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#11317 by Craig Maxim
Wed Aug 15, 2007 5:45 pm
This is a question that has to be answered straight out of the box, when determining what the band's goals are.

To me, there is no middle ground on this.

You are primarily either, a cover band, or an originals band.
Typically in a cover band, you will play 80% to 90% covers
and the rest originals. An original band will do the opposite.
90% original and 10% covers (some won't do covers at all)

The question is, whether you are in this for the money or the music. Do you want to "make it" or do you just want to play for fun and make a small living doing so?

Cover bands will ALWAYS be cover bands, and the odds are highly stacked against them in "making it" with their own music.

One of the main reasons, is simply, that when you spend the majority of your time playing other's music, and therefore trying to pretty much sound like them, you don't have the time or freedom to develop your own sound fully. It is not easy to develop your own unique style, when you are spending so much time trying to sound like someone else. It overlaps. Even your originals will start sounding like someone else's music, because you spend so much time trying to sound like them for the majority of your songs.

Cover bands, may enjoy performing, but they are trying to eek out a living in music, not trying to "make it". Cover musicians want to be paid their $50 dollars to $200 dollars a night, and generally won't play without it. They often join unions (to get union scale) and play bars and weddings.

Original bands are all about the music. They will play anytime, anywhere, just to play, and expose their music to the public. A great deal of sacrifice is involved in being an original band, because you simply won't get paying gigs until you have a solid enough fan base, that you can guarantee 100 paying customers to show up for you. Also, there are fewer original oriented venues, than cover based venues.

For the club, it is ALL about the money. They ARE a business after all. You can succeed as an original band, and you can play anywhere a cover band would play, provided you are bringing paying customers, and giving the club good numbers (drink/food revenue) every time you play there.

So, you have to decide what you want out of this. If your original music is good, and you believe in it, and want to make a name for yourself with your own music, and are willing to be poor at first, then the choice is obvious. An original band.

Some cover bands on here won't like hearing this, and may not agree with it, because many of them really do think they can achieve both, i.e. play covers and spend some time on originals and balance both and still make it, while getting a small income along the way, waiting for their break.

But my experience, 30 years worth, has shown me that this almost never happens. Cover bands will usually always be cover bands. Individual's have a chance to shine in cover bands, but not the band itself. In other words, a record exec is in the audience, and sees that a female lead singer is hot and really talented, but the band is playing covers, and that exec will want to take her out of the band and develop her career as a solo artist. She appears to be the one with the talent, and he will just have his staff find the originals for her, and he would rather back her with the highest quality studio-type musicians of his own choosing.

When you are a cover band, and get a break, where there is a record exec in the audience, he likely won't be there by the time you get around to playing one of your originals. So, what he hears is "Hey, these guys play The Police just as good as the record. Well, there is already a Police, there is already a 3 Doors Down, there is already a whoever. There is no need for another one.

As a band that wants to "make it", what that exec needs to see, right from the first song of the set, is that these guys have a unique sound, good original music, and no shortage of it. You can't rely on a music execs immagination. You have to have the whole package ready to go, and prove through your performance that you do, and take any guesswork on his part, out of the equation.

If you do choose to be an original band, I recommend 1 or 2 covers per set. But if possible, make them your own. Let them be recognizable, but at that the same time, played in your own unique style.

The reason you do a few covers, is that while you are developing a fan base, it gives people new to your music, a security blanket. People feel more comfortable hearing something they recognize, even if it's only scattered here and there, and they are possibly more likely to stay around and more importantly, pay attention, to your own music, because it is less of a shock, less disorienting, when there is some familiarity involved, and they can sing along in their heads and hearts, because they know the words and melodies of those songs. Then they become your fans, and in no time, they are familiar with your music too, and mouthing the words of the songs they love, of yours. Which are now becoming favorites to them also.

#11321 by Vocals & Bass
Wed Aug 15, 2007 7:30 pm
In our area, With the private clubs we play, VFW, EAGLES, MOOSE, etc. Pay's $1000.oo + for Fri & Sat. Producers, etc. Looking for new talent to discover has already signed two cover bands in our Tri-State area in just the last year. Of course, Just because you get a label, Doesnt mean that it is a guarantee you have made it. Anything & Everything is possible in the music buisness. [Ability, Talent, & The knowledge of the music buisness, Personality, The ability at dealing with people {Gift of Gab} etc.] Is what it takes, In my personal opinion, ONLY......Peace.

