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#159849 by Cajundaddy
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:11 pm
neanderpaul wrote:
neanderpaul wrote:
PaperDog wrote:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgSptNx1 ... re=related

!


If I was a betting man I would bet Clapton tuned his guitar at about 1:08.
It was sour before that, and sweet after. At 1:08 - 1:09 you can hear him hit something he could have played and quickly tuned to.
Sean, Jimmy, Paper dog tell me if you hear at least the before and after.


C'mon Cap and Johhny 7. Humor me here.


NP,
I am at work now and cannot listen to it. I will check it when I get home. :)

#159850 by Christopher Holmes
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:15 pm
Sean Akins wrote:I never learn solos of other players.


That's a shame. There's a lot to learn from learning other people's solos.

#159852 by jw123
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:20 pm
Paul I heard what you are talking about. Sounds like the G string was out and then it was in to me, I hate when that happens! LOL

#159854 by Christopher Holmes
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:23 pm
TheJohnny7Band wrote: A lot of players think that to do a song verbatim is the goal. A lot of people like to hear songs very close to the original track. I don't. I think it's a trap, it's boring, and I am guilty of doing it myself a lot. I think the best covers are always option #3. Where the player takes a basic song framework and pours their own fresh groove, inspiration, and interpretation on it. Really epic covers don't come from the local bar band hitting every note. Epic covers are loaded with fresh groove and inspiration like when Hendrix covered Dylan, Santana covered Peter Green, EVH covered Roy Orbison, Rush covered Eddie Cochran, SRV covered Hendrix, Clapton covered Robert Johnson, and on and on.

"Take what you need and make it your own" is the old bluesman philosophy and it still rings true today. Cover songs that really move an audience are familiar songs with fresh, interesting and new ideas that take a song through a whole new door.



You know, I used to think like this. Now that I've been in a cover band, I have a different perspective.

People who know guitar, or who pay attention to that instrument and the solos of songs, they WANT you to hit every note - on certain songs. That's what they want to see. And they get disappointed when you don't hit every note on a signature solo.

But that's the key - signature solos on certain songs. Some solos are just wanking anyway; so you can take liberty with them, do them better, have fun with them.

But some songs - people want to hear exactly the way it is on an album. "Crazy Train", for example. If you screw that one up, people get disappointed.

So the key, for me, as a lead player, is to figure out what songs I have to be exact on, and which ones I can play with.

What I've come to learn is this: every song in the set list is unique and different and presents a different problem when it comes to connecting with an audience. Some songs you need to nail exactly. Others you don't. It just depends on the song. Sometimes all you need to do is get the mood of the solo right and not the exact notes. But the song and how well people know it will generally dictate that for you. Sometimes it's enough to hit a few signature notes in a solo. And sometimes you just gotta suck it up and learn the whole thing note-for-note.

So, I guess my point is: There is no "BEST" way for all songs. Some covers deserve to be embellished or changed and they actually sound better when you do that. And some need to be played exact...

#159855 by neanderpaul
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:25 pm
jw123 wrote:Paul I heard what you are talking about. Sounds like the G string was out and then it was in to me, I hate when that happens! LOL

Thanks! I'm not crazy! :lol:

#159856 by jw123
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:29 pm
Chris I think you nailed the answer right there.

Im like you there are some signature solos that I feel I have to hit, but others I just try to understand a players quirks and trademark sounds and incorporate those into what Im doing.

Then of course occasionally I get into a pedal rush and just really let it all hang out, sometimes people dig this sometimes they dont. But as long as Im happy with my effort then thats all that really matters sometimes.

#159857 by neanderpaul
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:33 pm
neanderpaul wrote: So it's not one of those epic perfect things that you must duplicate or it is ruined. Some songs are like that.

I'm with John and Christopher.

