Canada

I can understand your trepidation about putting music on websites.

That's why I section it up. You get 1 minute, that's all. F you if you don't like it, buy the cd. (and the answer to that is, THERE ISN'T ONE)

The other point is that original music, NEVER gets uploaded in any form. Thieves are everywhere. I'll toss someone a bone that is rerecorded from someone else, but you won't see any original music of mine anywhere.

Unless it is a bootleg and then I don't care, just send me a copy, as I don't have it either. lol

Plenty of harmless music that can be rewritten and give the folks an idea of what is to come/what you are about.

Yes .... I agree to the "demo" idea for uploading songs.... allowing minute songs only will work to protect your music from being abused from those looking for a never ending ride on the FREE tunes train.

I can't help to think of the marginal increase in CD sales if all of a sudden every single musician and artist on the internet ceased to offer full songs for free. Fans would have little choice but to turn to FREE Download sites .... which are fast on their way out. In short .... fans would be in the direction of screwed. Pay or go without kinda thing.

Now we know this isn't going to happen. There isn't going to be some music genie show up and make all the full songs go poof. But you would think being that this concept isn't all that difficult to reason with.... that musicians and artists would take their music off the sites.

Its as simple as this.... If you offer even just 1 full song .... you fuel the fire of FREE assessable music... which acts to discourage fan based music sales.

Now here's an idea that i'm almost crazy enough to try.....

An Internet Musicians Union.... where musicians and artists register their songs for $1 each per year.... while abiding by the rule that the song... being registered... can't be uploaded anywhere on the net in full (1 min max) ..... and in return for the song registration .... the musician/artists receives funding coverage for any legal disputes if the song is stolen and/or pirated.

Ok.... alot of bugs to work out in that above plan ... lol... but you get the idea.

...<snip> The other point is that original music, NEVER gets uploaded in any form. Thieves are everywhere. I'll toss someone a bone that is rerecorded from someone else, but you won't see any original music of mine anywhere..<snip>

Unless you do what I did, and join ASCAP. They protect intellectual property of your original music by being this massive organization with "ears" all over the nation - listening to radio, TV, CD and DVD. They listen for material without the proper copyright permission to record or perform, contact the producer of such material, and if they don't then reimburse the artist properly or pull that material from the market, ASCAP has an immense legal machine to go after them.

Joining has been one of the best things I've ever done. Three years ago, they caught a Texas audio production company trying to steal two tracks of a CD I put out some time ago, for some radio promo they were being paid to do. I got a settlement from the company.

It's worth it.

Niiice, I love it when the little guys(musicians) shove it to the big guys (corps).

Man, we don't have any other choice! With all the talk on here about economics and the Iron Law of Supply and Demand, we haven't yet touched on the fact that every corporation will screw you if they think they have a chance to and get away with it. Sad, but true.

When it comes to large corporations screwing the little guy ..... musicians make that easy for them.... by tossing their music all over the place on ad based sites that have about as much care for the musicians musical future and protection as apparently the musician does. Sooner or later .... if you go to that much trouble to distribute your music ..... someone is going to say ok fine ..... damnit it .... i'll take it.

In another sense .... its very difficult to copyright and protect a song. Some people claim that if you upload it to a website of your own .... slap this Copyright symbol under it and say .... all rights reserved .... that now its completely off limits to planet earth. Which is interesting considering .......

The US Copyright office says ..... they don't like Copyrighting songs because they can't figure out yet who exactly has the most rights to a particular song. For example:

1) Is it the Songwriter?
2) The Musicians?
3) The recording studio?

When an artist records a song for the purpose of adding to ther CD and career .... the artist may have written the entire song in completion..... but .... when it is heard on the CD ..... the guitarists has rights to his riffs.... the keyboardist has rights to his melodies .... and so on .... plus ..... the overall sound production recording of the song belongs to none of the band members ..... but rather ..... to the recording studio.

In the music industry .... this is made simple. A licence is required for the use of the song by any claimed users.... such as .... a Recording Studio encourages other song owners to acquire a Master Rights Licence to use the song.... A recording studio would need a Statutory Mechanical Licence ... and so on. Each owner of the song is protected by his/her own individual submittion to the song within/as an overall production.

So to steal a song from sayyyyyyy Natalie ... I would be in interesting trouble ... for she may sue me for stealing her Vocal Lyrics and perhaps the written lyrics as well .... each band member may individually sue me for stealing their instrumental contribution, while yet .... the recording studio sues me also for stealing their master recording.

What I find to be just as sad as large coporations taking advantage of people's lack of knowledge and protection is also.... people's false understanding and assurance of their music actually being protected.

If Natalie were to come to me and say..... please make sure I have this here song completely protected by copyright .... I would have to tell her .... sorry ... but no can do.....