#11328 by Irminsul
Wed Aug 15, 2007 9:00 pm
Vocals & Bass wrote:Its what your audience wants to hear is what counts the most.....


If this were true, we'd still be using only sticks and hollowed out ram horns for music. Stravinsky certainly didn't have an audience desire in mind when he wrote Firebird Fantasy or Rite of Spring. In fact, at their debut performances, the audiences rioted. Wagner didn't give a sh*t what the audience wanted either when he wrote everything from Das Rheingold to Parsifal. The critics then panned his music and said it amounted to throwing a bomb in the orchestra pit. YET....all these years later, their music is landmark and represented major and significant shifts in compositional style.

If all you want to do is grind an organ and send the monkey out with the cup to collect a coin, then yeah, what your audience wants is what counts most.

#11340 by Vocals & Bass
Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:28 am
Irminsul wrote:
Vocals & Bass wrote:Its what your audience wants to hear is what counts the most.....


If this were true, we'd still be using only sticks and hollowed out ram horns for music. Stravinsky certainly didn't have an audience desire in mind when he wrote Firebird Fantasy or Rite of Spring. In fact, at their debut performances, the audiences rioted. Wagner didn't give a sh*t what the audience wanted either when he wrote everything from Das Rheingold to Parsifal. The critics then panned his music and said it amounted to throwing a bomb in the orchestra pit. YET....all these years later, their music is landmark and represented major and significant shifts in compositional style.

If all you want to do is grind an organ and send the monkey out with the cup to collect a coin, then yeah, what your audience wants is what counts most.
Irminsul, You are a very talented musician, But you tend to twist & turn other musicians opinions, & suggestions out of context, Because you believe only in yourself, ['Only'], As the best of the best. Your like so many good musicians, That are their own worst enemy, & impossible to work with. Its sad to see so much talent go to waste. [Only in your mind, Instead of being 'Open minded']. Feel free to correct me on my spelling & literature. [Myself], I will not reply to any of your threads anymore. :oops: {Sorry}, I know it breaks your heart. With all of my best of wishes, & With the best of Good Luck....VB.....PEACE OF MIND.

#11343 by Irminsul
Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:13 am
Vocals & Bass wrote:Irminsul, You are a very talented musician, But you tend to twist & turn other musicians opinions, & suggestions out of context, Because you believe only in yourself, ['Only'], As the best of the best. Your like so many good musicians, That are their own worst enemy, & impossible to work with. Its sad to see so much talent go to waste. [Only in your mind, Instead of being 'Open minded']. Feel free to correct me on my spelling & literature. [Myself], I will not reply to any of your threads anymore. :oops: {Sorry}, I know it breaks your heart. With all of my best of wishes, & With the best of Good Luck....VB.....PEACE OF MIND.


OK, that made absolutely zero sense.

I responded to YOUR quote that said it's what "the audience likes that counts the most". Was I twisting your words? Did you NOT make that comment? Was your name NOT attributed as the author of that post? Who typed it if you did not? A ghost?

If I believed that I was the very best musician on the planet, do you think I'd be here talking to you galoots? Maybe you are doing what they call "projection", V&B.

Think about it.

#11347 by RhythmMan
Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:26 am
Irminsul, What percentage of the music you play is original?

#11352 by Vocals & Bass
Thu Aug 16, 2007 9:51 am
We play all covers, We are a cover band. [It works for me]. Not that I dont have a desire to write originals, Its having the time to do so. Music is a hobby, more or less at this point & time. And I even make enough $ to make it worth the effort. We do, Have one original my brother wrote & sings. Maybe will get it online one day. Between Family, Work, & Music. I have little time or money for anything else. Of course, It may make 'zero sense' to others. And that is just fine with me. We all have our own personal opinions on the subject of music. [Right or Wrong] We are still musicians, If it works for you. Thats all that counts for an artist. {This is only my personal opinion, Of course} VB.

#11377 by Irminsul
Thu Aug 16, 2007 8:55 pm
BluesRockFunkJazz wrote:Irminsul, What percentage of the music you play is original?


All of it.

