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#211552 by ssemble
Wed Apr 10, 2013 11:14 am
Does anybody else out there find this celebrity driven crap that oozes into our lives now unbearably irritating, whether it's nonsensical soap's, reality shows or music culture.

I don't actually watch or listen to them but still they creep into our lives involuntarily.

The young seem to be so malleable in their acceptance.

I know every decade has had it's crap but the the last 10 have surpassed the previous 100...

#211556 by Jahva
Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:19 pm
I feel you brother and agree... the problem (if it is one) lies in the youth of today. They are the ones sucked into this crap. Most older folk make fun of this garbage or beckon for the days of Vinyl.
Teach your children well... have an influence on those closest to you. That's where the answer lies. imo

#211557 by gbheil
Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:37 pm
It's not necessarily age related.

I know hundreds of modern "country western" zombies my age or even older.

My eldest son ( now 18 ) listens to nothing but classical music and plays in a local symphony.

Many people are just simple when it comes to music / entertainment in general.

Just like I'd rather spend a day at the shooting range, hunting, or canoeing a calm lake, than drop a dime in Vegas or Disney.

#211568 by jimmydanger
Wed Apr 10, 2013 1:21 pm
If you want broad appeal you do have to cater to the lowest common denominator among your potential audience. If you don't care about "success" just do what you love and people that love what you do will give you support, it just may not be a throngs of people. But I would take 100 people who really love me and what I do over thousands who love a calculated product that I designed to make maximum profit from.

#211581 by DainNobody
Wed Apr 10, 2013 2:16 pm
hey OP, are you referring to stuff like Justin Timberlake's "Suit & Tie" ?.. I love that tune..

#211613 by fisherman bob
Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:57 pm
I believe every generation is horrified to one degree or another what their children are into musically. Just look at the radical shift in musical mainstream tastes in the 1960's, starting with do-op and early rock and roll (Elvis Presley for example) and ending with Led Zeppelin. My parents were into big bands, bossa nova, Frank Sinatra, etc.and I was big into Queen! Who knows what will be considered mainstream each decade and the various reactions by people to what's considered pop.
The one thing I can't stand today is turning rank amateurs who haven't paid any dues, like American Idol and The Voice, and turning them into superstars, when all they are doing is glorified karaoke. Kind of makes me want to puke.

#211627 by PaperDog
Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:45 pm
Nobody gives a sh*t what you me or anybody else has to say musically. From the 40's to the 60's audiences seemed to operate on some common consensus and value. As such, it made it easier for an artist to tap into 'what the audience wanted' All That sh*t got anihilated when everybody woke up from their party comas in the 70's.

The reason YOU will never become famous world wide,has a lot less to do with musical skill and lot more to do with marketers, who by design, are bent on creating distraction to lure audiences away from you and on to them... Those marketers (AKA promo agents, A&R, among things...) The reality is that the scaffolding, which once upheld the music business for artists and execs alike, has buckled.

Youre lucky if you can get 25 people to wave a flag on your behalf.

Like i said...Nobody gives a flying f**k what musicians have to say, musically.

#211628 by ssemble
Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:46 pm
Dane Ellis Allen wrote:hey OP, are you referring to stuff like Justin Timberlake's "Suit & Tie" ?.. I love that tune..


Yeah exactly that, He's one of my pet dislikes.

It probably took 3 months to produce

#211631 by ssemble
Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:54 pm
Jahva wrote:I feel you brother and agree... the problem (if it is one) lies in the youth of today. They are the ones sucked into this crap. Most older folk make fun of this garbage or beckon for the days of Vinyl.
Teach your children well... have an influence on those closest to you. That's where the answer lies. imo


Well it's nice to hear from some rational thinking people in the US, i think us Brits are the ones who are being institutionalised by the likes of Cowell and his cronies.

#211632 by DainNobody
Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:58 pm
and the cost to produce that tune at a high end studio 3 months of time at $80.00 + an hour plus hired session players and the cost would be in the thousands of dollars for one tune.. to think I have $22.50 invested in a tune of mine/ours that is getting good feedback from critics whose opinion count for something is astonishing.. there is some brewha building about "Anytime Is Fine" since google web crawlers are doing their job getting it propagated

#211638 by t-Roy and The Smoking Section
Wed Apr 10, 2013 7:10 pm
ssemble wrote:Well it's nice to hear from some rational thinking people in the US, i think us Brits are the ones who are being institutionalised by the likes of Cowell and his cronies.



American Idol (and those types of shows) are no different than, say, the Ed Sullivan show was in making/breaking stars because they are mass media.

But don't think for one minute that people actually go there to find new music, only new idols.

I believe we're actually in a very healthy transition period where the major label model will no longer dictate what people get to hear and like. Once this all shakes out, it will be different but the entreprenuers will figure out how to capitalize art again. Hopefully some of them will be musicians leading the way for other musicians.

And I do believe we are on the edge of an international explosion of music & art that won't be limited by borders. Those who are creating art right now will be the forerunners of tomorrow when that day gets here. So, just be faithful in the small things now and you will be given greater things to be faithful in.




.

#211654 by Kramerguy
Wed Apr 10, 2013 8:32 pm
I think everyone over-complicates the issues.

Big labels are in death throes. It's no secret. Only the dumbest of dumb music is published by them anymore simply because selling a million albums is a waste to them. They need to sell 12mil because they are still bloated; which is why we keep seeing clones of brittany spears and mariah carey, or whoever else.

