General Music Chat

I scan the profiles for my area every day in case someone new has shown up. I don't bother looking at the profile if they don't have a picture of them playing, or at least used something beside the generic pictures BM makes available. And if no music is posted ... bye-bye....

I know I've got to do the serious searching work myself because the people who are searching aren't reading.
Two contacts in the last few days - one here, band looking for an electric guitarist (it says right in my profile I'm looking for 'mostly acoustic') and one through craigslist - a solo player, when I have modified by ad to show I'm only looking for a duo or band looking for another player. last night at an open mic, a guitarist I know tried to hook me up with a guy who came with him, but I stopped him cold, explained - starting a duo from scratch is just too much work at this point for me - already wasted too many hours on too many people.

Mike, please don't take this as a criticism as much as an observation, ok? I really am only trying to help.

But you do seem to live on negative assumptions. I know you will respond by saying you're only being realistic, pragmatic, etc....

Yet you seem to expect disappointment and let-down in every situation. Is that a defense mechanism to avoid the pain of failure? Is that a way of shifting blame? Is it a way of avoiding an honest assessment of where you are? You don't have to answer this publicly but I wonder if you've ever asked yourself why you expect disappointment?

How do you know this guy was going to be a waste of time? For all you know, you may not be able to keep with his level of commitment for a great duo.

And the guy from Memphis who answered the "soul" band in California. Your response to him was "dude they're in California" like that is a limitation for someone?

You know what the biggest success stories in history have in common? They all failed several times before they succeeded! So I guess what I'm getting at is that you ought to look at every situation as a completely new one, without coloring it by past disappointments. You could choose to see every challenge as an opportunity, instead of only seeing the same drudgery it was in previous experiences. Failure is only failure if you don't learn from it. (not saying you're a failure, just hoping to show a different perspective on it)

Try going into your future by expecting greatness every time and looking for the hidden treasures in a less-than-obviously-bad situation. Try going into every partnership with the knowledge that every band has an end, yet also with an expectation that things will get better because of the time you have worked on it.

Just because things are the way they are, does not mean that is how they must stay.

Not that you need my advice....just an observation of what I hear from you over the years.



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Ted - I have wasted entirely too much of my precious time left on this earth with people who were not compatible with me - that I gave the chance to, even though they had no music online, or professed they wanted to do what I was looking to do. Could the 'magic right person' come along, sure, but you may have missed the statement that I am no longer looking to do the duo thing - its just too much work to start from scratch.
I'm long past the point of 'expecting greatness' - music for me has got to bring some kind of happiness - the 'fun element' - I'd like to make a little money to support this hobby, but its not a career for me (like with you), which Is why, I suspect you think your view on my life choices is not 'always looking on the brighter side'.

As to that guy from Memphis - brand new to bandmix, no music posted on his profile, and probably didn't even notice that the OP on that thread was in California. If you read his profile, you would have seen he was looking for people in the Memphis area ... Most players these days don't pick up and move 2000+ miles to audition for an oldies band!

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Mike- yes, it is a LOT of work to start from scratch but this is my approach (take it for what it's worth). The other person says 'yeah, that's right up my alley!!' That is what I'm looking for. Someone w/ the same concepts you have. Then you lay it all on the table.

...If you are not having fun, don't do it. But I'm having a blast!!

That's exactly how I started with everyone of the last 6 guys, Jook! Then they all flake out on me - and just to be clear, they all had the chance to "pre-audition" me, because I send links to my online tunes and videos, my 300+ song songlist. If they don't like how I play/sing, they got the chance to bow out before it even got started.
I could list why a few were not compatible, but mostly its that they won't put in the time. The last guy - we had 20 songs on the list already, each had 3-5 songs that other one knew to practice for the next time we got together. He cancelled rehearsal (on the day of) twice in 4 weeks - ok, I know things come up - then when he does show up hasn't practiced any of the new songs, only brings one guitar ... His excuse for not continuing (before I could say 'its not working') it was too far to drive to practice - when he knew from the start that he lived 25 miles from me - and he was retired, so it wasn't as if he had work to schedule around ... But that's a typical scenario of the guys I have tried to play with for the last 2+ years.

While Mike may have more than his fair share of negativism--I prefer to describe it as cynicism--there's something to what he's saying. When you're much younger it's easy to start from scratch again and again, but at some point, you get tired of it (esp. if you need to lug around a hefty piano, amp, etc.). And if there's anything true in life, it's that you can never count on what others might do.

At the same time, when there's a reasonable expectation--based on the proven ability of the musicians--that a band can develop a good sound, I get annoyed when guys don't want to put in the time and effort. My experience (at least in Tampa) has been that guys will sit in for a hour--playing the same simplistic 3-chord tunes everyone else is playing (does the world really need more bands to play Mustang Sally?)--then start to talk about booking gigs. The cynic in me wonders why, if that's what you want to do, you don't just join up w/ any of the many bands that are already doing that. I get bored playing that stuff. I can recall, back in the day, getting sleepy--on stage--to the point of drifting off while playing blues all night. I'm sure some blues aficionado will take me to task for that statement, but let's face facts: playing I-IV-V7 all night (pick a key...any key) can get pretty dull after a while. At least that's been my experience.