#11381 by Vocals & Bass
Thu Aug 16, 2007 10:58 pm
I hope I don't sound like anyone except myself! Everybody is going to have their influences and you can't help picking up the likeness of your favorites, if you truly love an artist. Imitation is the highest form of flattery, so they say. I like being different and maybe someday, someone will sound like me! It is fun to try and sing a song "BETTER" than the original ! :Quote:{ My good friend, With all my respect & Love as an Artist. {TESSA} New Jersey, Toms River.} Check out her website, Myspace. 'Sincerley' [VB]

#11624 by RhythmMan
Tue Aug 21, 2007 4:56 pm
After taking this thread into advisement, and talking to several local musicians who whave been in the scene for over 20 years, I've decided to do about 98% originals.
The few originals I may do are ones which I happen to like a lot.
Spending time learning originals takes time away from learning my own music. Some of my songs are quite complex, and difficult for me to learn.
Some songs may take me months to even attain the ABILITY LEVEL I require, - so that I can reproduce what I hear in my head.
Or, sometimes it's a month or 2 to simply even learn the song, and then be able to play it with no obvious mistakes.
Remember, after composing the song w/chords, I often go back and add a complex bass-pattern. It's like writing and learning 2 songs.
Obviously, very, very few covers will cost me anywhere near this amount of time.
But I feel playing my own music will be a LOT more rewarding.
I still have over 10 hours of song ideas recorded - 10 seconds here, 30 seconds there . . .
Each 1/2 hour of my recorded song-ideas I listen to - usually results in another 4-5 new songs; songs which may take months to finalize.
And - I usually record about the same amount of new material, concurrently to listening to my old ideas . . .
I sometimes laugh at my previous playing ability on some of these tapes, but the seedling of a good idea is still there, none the less.
If I do the math, it's quite intimidating - I have years and years of material waiting, right now . . .
Sorry, 'cover-people': the originals win.
I've got to learn to play my music before old age sets in . . .
Last edited by RhythmMan on Tue Aug 21, 2007 9:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

#11626 by Irminsul
Tue Aug 21, 2007 6:46 pm
BluesRockFunkJazz wrote:Sorry, 'cover-people': the originals win.
I've got to learn to play my music before old age sets in . . .


You said it. While cover bands have a specific purpose, and are fine for people doing this just for fun or some extra cash, in the bigger scheme of music they really don't mean anything.

The last line of your post made me laugh, because the piano pieces I write are often beyond my immediate playing abilities, even though I have played the instrument since I was 6. I'm halfway into volume two of piano work and I am still trying to learn what I have written so far. I later found out this wasnt all that uncommon with composers but its a little embarrasing, when someone wants to hear you play one of your pieces and you have to point them to a performance done by another performer.
#11636 by fisherman bob
Wed Aug 22, 2007 1:49 am
a bunch of Neanderthals banging bones, sticks, and rocks together, probably mixed in with a few shrieks and groans. Thank God a few original bands evolved from that crew. (Some of the crap I've heard lately isn't too far removed from neanderthals!). This is one topic that always gets me going, drives me nuts sometimes. It shouldn't matter what percentage of covers or originals you play. All the songs you play in front of an audience should KICK ASS. If a particular song you play isn't working, DUMP it. If you substitute an original for the cover you've dumped and it WORKS, keep it in the repertoire. You've got live guinea pigs out there (your audience). They will tell you (sometimes with a thrown beer bottle) whether a song works or not. Substitute it with whatever song you want, doesn't matter whether it's a cover or original. If I hear one more musician say "we can't play originals" I'm going to vomit. USE YOUR GOD GIVEN CREATIVE MINDS ONCE IN A WHILE. YOU MAY BE SURPRISED YOU HAVE MORE SONGWRITING TALENT THAN YOU REALIZE. Later, your friendly occasional songwriting non-neanderthal bluesman fisherman bob

#11646 by johnnya
Wed Aug 22, 2007 12:58 pm
there was a time when communications took weeks, covers are for learning, money making, influence, originals display your abilities to make up music. music now is heard all over the world and everything seems influenced by something else. but the music you write is your soul manifesting itself thru the guitar, voice, hands, feet, the stage is yours for that moment, just enjoy it in this life.

#11653 by jimmydanger
Wed Aug 22, 2007 7:29 pm
Writing and playing your own music is great, but not everyone is necessarily good at it. I have heard plenty of not so good original music, even though their intentions were good. I have written and recorded plenty of originals, as well as done plenty of covers. Both are fulfilling, albeit in different ways.

#11655 by JJW III
Wed Aug 22, 2007 8:37 pm
Think if Led Zepplin, The Stones, or The Who were content on playing covers and never tried originals.

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