I've noticed especially in other forums on other sites, that many cover-bands have a certain contempt towards their "fans", or at least the 'average' bar fly that hangs out at the bar.. that they are stupid, that they appreciate you playing the 'standards', meaning black-eyed girl, sweet home barf, you name it. 99% of coverbands share 75% of their setlists with each other while all claiming to play different songs than "every other band"..

I'm getting to a point with that-
In this thread I'm seeing the same thing regarding our youth. Do you think kids are that stupid? We talk about how they aren't into GOOD music. But that's really only half the picture.. they aren't into the music you deem good. They aren't into YOUR genre. That includes every genre in existence..

When we were growing up, rock was still transforming. Throughout the 60's, 70's, 80's and up to about 1995, rock evolved. It pretty much stopped, hit the wall in 95. Where has it gone since? Nowhere. Sure, a FEW bands have nationally broken out as different, such as kings of the stone age, system of a down, etc.. but they grow fewer and fewer each passing year.

The kids aren't stupid. They don't want OUR music, anymore than they want disco, 80's hair metal, glam, pop, etc.. they don't want grunge, and even the later screamo and metalcore is crap to them, because a totally different generation did it. Did we honestly want the doobie bros in teh 80's? Did we want Cinderella in the 90's? Nope. And today's kids certainly don't want us telling them they don't know good music.

So they are currently working hard to distance themselves from the most popular stuff, which is why we're hearing a lot of bluegrass, folk, and world music influences in today's modern music. There's a lot of great bands in the scene NOW, but I've seen many on this forum bash modern music as terrible, when in reality it's just.. different. It's not your rock, grunge, or whatever.

I remember being young.. my parents thought no less about my favorite...
#211695 by ssemble
Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:04 am
hmmmmmmmm..Kinda what i'm saying...

Its like Chinese whispers, you don't have to be great to become great.

Every new act, artist model whatever, that comes into the scene are labelled as amazing etc...etc.

Probably are some great new acts but i haven't heard one yet, or at least not the ones i want to hear.

Might hear a good song, doesn't make them a great talent.

Every decade/cycle has its modern rebellion its part of growing up i know, i did it once and it's been active long before the 60s.

And Each year has its crap, we shove these years into little packets of generations.

It's a good selling point.

EVEN POLITICIANS WANT TO BE CELEBRITIES

#211719 by PaperDog
Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:13 pm
Kramerguy wrote:I think everyone over-complicates the issues.

Big labels are in death throes. It's no secret. Only the dumbest of dumb music is published by them anymore simply because selling a million albums is a waste to them. They need to sell 12mil because they are still bloated; which is why we keep seeing clones of brittany spears and mariah carey, or whoever else.

I've noticed especially in other forums on other sites, that many cover-bands have a certain contempt towards their "fans", or at least the 'average' bar fly that hangs out at the bar.. that they are stupid, that they appreciate you playing the 'standards', meaning black-eyed girl, sweet home barf, you name it. 99% of coverbands share 75% of their setlists with each other while all claiming to play different songs than "every other band"..

I'm getting to a point with that-
In this thread I'm seeing the same thing regarding our youth. Do you think kids are that stupid? We talk about how they aren't into GOOD music. But that's really only half the picture.. they aren't into the music you deem good. They aren't into YOUR genre. That includes every genre in existence..

When we were growing up, rock was still transforming. Throughout the 60's, 70's, 80's and up to about 1995, rock evolved. It pretty much stopped, hit the wall in 95. Where has it gone since? Nowhere. Sure, a FEW bands have nationally broken out as different, such as kings of the stone age, system of a down, etc.. but they grow fewer and fewer each passing year.

The kids aren't stupid. They don't want OUR music, anymore than they want disco, 80's hair metal, glam, pop, etc.. they don't want grunge, and even the later screamo and metalcore is crap to them, because a totally different generation did it. Did we honestly want the doobie bros in teh 80's? Did we want Cinderella in the 90's? Nope. And today's kids certainly don't want us telling them they don't know good music.

So they are currently working hard to distance themselves from the most popular stuff, which is why we're hearing a lot of bluegrass, folk, and world music influences in today's modern music. There's a lot of great bands in the scene NOW, but I've seen many on this forum bash modern music as terrible, when in reality it's just.. different. It's not your rock, grunge, or whatever.

I remember being young.. my parents thought no less about my favorite...


Yes and no. You are dead-nut-spot-on about doobie brothers... I agree that trend continues to change and that's where the kids lean... But you also described a re-cycle scenario (Bluegrass, folk, etc) ...and there's nothing new in any of that.. Today's kids haven't innovated or invented anything substantial that will blow an audience out of the water. We sort of passed and buried our real musical renaissance by the time the 70's came. From there, its been down hill. Todays youngsters just seem to lack a certain green-light in themselves to become innovative and create the next era of mid-blowing music.

#211723 by Kramerguy
Thu Apr 11, 2013 3:26 pm
mix yellow and blue and you get green. All music is a byproduct, paperdog.

In the 80's i joked with a friend that we should start a band that mixes heavy metal like metallica and motorhead with popular dance like jodi watley and expose.. few years later I heard KMFDM, Ministry, few others doing "industrial".. it nailed what I had in my head from years before..

Mixing bluegrass, folk, and other stuff into the more modern rock and synth pop is not anything "new", and yet.. it is. So it's not a pure green, at least it's lime, and we haven't had lime green yet. Better than plain old 60's/yellow, 70's/blue, ad-neasuem.

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