General Music Chat

Just a question, one point a post with logical explanation , and lack of emotion (name calling) would be real cool.

This is not about attack and counter attack this is more about finding out why a bunch of really cool musicians feel the way they do. I may surprise you more than you think.

I liked him as Governor of Texas. Here, we really had a bi-partisan experience and even the Democrats liked him because he allowed the political process to work, and everyone got what they needed from State Government.

Once he became President, he found out that Democrats don't really want to work with Republicans in DC, they only want to make them look bad.


For the record, I didn't agree with 98% of what he did while President except for one thing. It was/is the biggest issue of our time though. America had been letting state-sponsored paramilitary groups (terrorists) attack us at will without reprisal since the 1960s. That needed to stop and it's the only thing I could support Bush on.

But here is the deal with W; people hated him because he was sure of himself. He'd tell you what he was going to do, then he'd let the political process go forward so everyone could be on record about whether they agreed or not, then he would do exactly what he said he was going to do.

That tied the liberals up in knots because its the opposite of how they do business. They deceive about their intentions, they try to manipulate the process, then they do the opposite of what they said they wanted to do.

So, though I didn't agree with most of what Bush did during his adminstration, I always knew where he stood on a matter. He had the courage of his convictions whether you liked him or not. In other words, he had a backbone like all Texans do...

Go Mavs!

I don't hate him.

I hate that he sold us one more step down the road into globalist slavery.

For that I'd love to see him tried convicted and hanged for treason.

Now there is a can-0-worms

"W" was a mixed bag for me, strong abroad and weak at home. I generally agree with his 9/11 response. Sending radical Islamists who only want us dead into hiding in caves and spider holes for 10 years has seriously weakened their ability to wage war on the west. No serious attacks on home soil in 10 years is an outstanding accomplishment considering the fact that there are terrorists living in every major city in the US.

His economic policies were too laissiez-faire:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laissez-faire

If the goal was a free market driven by supply and demand we missed it by a mile. What we got was a supply-side rigged market where a few gamers made off with billions and the rest of us got soaked. First it was Enron and El Paso Gas (friends of "W") who gamed energy prices and were sending $10,000 utility bills to little old ladies for two years.

Next it was the Mortgage mess which Chris Dodd and Barney Frank were in up to their eyeballs as well. "W" did submit legislation to reign this in but too little, too late. That freight train was rolling full steam and required executive order to shut it down. It never happened and now here we are. Housing as an investment for everyone may never recover.

The third inaction was the speculative gaming of oil prices during his last year in office. Many of his good buddies made billions selling oil at $150 bbl while demand was falling off daily. A pure speculative bubble that poked middle class working Americans in the eye.

Each of these rigged games did tremendous damage to individual Americans, struggling businesses and our economy as a whole. By allowing them to continue unfettered did damage to our trust in government and trust in our American economic system.

Other than those issues I had no beef with Bush.

He invaded a country that hadn't attacked us. (Iraq)

He failed to secure our borders in time of war (it would be bad enough during peace time)

He spent my grandkid's money.

He paved the way for an even worse traitor who currently degrades the office.

Mission accomplished eh?

yep - tried and hanged for treason.

Talbot

I don't hate him.

I hate that he sold us one more step down the road into globalist slavery.

For that I'd love to see him tried convicted and hanged for treason.

Then we need to hang every President going all the way back to Lincoln. From Woodrow Wilson forward, we should hang their Vice-Presidents, too.

Yod

I like the way you think. Wilson caused this country (and the world) than darn near anybody by dragging the US into WWI and breaking a stalemate. Result: Collapse of US Economy, Stalin, Hitler, WWII, Cold War, Make Believe Terror War, Collapse of US economy (again).

Yeah, I'm with you. Hang the lot of 'em.

Talbot

I 'll get the rope ...

Yod

I like the way you think. Wilson caused this country (and the world) than darn near anybody by dragging the US into WWI and breaking a stalemate. Result: Collapse of US Economy, Stalin, Hitler, WWII, Cold War, Make Believe Terror War, Collapse of US economy (again).

Yeah, I'm with you. Hang the lot of 'em.

Talbot

The Federal Reserve Act was his biggest transgression though. It sealed the globalist agenda.

We couldn't have a "federal deficit" without Woodrow.

Gun Control Act of 1968:

Most blatantly unconstitutional law ever enacted IMO.

WOOOW! If we had this sort of discourse throughout the country we could solve quite a few problems. MT please just explain things a bit more. Funny but Bush was goaded into the Iraq war by all the UN sanction Violations with the weapons inspections. Funny George H was stopped from stopped from finishing the job the first time, by the the very same UN.

How many Americans would NOT have died in a war if we had FINISHED it the first time? Any one want to go back to Vietnam? How about N. Korea.

Now Pakistan is crying because we helped a mass murderer exit this world. Sorry off topic, but the points being made are raising many valid ones. It's funny how it is not about one presidents mistakes, but about the mistakes, we the American people allow to happen.

