General Music Chat

I am ALL FOR alternative renewable fuels! No one can argue that some day fossil fuels will be gone. It took a LONG time to become dependent on these non-renewable fuel sources. I would add lets not destroy our economy and country without using common sense! Common sense dictates that we persue reasonable renewable fuels and methodically and SLOWLY bring them into use! Furthermore products other than fuel come from crude oil. Products that society can't do without. Humans are going to take things from this earth that is a fact. We are NOT GODS! We as humans are consumptive by our very nature. We can't imagine things into existence. They come from the earth people! Where do ya'll think Solar cells come from!

No one can argue that some day fossil fuels will be gone

Finally, we agree on something

My argument would be which will run out first- the fossil fuels or the environment's ability to survive burning them?

A risk I personally don't want to take. So what if we all end up poor? I'm already poor. I'd rather have my planet be habitable than personal wealth.

Some people, not so much.

Doesn't the fact that they discontinued "global warming" for climate change when the temperature of the earth began cooling tell you anything?

July 2012 is the hottest July on record. The last year has been the warmest as well. 11 of the 12 hottest years have been in this century. The ice caps are melting rapidly. You cannot deny facts unless you're insane.

Doesn't the fact that they discontinued "global warming" for climate change when the temperature of the earth began cooling tell you anything?

July 2012 is the hottest July on record. The last year has been the warmest as well. 11 of the 12 hottest years have been in this century. The ice caps are melting rapidly. You cannot deny facts unless you're insane.

Uh Jimmy, the earth has been warming since the last Ice Age ended and thats what 12,000 years of global warming? man has been burning fossil fuels for the last 100 years. Your numbers just don't add up Bud!

Not my numbers Bub. They are those pesky things known as facts. The sun is getting hotter, we're dumping more and more gases into the atmosphere by the day, and the world's forests are being decimated annually. Believe or don't believe, I couldn't care less.

Not my numbers Bub. They are those pesky things known as facts. The sun is getting hotter, we're dumping more and more gases into the atmosphere by the day, and the world's forests are being decimated annually. Believe or don't believe, I couldn't care less.

Good for you! For the sake of the argument you have earned one bisquit!

Bisqut? That sounds like a foreign word. I'm afraid I'm going to have to see your papers.

Bisqut? That sounds like a foreign word. I'm afraid I'm going to have to see your papers.

Old Mon sign Zis Pa-pa's (think cheech and chong)!

Bisqut? That sounds like a foreign word. I'm afraid I'm going to have to see your papers.

In another 10 years just think Jimmy, you will have taught the mulletman how to spell! Don't you feel proud? That will definately earn you a bisquit!

Definitely. You're welcome.

Mercury..I hadn't even thought about that one in connection with this topic, but it certainly is a scary problem, and related, in addition to the huge amount of pollution produced not only by coal burning industries, but cars etc as well.

Not many people really understand why it's primarily in fish that mercury shows up, and since fish is one of the best foods you can eat, it's a really scary problem.

I've been a fisherman since before I can remember, so I was really upset when I started seeing mercury notices on many lakes a rivers, and I Had to look it up years ago when my father insisted it was no big deal and mercury got there from people throwing tin cans in the lake.

HUH???

OK so I did a bit of research...all coal burning industries, not just power plants, produce mercury as a by product, usually floating into the atmosphere from their smokestacks. (power plants and paper mills were the two primary examples quoted in the articles I read.) After being carried any distance, in some cases across oceans, it gets dropped into the water by rain. Plankton transform it into the mercury that ends up in fish, from a variety known as organic mercury. (I'm relying on memory here, but I believe that's correct and I can't remember the type it's transformed into either) then it gets consumed by larger and larger organisms as it moves up the food chain. The highest levels of concentration are found at the top of the food chain, which is what humans eat...fish, mainly.

And that's where it becomes a problem for us. Mercury is related to several different medical issues, but mainly brain damage. That's why I was appalled to find that mercury was also used in a number of vaccines, how stupid is that???

Autism, Alzheimers, ADD, ADHD...what else might be related? and nothing is being done about it, most "experts" won't even admit it's a problem. Nobody in the food industry will admit it for sure, they like making money...

Also, I looked up my geology book, earthquakes have been caused by man in a couple of different ways. The one I mentioned was in Colorado. The army was pumping toxic waste from nerve gas and insecticides into the ground in a 2 mile deep well, under high pressure. It was originally in holding ponds, but was leaking out and killing crops and animals etc so they put it underground. It took only six weeks to cause the first mild earthquake. What it did was to force water into existing cracks, widening them, introducing lubrication and allowing rocks to move around, resulting in earthquakes. The earthquakes finally stopped a couple of years after the Army stopped pumping water into the ground in 1966. They tried to keep it quiet, but the story gradually got out anyway.

Also, the filling of Lake Mead caused minor earthquakes for 10 years in a previously earthquake free area, as did the creation of the Kariba Dam in Africa in 1963-66. Those were stronger. Same for Konya Dam in India, 1967, which also cracked the dam itself. That one killed over 150 people.

Nuclear testing has also resulted in earthquakes in Nevada. (Howard Hughes pestered Nixon constantly to stop nuclear testing in Nevada, it shook the hotel he was living in)

So this type of oil drilling seems to me to be a very bad idea, and I live too close to the Texas drilling area for comfort. I'll soon be moving even closer...east Texas a couple of hours from Sans. So I'm not happy about this at all, there's already a fault line running through Texas, which has been mostly dormant for a long time. It's a minor one, and dormant for apparently around 750,000 years. But it runs right through the area I'll be...and between Houston and Austin too. Then it runs north, and curves east to where I live now...then across Mississippi and back south to the coast.

Pretty scary stuff, when you realize this is not imagination, it's proven fact. This type of drilling is doing the exact same thing that caused earthquakes in Colorado in the 60's, and actually worse, since in that case they didn't break up the underlying rock, just lubricated it. This time the rock is being broken up. Nothing good can come of this...

My argument would be which will run out first- the fossil fuels or the environment's ability to survive burning them?

Excellent question...I would hope the planet would outlast the depletion of fossil fuels, as it probably will, after all it's been here for a couple of years already, but will we outlive it? Will we be around to see what happens and how the planet rebuilds itself?

I'm sure the planet will carry on. It has survived thousands of meteor/asteroid hits, ice ages, floods, and it will survive man. Just look at the moon through a pair of binoculars, you'll see how many potential asteroid and meteor hits the earth has had to deal with. Several huge ones have been proven, I have little doubt those are a small percentage of those that actually happened in the dim and distant past.

But I think Kramer has hit on the biggest question of all...paraphrased, will the planet survive man??? I know I've basically answered myself, but it's an interesting idea to ponder...