General Music Chat

Okay, my pc is smarter than I am. I tried to get on here to respond hours ago, and eventually had to go in and change my password and all that junk.

Improv, the one thing I wanted to respond to is this: You said you wouldn't play with a set list. Essentially, you stated that you play for you, rather than playing all the same tired sh!t...

That's exactly the point that I was making...

*Your audience is the reason for your playing. You are there to entertain them. The fact that you get to perform in front of an audience (and maybe even get paid to do so) should be enough satisfaction. Unfortunately, it seems that musicians nowadays have to eat their cake and have it, too. The idea that your happiness comes BEFORE your audience is exactly what I'm talking about. That's why we are losing venues.
*Structure is paramount to performance...I don't care who you are. These days, mega-acts have EVERYTHING choreographed. THey leave nothing to chance. That's why they are successful. Again, it seems like putting that kind of work into a performance is, well, too much like work for the average musician...and it shows. I don't about you, but when I see a band on stage, discussing which song to do next, I head for the door. That band is there to entertain ME, not humor themselves.
The mentality of "make yourself happy, slop it together" is what is killing music scenes across the country.

You're misunderstanding me.. If you play what you love.. PEOPLE WILL COME. On top of that they'll keep coming because they want to hear you play X.. and you haven't played it in 30 shows.. but when you do bring it out.. THEY GO NUTS.. If they come tonight and here me play X song.. and come tomorrow and here me play X song.. eventually they'll stop going because they've seen it already. Thats why we have so many 1 hit wonders these days and why people will follow a band like Phish around the country.. because they dont want to miss a thing.

this topic was titled uninspired i'm trying to show you ways to bring inspiration to your playing.. I offered a suggestion.. Play without a setlist..

If you want to go out and play the same 15 or so songs every night so be it have fun.. to me thats uninspiring and it is no surprise you're bored. I could care less if you do it or not. To me there is more to music then money, fans, or anything else.. I do it because it pleases my soul and feels good and it gets me off.. If other people get off to it AWESOME, but i'm not gonna do something just to please other people..

The reason I started playing bass was for myself.. not to get rich or be famous.. you say i'm being selfish.. I say I'm being generous sharing something I love so much(playing my music) with you and if you enjoy it cool, if not the doors over there.

To the guy that asked me to post music.. Can't don't have the gear to hook up to my PC.. If you wanna come jam with me sometime you're more then welcome.. I came here in hopes I'd find a drummer that can keep a beat and lay down some funky licks in something besides a 4/4 and that had some interest in the same music I do.. Pretty much everything that doesn't suck.

Don't you have anything on CD , you can put in ITUNES and turn into mp3.

Somebody else help him out here please...Im trying to stop ww3.

Improgrooves, I gotta cut you a bunch of free passes because you barely posted a couple of things and allready you had a bunch critics jumping all over your butt. I hope you kept your legs crossed caused all they want is some shiiit.
Sorry man, just the way some men show us they are just boys .

Don't you have anything on CD , you can put in ITUNES and turn into mp3.

Somebody else help him out here please...Im trying to stop ww3.

i could care less what they're trying to do.. its the internets. I don't take it seriously.

First of all, Phish and TGD both suck.
Deadheads didnt care when they 'missed a beat' because they were all on shrooms.

The musicians may not suck, but as bands, they suck.

Now that we got that out of the way...


I save my improv for 'some' of my solos. I let the spirits take me, and I couldnt even tell you what I just played half of the time.
Mind of no mind.

Patrons, above all, want to see women shake their asses.
And they want something that they can either dance to, or let their frustrations and anger out with.

Its not a mystery why acdc and the stones are still playing shows 100 years after they started.
Its no mystery why Reggae bands go over so well in a live situation.

The funny thing about Smoke on the Water... its not so cheesey and easy anymore if you're playing lead guitar. (If your trying to cop it note for note).
Its fun.

I'm rambling...
Good day.

Hey guys we kind of got off the original topic. Improv or structured, Phish and Grateful Dead jambands or not, this is irrelevant to the topic. The topic is LIVE MUSIC IS DYING. I believe it has nothing to do with genres, structure, lack of structure, etc. It's all about the economy. It's all about what the economy will or will not bear. The venue owners are having an increasingly difficult time making a profit. There's too many regulations and fees they have to pay. People are having less and less money they can spend on entertainment. People are more scared of being pulled over for tougher and tougher DUI laws. The clubs that have been forced to become non-smoking clubs have lost a huge amount of business. Lawyers have their greedy and grubby hands in more and more of our business. If there's a remote chance for a lawsuit you can rest assured there's a vulture (lawyer) ready to pick at your carcass. As far as being inspired my main point of contention is the sad state of live music today. If I can't even earn the equivalent of minimum wage why even bother gigging? We have an excellent band. We receive nothing but compliments. But there's NO PLACE TO PLAY FOR ANY MONEY. Playing ANY genre at this point will not inspire me. Bands that are better than us (there are a few out there) are making next to nothing. The only thing right now I'm interested in is recording. I don't care if we make any money with it or lose money. If I can find enough excellent musicians who want to record and don't care about gigging for peanuts I would become inspired again. I've even been talking to a guitarist on the east coast about coming to K.C. and doing a CD together. Just about every guitarist in the K.C. area would rather make their meager lunch money and has no interest in creativity and recording. That's what I'm talking about. I'm not getting any younger. It's time to create and record. If there's no gigs worth a crap why bother...

