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#1106 by RhythmMan
Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:49 pm
I'm just wondering about something.
I've been using 6ths, 7th's, and 9ths for years now. I put up a post, the other day, looking for other musicians who know 6ths, 7th's, and 9ths.
I thought that almost all musicians knew, but maybe not . . . now I really don't know . . .
Someone brought it to my attention, that perhaps I'm expecting too much. Hmmmm . . .
So, heres the question:
Do YOU know the difference, either in fingering, or just the sound, of 6ths, 7th's, and 9ths?
With your reply, also mention what instrument you play, what kind of music, and your experience level.
This should be real interesting . . .

#1110 by Guest
Wed Jun 14, 2006 11:30 pm
I know the 6ths ,7ths & 9th's. I am a studio musican and i play guitar and keys.

#1129 by RhythmMan
Fri Jun 16, 2006 4:26 am
Hey, JR.
Do you have any preference? I know it depends upon the song, but what types of chords do you like playing (on guitar) most?

#1133 by RhythmMan
Fri Jun 16, 2006 4:19 pm
Belle - yeah this discussion is better here.
I always pretty much figured that so many songs are in G, C, & D because of the human vocal range.
I guess it's mostly the blues-type songs that favor the 6ths, 7ths, and 9ths. Mostly 7ths, and then the 9ths, I guess . . .
In my various songs, you'll find (roughly) a lot of these chords:
A7, A9
B6, B7, B9
C, C7
D, D9
E6, E7, E9
F6, F7, F9
G6, G7, G9
Translate that into the sharps & flats . . . .
Also, I use some unusual fingering for the 'standard' chords - the three- fingered "A" on the 9th fret, for example.
And many other, uncommon chords . . .
I don't often find myself writing 'standard' chords into my songs much, anymore. Not when there are so many other delicious 'flavors' available!
With some of the chords I have found, either accidentaly or through research, I sometimes write songs that I can't even play, - at least, not without 2-3 weeks of practice.
That's how we learn. We have to challenge ourselves, huh?
I don't always write songs that I can just pick up a guitar & play. I write some songs that force me to learn new stuff.
Anytime I start to think I know what I'm doing, I'll look for a new chord that takes me a LONG time to finger - and write it into a fast song.

#1282 by RhythmMan
Wed Jun 28, 2006 3:57 pm
This post has been up for over 2 weeks (as of 6-28-06), and now over 100 people have seen it.
Of the 100 people that have seen it, only 2 responded.
That's 2 out of 50 musicians that claim familiarity with 6ths, 7ths, and 9ths, - or 4%.
One out of 25? I can't believe that - more people than that must use 6ths, 7ths, 9ths . . . at least once in a while, maybe, yes?
Do the people who have seen this not know about them, or are they just not bothering to reply?
Whatever . . .

#1295 by RhythmMan
Thu Jun 29, 2006 3:37 am
Thank you.
There IS hope for civilization! (I take no insult from your words, my friend.) I too, think 6ths, 7th,s and 9ths are basic. I just don't want to come across as a 'music snob.'
I really do like almost all types of music.
It's just, as the years go by, - I get bored hearing the exact same progressions over and over and over, in 'different' songs.
I have used hundreds of different chords in my music. I've referenced many sources to find new chords. I've found perhaps 30 chords by experimenting, just trying to reproduce the sounds in my head . . .
Ted Green's "Chord Chemistry" has a few thousand chords listed . . .
Nice piece of work . . .
I've written down about 6-7 pages of chords whose sound I like, merely awaiting the right song to come around . . .
When I use a new chord in a song, I cross it off the list. Eventually, I'll find out what it's called . . .
But - being a master of theory is NOT my desire.
As long as I can keep writing songs with new and different sounds, I'm happy.
I don't want to be a professor - I just want to play good original music.
I have no formal studies of music, but when I make a song, I sometimes need to experiment and seach for the right sound - a SLIGHTLY different chord. I've tried several unlikely fingerings, all over the neck, before (usually) coming across the perfect chord (for that one spot in the song).
When I find the right sound, I use it, record it and write it down. It's often not until several months later that I take the time to actually reasech the chord to see what it IS, either by picking it apart, or looking it up.
If I get too hung up on theory, it can interupt the creatice process, and the new song I'm working on can be lost.
(and, I'm ALWAYS working on 3-4 new songs). :)
I've got to translate the sound in my head into chords, right away.
I hope others will also experiment, and look at the chord charts.
There are hundreds of "crummy" sounding chords that sound GREAT, when you know the right place to play them.
To the musicians reading this:
Challenge yourself. Find a chord that you NEVER, NEVER use, and write it into a good -sounding song.

