Irminsul wrote:
Rock/Metal was established as a type of rebellion. The
However, Christianity - especially modern American Evangelical Christianity - is rooted in a King James/Martin Luther flavor of Protestantism that is anything BUT rebellious.
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BTW your first problem with Christian music WAS strictly musical "my only problem with music is that it all sounds the "same-y"
But this is good.
To say that Rock and Metal belong to "evil" or "rebelion" because of it's first appearance in the light of your example is intersting.
All talent, ability, knowledge, power, ALLL comes first from God. If you don't agree, that's the end of our conversation simply because we can't go anyfurther on that vein. But if you do, then all forms of "evil" or rebellion are inherently distiortions of what God has first made.
There is not a "diminished Fmin" Chord or a "WICKED RIFF" that is evil in and of itself. IF you put things in it that are contrary to the Bible, it would THEN BY THE BIBLES standards,
be a pure thing with evil content.
For instance, Sex,,, AWESOMELY MADE BY GOD!!! He says, (in essence) "no sex before marriage,,, inside of marriage, its TOTALLY BLESSED THOUGH and you can do whatever your heart desires and whatever your mind can think of,,, as long as it's only with the one you married"
So satan comes, unable to create, takes what God has made,,, which is pure, and in order to get someone to sin, he tempts them NOT WITH WHAT IS GOOD, but has to distort something that is pure and cause it to dabble into something that is against God. (being that GOD is the enemy of satan)
SO sex outside of marriage is BORN!!!
So satan says to himself: "sex is good,,, lets make it evil by doing what is good in the unallowed context, therefore, it is sin against God!!!"
So is sex evil? No, it's pure. Is sex outside of marriage wrong,,, to GOD, yes.
BACK TO MUSIC, no music belongs to the devil as far as it's origian.
People who make music with lyrics, intents, and or results of evil are simply
taking something PURE and using it for evil.
Just like the middle finger. Is it a SPECIAL EVIL FINGER? No.
USED in a certain way, is it,,, yes.
God never says that a certain food, thing, or activity is evil in itself in his word OUTSIDE of the KOSHER LAW, which he used to show the captivity of the LAW which he later "DID AWAY WITH". The things that GOD defines as "the world" or "wordly" are ALL attitudes, mindsets, and actions or thoughts backed by ill motives. CHRIST IS AFTER THE HEART, not the surface or appearance.
When the guys from AC/DC played the RIFF from HIGH WAY TO HELL, where those NOTES, or THOSE RIFFS EVIL? NO. When they wrote the lyrics glorifying rebellion? Yes. (in Jesus eyes)
Are ALL magazines evil because someone decided to start putting PORN in them? NO! VHS cassets, DVD'S, BLUERAYS? NO!
So as for music of a certain type being evil. Come on.
That's ridicullous if you're trying to say that the GOD of the Bible thinks that a certain type of music is inherently evil.
That type of music that brings agression, is not sin. Is football sin because it's agressive? Coud football be looked at as a form of REBELION? sure, all just a matter of those LOOKING to define REBELLION, in something. (OPINION)
What about all the Symbols of scarry things, Bats, Spiders, Snakes, SKULLS, FLAMES, all NASTY LOOKING (to some) but all GOD made.
A GREAT WHITE SHARK, FREAKIN AMAZING!!!! MADE to VIOLENTLY KILL CUTE LITTLE BABY SEALS AND KEEP ON DOING IT TILL DEATH!!! FRIGHTENING POWER, AGRESSION, and PRIMAL INSTINCT!!!
Another creation of GOD.
Yes, if a Christian artist is trying to "act like evil, KINDA SORTA, to reach out and be godly" it's pathetic. Christ called us to be free and enjoy all that he made for us. ALSO to be like him, and He never tried to act like evil to win anyone over,,, but HI DID try to set people straight when they were being bound by the LIES of his enemy. satan.
