General Music Chat

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My solo gig I am doing quite a few originals, and they change nightly on the spot to fit the mood at the time..

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Music is emotion, huh? I love performing solo originals, where I can change the emotion of a song on a whim . . .
Basically - just doing what I do most nights anyway . . . just sharing it . . .
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Yeah, Craig, you're right: I'm pretty specific with who I'll work with, now.
Used to be that I'd pretty much play with anybody.
But now, with less time available, - I can't be squandering any of it . . .
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I have noticed a funny side effect to my being choosey about who I'll work with . . . over the last few years, my friends and associates have all become really good guys, or good women.
Dunno why . . .

I have a gig coming up at Borders Books with the Orange County Flute Choir Rehearsals are a must because of the precision that is required.
We also make instrument switches and seating changes. But, I have another gig coming up where I am performing for the Philharmonic music club. I am a soloist wnd will have at least one rehearsal, possibly 2. It is all music we have performed before, we would just be reviewing old stuff. Now, I have another accompanist that I worked with and we rarely rehearsed. We were able to just bounce off each other and he was the best sightreader I think that I have ever met. Sometimes, we would just sight read some of our show's selections.

But for the best quality performance nothing beats good rehearsals. Plus, I only work with people that I like.

Well, after yesterday's lousy rehearsal, I FINALLY got the guys to agree that this bluegrass guy is NOT gonns fit into our program!

The really good news is that there's another guy in the wings, who looks quite good to me. I've jammed with him once before, & he's not only a
good player, but can sing pretty well, too, which will help with our harmonies.

On the down side, my damned ear-aches started up again last night. After a sleepless night of agony, I'm in a quandry as to what to do. Doctors just gimme anitbiotics for this. They never seem all that interested in SOLVING THE DAMNED PROBLEM. Antibiotics ruin my guts. The last batch I had gave me the runs for...well...it's going on 9 months, now. (Sorry if that's TMI, but I'm a frustrated guy at this point!) I will not go through more of that sh*t again (pun intended). i'll shut up about that now...sorry I brought it up, really.

Anyway, I haven't told the bluegrass guy yet, & I think I'll hold off until I'm sure that the new guy is fitting in. The reason for this is that, while its rough working with someone who can't seem to be able to catch on, it's good to keep the 3 of us going & keeping our chops up. We've all become better at holding onto a tempo in spite of the bluegrasser's attempts at speeding us up or otherwise altering things, like simple chord progressions & arrangements. Maybe it's making the 3 of us better in spite of our lil stumbling block. We DO seem to have tightened up quite a bit over the last 3 months, if only between the 3 of us.

RhythmMan- Absolutely, rehearsal is a great time to cut loose and experiment with things you wouldn't dare touch at a gig. My band also could pull off songs at the drop of a hat that we've never done before, it's not that rare when everyone is a 20+ year veteran, and at the same time (Craig!), we've BRICKED songs live that we just didn't rehearse or play in a while.

You can and will easily forget arrangements and bridges if you stop rehearsing a song, and even if everyone practices by themselves at home, there's just too much to go wrong in a group setting, especially on the stale(r) songs.

I also disagree that cover-bands can lower the bar because they ain't going anywhere.. almost every famous band today started as a cover band. Sure, it's a changed landscape, but coastal bands that tour all summer long and tribute bands tend to be full time musicians who ARE making a living off playing covers!

Why bullshit your way through anything? It's not worth doing if you don't care enough to do it right.

Well, after yesterday's lousy rehearsal, I FINALLY got the guys to agree that this bluegrass guy is NOT gonns fit into our program!

The really good news is that there's another guy in the wings, who looks quite good to me. I've jammed with him once before, & he's not only a
good player, but can sing pretty well, too, which will help with our harmonies.