#1342 by BillyRich
Sat Jul 01, 2006 3:06 pm
I'm also one of those guys who's been playing for "decades". I mostly play by ear, but can read music when I have to. Before this internet thang, you had to really listen to a song to pick out the "right" chord.

That's how I learned stuff like Rocky Top, Wheels, Walk Don't Run & Pipeline, Something & While My Guitar Gently Weeps, California Dreamin', Classical Gas, Friday on My Mind, Colour My World & '25 or 6 to 4', Time In A Bottle & Operator, Dream On & Walk This Way, Allman Bros 'Rambling Man', Play That Funky Music, Dust in the Wind, Carry on My Wayward Son, Lights, Flirtin' With Disaster (now that lead's a tuffy!), Foolin' & Hysteria, Crazy Train & Mama I'm Comin' Home, Under The Bridge (City of Angels), Lonestar's 'Amazed', Santana / Thomas 'Smooth', Love Me When I'm Gone & Here Without You. I listed those songs because they cover about 40 years & all have interesting chord progressions &/or solos. (Or I just plain like the song, haha!)

It used to be that maybe you could get lucky and see the guitarist hit that chord on a video or live. You could always buy the sheet music, but the standard chord is often shown, which just doesn't sound like the actual recorded chord. (A lot of musicians are very guarded about their own "special" chords.)

Now there are lots of sites out there on the internet that show the tabs of many songs. Many of these are free. I go to these for learning songs where special tuning is used (open C, D, Drop D, etc.) I think you'll find it easier to learn your 6, 7 ,9s, etc., once you get all the basic open / barre chords down. Since chords can be played in multiple neck locations / configurations. So just find the one that sounds the best.

Then practice, practice, practice. You'll find by learning a wide variety of songs, the chords start to sound familiar. Take Sheryl Crow's 'All I Wanna Do Is Have Some Fun'. That song sounds an awful lot like Stealers Wheel's 'Stuck In The Middle With You' recorded 20 years earlier! She has a talent for reworking 60's & 70's style music into "new" tunes. Point is that if you learn some of the older basic stuff, that will give a good foundation for newer music, or writing your own music. You'll also learn all the chord variations you desire along the way. :shock:

#1343 by RhythmMan
Sat Jul 01, 2006 3:15 pm
Hey, Monkey68,
Yeah no rules - it just has to fit, and sound good.
You can use them for connecting cords, but you can also use them as the main chord.
It's a neat trick to string together a series of sad, or 'blah'-sounding chords, and then, through careful arrangement - end up with an upbeat, happy-sounding song.
Just to remind you of where I'm coming from: I don't worship these chords. I had posted an ad looking for musicians who at LEAST knew the 6th, 7ths, and 9ths.
I use hundreds of chords in my music. I mean that literaly, not figuratively.
But someone brought it to my attention that I might have a hard time finding musicians that could play these rudimentary chords.
So I - we - have been trying to get an idea of what kind of experience the other musicians on this site have accumulated.

#1344 by RhythmMan
Sat Jul 01, 2006 3:34 pm
Hey, Billy Rich,
You've been playing for decades, eh? Your profile says you're 18!
But from your words, I can see that you probably have been playing for decades. Hmmm . . . maybe I should change my profile to read 18, too . . . I'm 53 - or was that 35? 25?
Hey -
You know when you have a guitar leaning against the wall or something, and someone makes a sound which resonates in that guitar across the room?
That's what happened w/me when I read your post. There was a resonance.
I, too had learned many of thoses same songs by listening to the song. Usually I can figure them out instantly. But some of the songs have a better fingering, and it can take quite a while to find it.
And I also have learned songs from the books. MAN, THAT can be a big, dissapointing mistake!
When you play the song back along with the original, it's all different. It sounds like it was re-written by a 9 - 5 hack in an office cubical.
Or worse yet, it's re-written in a different key.
I'd rather not talk about all the "originals" out there which are, indeed, modified older songs, with new words.
But - it's nice talking with people who have been around long enough to know what they're talking about.
Thanks for your post.

#1350 by RhythmMan
Sun Jul 02, 2006 3:18 am
Thanks guys.
I needed that. :)
It's like a breath of fresh air. :)
Anyone else got some thoughts about any of this?

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