As to the topic, it's bad all over. Karaoke, DJ's, DUI's, smoking bans, have all conspired to kill the live music scene. Of these, Karaoke is the worst offender. The audience is now the talent. They don't have to invest tons of money into gear, tons of time into rehearsal, or pay any dues. They just show up and they are a star. The bar owners love it, because it's cheap and brings in the crowds to hear little Janie sing.


Bars are not in the Live Music business. They are in the Booze Business. Think the music business is in bad shape? Ask a bar owner how his business is going.


I just have to comment on improvgrooves and his disdain for structure and setlists. He said the following:



“I wouldn't play in a band that used a setlist.. Just saying.. I like to get on stage and let it all hang out.. Including the songs we play.. Having a the ability to pull songs on the fly and create a UNIQUE SHOW every time out has to be the best way to play live music.”


“Not only that who gives a f**k what the patrons want.. play music for you.. and the people who like it will come.”


“There is so much more to music then playing the next freebird for some watered down budweiser.”



He ridicules the opinions of some people who have paid their dues, and yet, on his profile, he says:


“Just started playing.. I have been taking lessons for about 5-6 months, but i'm looking for something deeper.”



Have you ever actually played in a band? A club? A bar? Have you ever auditioned like a piece of meat, competing with other players/bands? Have you ever dragged your gear through the rain up six flights of stairs, played for four hours, only to be stiffed for your pay at the end of the night?



A lot of the problem with the music scene now is the attitude of many of the players. “Who gives a f**k what the patrons want?” The guy who's paying you, that's who. You won't find many pros with that attitude.



You are entitled to your opinion, though. I wish you luck with that.

For the last time improvegripes, Cobo is still here, no one tore it down, and concerts and events are held there all the time. Get your head out of the sand (or butt) and quit acting like a know it all. I've played over a thousand gigs, some of them improv, and the structured ones blow them away.

We have a gig in two weeks. We are rehearsing three hours a day, every day. Stuff we have played a million times.

Why?


Because a musician practices until he gets it right. A professional musician practices until he can't get it wrong.

During the Great Depression, musicians did rather well. It was a different world then, with a completely different mind set.

Now, it seems that our mad mothers, anti-smokers, & mechanized musical replacements have pretty much made us either unnecessary, or an outright danger to society, should we dare to bring ppl together to enjoy as a group.

Yes, it's a sorry state of affairs, & we've been fighting to merely exist for some time, now. Frankly, I'm glad my son isn't all that interested in performing, cuzza the state of the art these days. That's saying plenty, right there.

I dunno, folks, but I think it may just get worse when the cost of energy skyrockets.

I suppose there's still private parties...if anyone's still having them...

I'm pretty much giving up on the rose-colored glasses, these days, when it comes to this topic. Unless some laws get repealed (yeah, right!) I don't think anything's gonna be changing anytime soon. And with many schools driving to extinguish music from the curriculae, our future looks even bleaker...

There's a band in the K.C. area who are totally improv. They have no set list and just start playing. I'm not sure they attract any size of an audience but they have recorded a number of live CD's. I believe getting good at improv is the same as getting good at something structured. I personally couldn't be a good improv player. I enjoy planning a set list. But I can see that sometimes it would be fun, other times not. It IS a great way to create new songs. If you're into creating music and you record your improv shows (or rehearsals) you can come up with some great new tunes this way. Improv may be great for some and not others. The only thing that matters really is enjoyment. For me there has to be BOTH enjoyment and being reimbursed for a bunch of HARD WORK. Musicians these days are NOT being reimbursed for their hard work. We DO have a minimum wage in this country and I guess the attitude towards bands is that we are NOT working, therefore we don't have to be paid for what we do. I say bull*hit to that....

The repeating mantra in all of yalls posts is.. "I GOTTA GET PAID!"

last post here this place is a cesspool of shitties.. except for phil dudes got a clue.

Buh-bye. I could tell you wouldn't last long. Try using a little respect and humility next time.

Well...as far as that goes - I GOTTA GET PAID, TOO!!!!!

Don't get me wrong on that. Musicians' pay is the only one I can think of that has actually decreased over the years, & it pisses me off!

Bye-bye, Improv...don't take things so personally next time.

I seem to recal the crash starting to occur in the ninties.
what else happened in the nineties?
the boom of the world wide web.

the economy was pretty good in the ninties, or so I thought.
alternate forms of entertainment started to take off.

(stupid new phone... Can't figure out how to capitaliZe properly)