On the down side, my damned ear-aches started up again last night. After a sleepless night of agony, I'm in a quandry as to what to do. Doctors just gimme anitbiotics for this. They never seem all that interested in SOLVING THE DAMNED PROBLEM. Antibiotics ruin my guts. The last batch I had gave me the runs for...well...it's going on 9 months, now. (Sorry if that's TMI, but I'm a frustrated guy at this point!) I will not go through more of that sh*t again (pun intended). i'll shut up about that now...sorry I brought it up, really.

Anyway, I haven't told the bluegrass guy yet, & I think I'll hold off until I'm sure that the new guy is fitting in. The reason for this is that, while its rough working with someone who can't seem to be able to catch on, it's good to keep the 3 of us going & keeping our chops up. We've all become better at holding onto a tempo in spite of the bluegrasser's attempts at speeding us up or otherwise altering things, like simple chord progressions & arrangements. Maybe it's making the 3 of us better in spite of our lil stumbling block. We DO seem to have tightened up quite a bit over the last 3 months, if only between the 3 of us.

Philbymon, make sure that you have your vitamin D levels checked. I bet they're deficient. Also add coconut oil to your diet...sounds crazy but I am speaking from experience. I could add other things but they are too crazy!

That is a good point. Rehearsals do reveal who can handle the job and who can't.

Earache my eye!

Sorry phil, I couldn't resist. Did get you some info though, read this page, it might just help.

http://www.organicauthority.com/health/ ... -home.html

Mary - as much time as I spend outside without wearing sunglasses, I suspect my D levels are pretty good.

Billy - thanks, man. I've been using some of these without success over the years, but there is some new stuff I haven't tried in there. I'm dreading the coming night, cuz it's far from over. I get these a lot.

Now get your little fanny perpendicular and get ready for school!

Try duckin that Frisbee Phil ?

Just a little humor ( very little ) Not meaning to make light of the situation. Oral and or ear pain really suck, partly because it's so hard to treat.
Have you ever seen a chiroprator or acupuncturest?

I know this guy whom knows a guy that may help.
I'll keep you in mind when I talk to him again.

As I sit here with a garlic clove in my ear (yes, I'm REALLY doing that!) I feel more than a little foolish, but if it works, I won't feel foolish at all.

I've had more than my fair share of these. No, sans, I haven't seen a chiropractor or acupuncturist for this. I have seen reg docs innumerable times, & a homeopathic guy gave me some stuff that wouldn't work in the immediate, like I needed. This really is a pretty bad thing to get so often, though, & it puts me out of commission way too much when it does hit me. I actually had some work to do today & couldn't.

This garlic feels kinda strange. A little burny. Wheee! Maybe it's workin'!

Sorry...didn't mean to kidnap the thread...back to our regular programming...

Practice is too important to slide on. In JW's situation it works, cuz the ppl involved DO practice on their own, & are used to playing together enough to pick up on each other's cues, kinda like me & Dddonnie. Our new guy couldn't or wouldn't catch on by himself, so we'll hafta let him go eventually. (I honestly think it's a result of the accident he had that hurt his brain. Damned shame, but I can't work with the handicapped in this area, ya know? It still makes me feel a little bad though.)

I seem to catch the best posts when they are teetering on going out of control...no offense, guys, I just wanted to put in my two cents on the OP.

Now I forget what I was going to say...

No, seriously, I've seen the same situation first hand more times than I care to count. Hell, the main reason I just left my last band was because ONE guy decided that we needed to continually change things up: At rehearsal, on stage, etc. Keep in mind that this band (of which I spent a year) was notoriously bad at learning new material. The idea of changing anything-even the KEY of a song mere DAYS before a show was ridiculous. They couldn't handle it.
I guess what I'm trying to add in here is that NOTHING beats a polished performance. Nothing. I've seen guys that could think on their feet and come up smelling like a rose (excuse the mixed metaphor), and while I applaud those folks, I simply don't believe it to be a key to success. Why not eliminate the possibility of a major cluster f*ck in front of an audience? Everyone makes mistakes, sure, but that not an excuse to half ass your performance. I believe Craig used the phrase "good enough". I don't even let those words into my rehearsals.
I watched a youtube vid of one of my heroes, Dennis DeYoung, talking about songwriting. He said the key to it was not fooling yourself. Sometimes you have to listen to what you are doing and say "this is just bullsh!t."
I believe that the same process applies to live performance. Taking shortcuts, not rehearsing, even improvising to an extent cheats your audience of recieving your best work (and, no, I am not a fan of Jazz).

