ (insert currently trendy band name here). 2 ballads, 2 fast songs, and a coule of fillers. Here are the chords. Now go create something original!"

You mean like this?



My daughter is in love with this band. Can you say Motley Kiss?

Chaeya

We did the MusicXray thing too after getting the email from Bandmix. We did a focus group on our song "My Blood." Our focus group was 24 out of 25 people. Our song scored 3.67 and it said our song was better than 89% of the music on MusicXray. If it wasn't free we would not do it. MusicXray is not the only site like this. You have Sonic Bids, Reverbnation, and a host of others. I firmly believe that no legitimate promoter should be paid, or will look to be paid, to listen to your music. Although I think these sites are just looking to make a buck, I also think some of them offer good FREE services and tools that musicians can use to promote there music and get some gigs.

http://www.rainmakerrocks.com
http://www.facebook.com/rainmakerrocks

We did the MusicXray thing too after getting the email from Bandmix. We did a focus group on our song "My Blood." Our focus group was 24 out of 25 people. Our song scored 3.67 and it said our song was better than 89% of the music on MusicXray. If it wasn't free we would not do it. MusicXray is not the only site like this. You have Sonic Bids, Reverbnation, and a host of others. I firmly believe that no legitimate promoter should be paid, or will look to be paid, to listen to your music. Although I think these sites are just looking to make a buck, I also think some of them offer good FREE services and tools that musicians can use to promote there music and get some gigs.

http://www.rainmakerrocks.com
http://www.facebook.com/rainmakerrocks

If I were a promoter, and became inundated with musicians every day, trying to slip in their material for me to review, (Knowing that a majority of it is less than desirable material) , then I can t think of a better way to buffer the influx, than by charging a fee for taking my valuable time to listen to the material and provide professional feedback.

Now, The online thing... If a promoter depends on public to thumbs up or down, (aka automated feedback) on the submitted material, then I believe that promoter should not see a dime, since there is no earnest effort to actually review and provide feedback one -on-one from the promoter. In that case, the promoter will have to depend on advertising revenue from the site...which is where all this is going...Its no longer about your songs. Instead its about a site owner guaranteeing that his advertisers will enjoy the exposure of products on line, by a market , who is being sold on the dream of riches, stardom and success.

This is precisely why I place absolutely no substantial credence in any of the musician "support" sites. (Other than they get your name listed) If you wanna become a star, the only real way to do this is the good old fashion way...years of gigging, networking and seizing every opp that flies your way. Basically, one must still "Traverse the Brick and Mortar World" ...And why not? Its always down to one thing...ENTERTAINING AUDIENCES.

I never got an email or even heard of these sites until I read this post. From what it sounds like it seems to have the same motive as a dating site. DON'T JUDGE ME YET, LET ME EXPLAIN! There is nothing with a dating site and I respect what they are doing. It worked for my aunt and she is very happy with who she found. What I'm getting at is that it's taking away the work that needs to be done. I find satisfaction when my hard work finally pays off. If there is no work done, I don't get that feeling of success. Yes, it may pay off sometimes, but so much of the experience is left out. Anyways, any of these "music opportunity" sites always send up a red flag when I see them. I was hesitant on signing up for this one. I'm a little upset that I had to pay to contact somebody, but now that I've talked to anyone that might work out I'm going to stop payment. I always do research on stuff like this. I got an email from bandmix saying somebody left me a message. It basically was a scam artist offering me an "opportunity" at several million dollars because of our name or something like that. The message had "SCAM ARTIST" written all over it.

If what I said about the dating sites offended anybody, I am truly sorry. I wasn't disrespecting what they are, what they do, or who uses them. It was simply an illustration.