I need to play interesting music, stuff that no one else is doing--stuff that holds my attention--and it takes some work to get it right--these aren't your well-worn 3-chord tunes. Someone will likely point out no one is playing that stuff 'cause no one wants to hear it, and that might be true. But my experience in Tampa has been that guys who could do it (discounting the guys who just don't have the chops) just won't put in the time to develop their sound. If you're willing to put in the work and do it well, it's like P-guy said: they will come. Either way, I'd rather do free gigs playing interesting music than get paid $100/night for playing Mustang Sally, etc. While I'm not rich, my life isn't about the almighty dollar.

So while I can kinda agree w/ what Mike is saying, at the same time, I'd be willing to start from scratch w/ some guys who a) have the ability, and b) are willing to put in the work. Unfortunately, there don't seem to be guys down here who fit those requirements.

yes DP, but at least you and Mike live in large metropolitan centers.. try finding musicians in Half Way, Mo. I sometimes wish I lived in a major metropolitan center again, because when I did, I never had a problem finding gig-ready top echelon musicians to work with.. well, in Orlando I did not work with anybody but was burnt out at the time..

I am 57 years old and have no problem doing what ever it takes to play out have fun and am now making some VERY good $ playing out. All I'll say is if you want to be successful playing music and I use the term "successful" very subjectively, you have to be above all else flexible. If both parties are unwilling to be flexible it won't work for long. I have found most folks our age have been musicians all their lives or wanted to be but had different priorities, college, family, living life. A percentage of the latter think they want to do it until they realize how much work is involved and then wimp out! With all due respect Mike you sound a bit inflexible. Perhaps the let downs you have experienced have jaded you?

yes DP, but at least you and Mike live in large metropolitan centers..

True, Dayne--that's what makes it so frustrating. Large metro area, lotsa musicians, but still...

A percentage...think they want to do it until they realize how much work is involved and then wimp out!

Bingo! Or they realize they won't be playing those lucrative gigs for a while just yet...and then wimp out.

We all go through disappointments and letdowns from other band members. We ought to go into every band knowing that it's going to break up, and just try to enjoy the time we've got.

Guess all I'm saying is that it can become a self-fulfilling prophecy if you go into an opportunity with the expectation that it's only going to be a hassle. Every band, every relationship in life is a hassle to some degree so it becomes a matter of what you're willing to tolerate to move forward.
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We all go through disappointments and letdowns from other band members. We ought to go into every band knowing that it's going to break up, and just try to enjoy the time we've got.

we're in year TWENTY FIVE playing as Planet Jazz. Mere Mortals is 11 yrs....and this fall makes 4 yrs playing at the truckstop w The 121's. Before my friend Val moved out of state we'd been playing together 20 yrs.

(how the hell these people put up w me that long I have no stinking idea!)

Every band, every relationship in life is a hassle to some degree so it becomes a matter of what you're willing to tolerate to move forward.

i do agree w that. afterall....what in life ISN'T a compromise????

as far as big mkts vs. small.....there are advantages and disadvantages to both. i worked pretty steady when i lived in NYC but face it ....my digs since '84, Mid MO.... it's a pretty small mkt w fewer players to hook up with. i suppose luck has something to do w it....but i believe there's more to it as well.

it can be done. you just have to keep your eye on the prize and continue plugging away if that's what you want. and if you want it bad enough.

Thanks for keeping my post alive. Anyone got any response to my first post? Accordion? Banjo? Bagpipes?

I am 57 years old and have no problem doing what ever it takes to play out have fun and am now making some VERY good $ playing out. All I'll say is if you want to be successful playing music and I use the term "successful" very subjectively, you have to be above all else flexible. If both parties are unwilling to be flexible it won't work for long. I have found most folks our age have been musicians all their lives or wanted to be but had different priorities, college, family, living life. A percentage of the latter think they want to do it until they realize how much work is involved and then wimp out! With all due respect Mike you sound a bit inflexible. Perhaps the let downs you have experienced have jaded you?

Jeff - I stayed flexible long enough! It didn't get me anything but 2+ years of wasted time.

'Cynical'? 'Negative'? I say to anyone wanting to play with me, prove me wrong.

I'm sure I told you about the guy who came over (for the acoustic duo thing) with an electric (no warning) asking if I had an amp he could plug into. Said he 'daughter had his acoustic'. He had pointed me to a youtube of him playing with a band - impossible to tell what, if anything he was playing in the band, but I gave him a chance. he could barely muddle through any of the songs he said he knew. A couple of days later he sent me an email and wanted a 'second chance', invited me over to his house, we decided to work on 6 songs that he picked out and said he knew. I hadn't played 3 of them before, but learned them all. go over there, find out 'his daughter has his acoustic' again. And all he really wanted was for me to help him set up his new recording gear.
So, yeah, I'll be cynical, and negative rather than waste any more of my time.
I'm practicing for the one-off benefit show now with a girl singer/player I've known for years - she's not one for doing much prep work on her own (would drive me crazy full time in a band), but she's a good singer, and for one night, we'll still do well. And the other group - same guys I've done this with for 6 years now are all pro and it's always fun and good, too.