Now I'm the long winded one. To answer your question, Bob, musicians are (in general) lazy S.O.B.s.

Well, in defense of bob's mates, they are gigging a lot more lately.

Some ppl (I'm as guilty as the rest in this area) figger that, when you're gigging a lot, but not adding a lot of material, you're already getting your time in. If you wanna add new material, then JW's way might work, or it might not. Best to discover that off-stage in the rehearsal space, provided you can get everyone in there at one time.

Some family members will start to get upset over the time spent with the band away from the family. This causes strife that can be overcome if the band members will work on stuff alone, & get the new material set in stone, say, once a month or somesuch. There are compromises that can be reached, often, that benefit everyone once a band gets busier, provided everyone's willing to do the work.

Psst- good to see ya still checking up on us, Joseph.

its rough working with someone who can't seem to be able to catch on . . . holding onto a tempo in spite of the bluegrasser's attempts at speeding us up or otherwise altering things . . . .

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Philby - I'm telling you, man - do yourself a favor, and stop calling him to rehearsals.
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I went through that exact same thing w/ a bluegrasser . . .
But . . .
The stuff I play has extremely exacting and unusual rhythms. When he played along with me, he kept starting each measure 1/32 beat faster, and shortened the following mesure by 1/32 of a beat . . in a few words - yeah, he sped up, too, continually.
And other guys joined in, and sped up right along with him.
I kept telling him, but each and every song ended twice as fast as it started.
He had very limited experience with rhythms . . . what I'd expect of a 5th grader . . .
When an intricate rhythm is at - say 105 bpm or 110 bpm, and a bunch of buffons speed the tempo up to 130 bmp - the rhythm has to drop things out.
What a royal pain in the rear . . . I had to leave all the fine points out of the song, or it couldn't be played . . .
RUINED my songs.
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If you practice with people that bad - you will start picking up bad habits, and, although you may not notice it, your playing will suffer . . .
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I heard a good saying the other day . . .
"When you wallow with pigs, expect to get dirty." Work with him for 1 year, and you might lose 1 year's amount of experience.
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Life's too short, man . . .

You're undoubtedly right, Alan.

I think the biggest problem with bluegrassers in the area of tempo is that the banjo sets the time - no drums. He gets his fingers just a-flying over those strings, &, before you know it, everything is cooking like a runaway train. Then, when the mandolin gets that super-fast strum going, it gets even faster...

The drummer & I set up a metronomic tempo yesterday, & Dddonnie & the guitarist had one hell of a time keeping to it. Dddonnie, as the singer, has a tendency to rush certain phrases, & it can really speed things up when those phrases are the chorus, for example, & you speed up on every one. I've been a real nazi about holding him back, but it doesn't always work...& there are certain little things I do that can speed things up, too. I'm not perfect, by any stretch of the imagination...

Yesterday I turned the guitarist's amp way up, so it pretty much cut through everything, so the guys could hear what I've been dealing with as I stand by him. I've been complaining for 10-12 weeks that we sound like 2 or 3 different acts all playing at the same time. Well, yesterday they could finally hear what I've been talking about, & although he's got some pretty good licks, this new guy just can't stay with us for any length of time.

After he left, we listened to the rehearsal tapes, & omg! I can't believe that I kept the tempo going for as long as I did, frankly...(I'm kinda proud of that, but damn it was too much effort & it still ended up sounding muddy as sh*t!)