The God who made, AWESOME LIGHTING, SEX, RAGING STORMS, MOLTENT HOT LAVA, FIRE, Space, Earthquakes, TOTALLY GNARLY THINGS IN THE WILD THAT KILL FOR FOOD, and THE GIFT OF MUSIC ITSELF!!!,,, if he didn't make metal than who did?
Is METAL TO AGRESSIVE for a God who makes things like this?? Remember has NO power to create anything.
If you care to see examples of agression based on GODS PROMPTING, look at david before he was King.
He REBELLED against the evil that was in the land. BY THE HOLY SPIRIT he killed a GIANT with a stone and CUT OFF HIS HEAD IN GOD HONORING BATTLE to defend the HONOR of God's holy name!! Moses was TOLD to rebel against pharo to free Gods people, THROUGH HIM, He sent PLAUGES OF DEATH AND DESTRUCTION!!!
Christians are to be like their master Christ.
1 John 3:8 He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. To this end the Son of God was revealed, that he might
DESTROY the works of the devil.
You wrote:
However, Christianity - especially modern American Evangelical Christianity - is rooted in a King James/Martin Luther flavor of Protestantism that is anything BUT rebellious.
YOu're right,,, what YOU'VE seen has been, but that's not like my master.
JESUS,, not rebelious? What about flipping over tables and driving people out,,, and COMANDING MIGHTY DEMONS TO FLEE?
Do MIGHTY DEMONS COWER under week people who can not appose their power? Do DEMONS TREMBLE at the sound of my name, yours?
(I'll list these referenses from the Bible if you like, just put it in your next reply)
NO, this is a GOD who APOSESS evil,,, like the flipping over of tables and driving out money changers in his Fathers house,
THAT IS THE SPIRIT of Christians who play WHAT GOD MADE TO GLORIFY HIMSELF. We're APPOSING the lie that Music, or SEX, or MONEY in themself are EVIL or belonging to the devil. It looks like we're trying to be like the world because so many ARE, it looks just as bad as the CRUSADES!!! EVIL under a good name.
No my friend, God's Children rebel against the prince of this world,, satan. I'm not going to go allong with the crowd because I'm scarred of a bunch of souls that don't even know what the bible actually says. I'm gonna follow my saviors example and DRIVE OUT those things that should not be,,, in this case, "driving out" practically means to play what GOD INTENDED FOR HIMSELF in a world that is trying to tell me that music (of any kind) can be attributed to satan.
They say "keep music evil" and I say, it never was evil, just like sex.
I think most people see a babtist church with a suit and tie pastor, over a church of 20 members that's all SONGY and happy with hymnals and such, and JUST ASSUME that Christ is boring, passive, week and lame.
Dude please don't take this as condisending,,, I'm NOT trying to get you upset,,, a lot get's lost in translation.
It's amazing, the things you find in the bible when you look for yourself, rather than take others EMPTY observations from affar. (not speaking of yours, but obviously those observations were not saught out in depth)
Romans 8
6The mind of sinful man is death, but the mind controlled by the Spirit is life and peace; 7the sinful mind is hostile to God. It does not submit to God's law,
nor can it do so. 8Those
CONTROLLED by the sinful nature cannot please God.,,, 13For if you live according to the sinful nature,
YOU WILL DIE (talking of the spiritual, eternal death) ; but if by the Spirit (meaning that NO MAN CAN DO IT WITHOUT GOD) you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live(speaking of ETERNAL LIFE)
THIS IS CHRIST REBELIOUS GOAL!!!
15For you did not receive a spirit that makes you
A SLAVE AGAIN TO FEAR, but you received the Spirit of sonship.
The Bible says that we are slaves to sin, and I'm sure that at some point in life you've seen some type of glympse of this as we all have if were being honest.
He desires us to be FREE, he has rebelled against OUR self induced CAPTIVITY!
I know it's long, I'm sorry.
thanks for listening. I'm glad you gave it a whirl.
Tony Parma
www.myspace.com/DITD1