Thanks guys, you are all GREAT!!!

He sold out the American worker.

He erased our Constitutionally-guaranteed American freedoms.

He helped create the worst economic failure since the Great Depression.

He encouraged the privatization of military & other gov't duties, to the further economic detriment of this country.

He failed to act decisively during at least 2 domestic emergencies - Katrina & 9/11.

He insulted too many countries to list.

He acted like a buffoon who couldn't even speak our language.

He failed to stop illegal aliens from entering the country...in fact, he seemed anxious to keep them coming in.

He lied about our reasons for entering the Iraq War, & invaded a country that had done nothing to us - the 1st time this ever happened in US history.

His demeanor was the least presidential I've ever seen in the office.

He took vacations when we needed true leadership.

He hired some of the worst anti-American advisors & cabinet-members ever.

His actions made him, &, by association, our entire country, a bad joke to the world at large.

He encouraged the uneducated among us to remain uneducated.

He was the worst president this country may have ever seen.

Yes, I think I may actually hate the man.

At first, I really thought you were talking about Obama until you mentioned Iraq instead of Libya (where he hasn't given a legitimate reason at all yet). Assuming you meant Bush, I'd agree with a large part of this, but would find your comments highly hypocritical unless you mention that Bush was merely Obama "lite" in every regard you've brought up.

Like I said before, Bush at least told you what he was going to do, and then let the politicians we've sent to DC go on record about where they stood, and then did exactly what he said he was going to do. Obama is a much worse transgressor at ALL of these same items, except more deceptive about his intentions and unwilling to allow the political process of debate.

So what is the answer????

It looks to me that the USA is going to split in half (or more) if things continue the way they're going. We already are, ideologically, but I'm talking about physically. Texas and/or Arizona will lead the way.





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Phil, my friend, could you do us a favor and go line by line and just give a reasonable little bit of fact to substantiate what you are writing.
The problem I have with everything you have have written is the lack of basis, other than your feelings and it seems to just be a rant based on your opinion. That is fine if you just feel that way, but this country is in trouble and the truth should be made in a greater understanding of how these feelings come to be.

I am in no way putting you down, I am just trying to understand where this strong dislike of W comes from.

I'll tell you why I didn't Like H. He didn't finish the job in Iraq the first time.
Your turn.

He took NAFTA beyond even what Clinton started. Gave GM bailout $ without requiring that they invest in AMERICAN manufacturing.

The Patriot Act is as clear-cut a case of the removal of American freedoms as any I've ever seen attempted.

By keeping Greenspan in office, he assured that corruption would run the market. By handing out bailouts to the ripoff co's without demanding jail time when it was needed & deserved, he allowed the ripoffs to continue, as they have & do to this day.

Blackwater & other co's taking over our prisons & such are the very worst thing that can be allowed for our economy, & for our freedoms...not to mention the ridiculous COST of these firms' services.

His good ol' boy system failed us miserable during Katrina, yet he did nothing to make the situation better. His response during 9/11, while reading to elementary school kids, just showed how ill-prepared he was to lead us in any emergency. His follow-ups & cover-ups after the fact were embarrassing, too.

His incredibly stiupid remarks during the G8 summit were embarrassing to us all. "Good bye from the world's biggest polluter!" His bragging. His bluff & bluster, & his unability to back up his words in Iraq all add up to his inability to have any real substance.

His words never backed up any of his actions concerning illegals. He was a wimpy ass-licker to many ppl who hire illegals...& fund his & his cronies' campaigns.

This country never declared war on another country who hadn't attacked us first, prior to the Iraq War. There were no WMD's, & I suspect everyone knew it but Powell...

There are pages & pages of his verbal gaffs in print...more than any oter public figure, even including Dan Quail!

He took more vacations than any other pres, esp war-time pres's/

Rumsfeld...Chaney....aw, hell, man...the list is just too long, of the ppl who were only in office to further their own personal interests.

Ppl STILL joke about his inability to speak, to lead, to accomplish anything, while they still talk about the damage he's done. Far more than any pres I've heard of.

"I had a C-minus average. So you, too, can be pres if you have bad grades. Isn't this country great?" (a paraphrase, but clearly an accurate one.)

Between having to hide his military lack of background, the theft pf the office in spite of the coubtry's vote, his horrible actions & line vetoes (more than every opther pres COMBINED), his actions to upgrade the pres office to a virtual emporer-ship, his lies, his war that was fairly obviously set up to keep him in office, his stupid use of language, his complete disrefard & disrespect for other countries, his croneyism, his crappy cabinet, his deregulation of big biz, & his general lack of any real backbone or ability to complete a task, I have zero respect, & a hell of a lot of real disgust for the man. I only wosh I could go back in time & kill him & his entire staff AND the Supreme Court assholes who placed him in office.

Yeah...I guess you could say I hate him...for all the right reasons.