Dddonnie, who has been the holdout on this guy more than anyone else, had to agree that he must go. I think his comment was "I'm getting old & I don't have that kind of time to get it together." LOL

When I worked with that bluegrass band a few years ago, I was the guy that held them all back, & they noticed & appreciated it. It made their music much better than it's been since I left. Part of their prob, I think, is that the new guy has a stand-up bass that just doesn't cut through, even if he WAS on time like a metronome (which he isn't, btw).

I'm amazed at the number of bassists I see that just kinda wander around the beat. I can't get close to that style, when I play. I'm more of a thump thump fellow that adds in counterpoint beats, triplets & 16th notes where I feel it fits, but I'm almost always there on the one.

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The garlic blue tooth seems to be working, btw! The pressure has really lessened. I hope I can get some sleep tonight! Wonder how this works...

philbymon, if you're going to be teaching the guys you work with - make sure you get paid for it . . .

Kramer,

About most bands being cover bands before making it big...

I just don't believe that is true, but I can't be sure, since I've never done a survey. But most bands that make it, that I am aware of, are ORIGINAL bands and not cover bands. Individually, they may have all had cover band experiences, but that is not where they "made it" from. They were original bands, that had spent time and effort writing their own music, and developing their own sound, and when discovered, it is THAT SOUND they had spent months and years working on, that got them their break. They already had their sound, and enough originals to select from, for an album of material or more.

I don't disagree that there would be exceptions. There are almost always exceptions to anything, but I don't see it as a rule. When you spend most of your time, trying to imitate other bands (playing covers as the original artists played them) then you are investing your energies in sounding like some other band, not really developing your own style and your own originals.

I do agree with you about tribute bands.

But even there, the ones I know, (that are big) practice alot and have worked and sacrificed to get where they are. Now, after they are nationally known (as some tribute bands become) then yes, they may be able to afford to slack off a little, since, KISS for example, is not coming out with any more hit songs. Meaning, that once you have perfected all of KISS' songs, and you are a KISS cover band, really... what else is there to do? Other than stay tuned up, which a regular touring band could do simply from playing 250 shows a year anyway.

But in the beginning, I am sure, they were sacrificing and busting their asses to become KISS (or whoever) incarnate.

But lowering the bar.... I didn't mean to be offensive about that. Just that when you are a cover band, what is really driving the band? Generally speaking, you aren't going to headline huge venues as a cover band (except tribute bands that are nationally known).

The headliners are almost always, going to be famous or mid-level original bands, that have HUGE followings, and are very well known, even if mostly in a 1 to 3 state circuit.

Wedding bands though?

Maybe they are an exception? They are cover bands, that can bring in big bucks. But I imagine it is mostly the band leader raking in the cash, whereas the musicians probably make scale or a little better. I don't know that you can live off that comfortably. You're talking mostly weekend work, and maybe $200 or $250 a night for two nights.

I know I can't live into old age off $500 bucks a week.

An original band on the other hand, may share in the merch and CD sales and everything else.

What I know, is that it is VERY DIFFICULT for a cover "band" to make it in a decent fashion. Any industry person seeing a cover band, will NOT think "Man, those guys sound exactly like Metallica, on that Metallica song they are playing! I better sign them right now!"

There is already a Metallica.

Sounding exactly like Metallica (which is what a good cover band will do) is going to accomplish nothing more than eliciting the comment...

"Damn, they sound JUST LIKE Metallica don't they?"

No industry person has the time or patience to wait around for the occassional original song, to decide if that "band" is original enough and has good enough material to take a chance on. They need to walk into that room cold, and be blown away by a solid band with an original sound, playing original after original, and many of those originals already sounding like radio fare.

What THEY WILL do however, is say to themselves...

"Holy Crap, that lead singer has amazing pipes and great stage presence. But he's wasting his talent in this cover band!"

And he will offer that girl or guy a deal... "Leave the band and we'll sign you. Let us put a winning band around you, with good songwriters, and you may make it. Interested?"

Not only do I know this is how they operate, but I know it first hand, as my mother was TWICE offered deals, if she would leave her band behind. She wouldn't do it.

Maybe she should have?

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