Because the song ... as a whole ... doesn't belong to her. And ... there isn't a damn thing I can do to stop the guitarist on the CD from distributing his portion of the music. Its "his music" ... who is going to stop him? Also .... I can't stop the Recording Studio from adding the song to a commercial ad .... as they own the master rights of the song.

At best .... the only thing I can do for Natalie in the sense of defense .... is either take her voice and lyrics off the CD... or sue for false use of her voice and lyrics.

But to protect the "entire" song at her request .... there is no way in hell I can do that ... and neither can anyone else. Not unless there is a contract explaining that all other rights within the song was/is subject to and/or under the sole rights of Natalie. Then I can do whatever she asks.

This is where large corporations are taking advantage of the little guy. They know that Natalie can't stop them from taking the song .... but only her partitioned contribution.

Not sure how the law works in Canada, but it costs money and takes time in the USA to actually copyright your songs. I found that its much cheaper and at least some protection, by joining ASCAP. See, even if you do go through all the hassle of copyrighting every one of your pieces, if someone steals it and you don't know about it, it's as if you never copyrighted it at all in their case. The copright symbol is not some invisible magical shield that makes sure your stuff never gets pilfered. At least with ASCAP, people are actually LISTENING and watching everywhere for copyright violations. You don't get that with a simple copyright registration. And if you choose the abstinence approach by never posting your music anywhere, nobody is going to know who the f**k you are.

As compared to the US Copyright Office ... the Canadian Copyright office sucks big time. There is no way I would use the Canadian Copyright office to register even the trash bags I toss out.

Being that ASCAP actually takes the time to monitor the usage of the songs they claim to protect .... is one of the reasons to choose them for song protection long before the US Copyright office .... who finds it in their best interests to just sit back and wait for a complaint to come to them... and ... then they rely on the submitter to do all the legal work.

As for non-distribution of the songs over the internet .... I didn't say shut down full/all sharing of every single song on the planet ...... what I did say however is....

Sharing full songs are fueling the fire of FREE assessable music and acting to discourage fan-based sales.

If you want exposure ..... get it .... by uploading demo songs. (non-full tracks). People will know who you are just as much with a demo song as they will with a full track song.

There is another concept as well.... technically ... when you upload a full track to a website .... what you are doing is .... agreeing to GIG on that website. Sooner or later you have to face the question of ..... do you want to constantly GIG for FREE? .... or not?

Natalie has 7 songs on her EP.... 4 of those songs are on the internet for .... what is claimed to be ........ exposure... and of course ... to help sell her CD.

Now consider this ... to buy her CD what exactly are you buying? The 7 songs on the CD? Or the 3 that you are missing being that you already have 4 of them for FREE.

So the incentive to buy her CD is not: Cost of CD/7 Songs ... but rather ... Cost of CD/3 Songs.

Natalie isn't the only one depending on this marketing system.... literally thousands of talents on bebo, myspace, youtube, and many other sites are trying to get $12.95 for a 4 song CD. The CD has 10 songs on it .... but 6 of those songs are uploaded in full track for ........ whats that word? ..... oh yea ..... exposure.

And whats worse is .... they likely don't even have these song properly protected.

<snip>

If you want exposure ..... get it .... by uploading demo songs. (non-full tracks). People will know who you are just as much with a demo song as they will with a full track song. <snip>

Yes, that's a good suggestion. And one iteration of that is the "song menage" concept. That is where you pick clips from some of your star material and you fade them in and out of each other. It takes some finesse but I have heard some good ones, that give a great overall picture of the artist.

Yet another thing to master, huh? lol

well remember what your mother told you, be careful what you do on the inernet , [ lol.......oops there's another one ..} not to trust everyone just because it seems good. I know bands that were lucky if they made 15%. the managers and promoters got it all. because they [ the management ]are also trying to make a name for themselves. The mad dogs and englishmen tour in the 70's was a prime example. the guy didn't have enough money to buy a car at the end of the tour. I personally don't buy music or take it for free from the internet at all, never did.and would not sell or promote my music inless i had my own personal pro web site to do it. because it's usually bad quality sound and or video when you just post it. there are bands who make one record never make another one because they lost their shirt, managers / recording studio and the like bankrupted them from the get go. so it's take your time and think. the internet is here to stay. beware

I totally agree bass..... excellent comments .... this is why I don't charge musicians a fee. I offer only FREE services. I believe musicians are paying enough out-of-pocket expenses as it is.

Man I would have loved to meet up with a manager like you 30 years ago.
Ain't hindsight great? If I would have stayed in the business 30 years ago I might have died.

My take on the free music thing is pretty simple. If an artist is putting out a full length song out there to be scooped for free then they deserve whatever comes back at them.
I suggest that artists simply make up a collage of songs into a sound byte thereby wetting the appetite of the paying public.
The big machine that was supporting artists 30 years ago has changed. The medium has changed....long live live performance...that's where it's at.