#159858 by J-HALEY
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:34 pm
Clapton plays with light gauge strings on his electrics. I have seen (in video) him stretch a string and I swear that thing is gonna pop! I mean he'll stretch the high E untill it literally touches the low E. Thats how I have determined he plays light guage strings. Having said that sometimes if you are pushing to hard on the strings you can pull them out of tune especially on an elec. with light 9 to 42. I catch myself doing that from time to time! In this case that could be what happened!

#159859 by jw123
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:36 pm
Sorry I got sidetracked as far as Seans take on Badge I found his playing refreshing, ussually he is wanking so damn hard that it just gets old listening too, at least we know hes got some bluesy soul in there somewhere.

Hes got chops, just hasnt learned how to use them, nothing a couple of hundred gigs wouldnt cure.

#159862 by neanderpaul
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:47 pm
jw123 wrote: nothing a couple of hundred gigs wouldnt cure.

Haha! That's the cure for everybody's musical deficiencies!

#159864 by neanderpaul
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:48 pm
It's clear Sean that you also whip out an awesome classic tone at will. 8)

#159865 by Cajundaddy
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:48 pm
Christopher Holmes wrote:
TheJohnny7Band wrote: A lot of players think that to do a song verbatim is the goal. A lot of people like to hear songs very close to the original track. I don't. I think it's a trap, it's boring, and I am guilty of doing it myself a lot. I think the best covers are always option #3. Where the player takes a basic song framework and pours their own fresh groove, inspiration, and interpretation on it. Really epic covers don't come from the local bar band hitting every note. Epic covers are loaded with fresh groove and inspiration like when Hendrix covered Dylan, Santana covered Peter Green, EVH covered Roy Orbison, Rush covered Eddie Cochran, SRV covered Hendrix, Clapton covered Robert Johnson, and on and on.

"Take what you need and make it your own" is the old bluesman philosophy and it still rings true today. Cover songs that really move an audience are familiar songs with fresh, interesting and new ideas that take a song through a whole new door.



You know, I used to think like this. Now that I've been in a cover band, I have a different perspective.

People who know guitar, or who pay attention to that instrument and the solos of songs, they WANT you to hit every note - on certain songs. That's what they want to see. And they get disappointed when you don't hit every note on a signature solo.


So you are suggesting that Hendrix blew it by wanking All Along The Watchtower, SRV choked Voodoo Chile, Cream duffed Crossroads, EVH mauled Pretty Woman? I completely disagree. Each of those epic covers was pretty far off the reservation from the original track. Especially the guitar work and solos. I think if people want to listen to a parrot they should buy a parrot. :)

I play verbatim solos often but I think it is kinda lame. It's just that I don't have anything better to say on this one so I play it like the track by default. My best guitar work (and what always gets the best crowd reaction) is fresh, inventive, and new inspiration. I think the same is true of all great cover songs.

To each his own.
Last edited by Cajundaddy on Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.

#159867 by jimmydanger
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:53 pm
Johnny, I think Chris said on certain songs, and I tend to agree. I think it's great when an artist takes a song to the next level like Jimi did on "Watchtower" - that was definitely not wanking. But sometimes you just have to suck it up and learn it like the man played it.

#159869 by neanderpaul
Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:57 pm
And it does seem like all these instances of "needing to play it right" are big guitar hooks.

#159871 by Cajundaddy
Tue Dec 13, 2011 5:06 pm
neanderpaul wrote:And it does seem like all these instances of "needing to play it right" are big guitar hooks.


Yes, you do need those big hooks. Of the tracks up on our band page most are pretty true to the original tracks and all have the big guitar hooks. The Santana tune is probably closest to the way the guitar was recorded in 72. All are quick demos that were done 5 years ago. Covering Santana verbatim is not my proudest moment as a guitarist but it was a theme necessary to the groove of that song.

I think "Crazy Train" is one of those songs that Randy loaded with tons of unique and interesting guitar hooks. Yes you gotta have those hooks but in later years both Zakk Wylde and Steve Vai managed to play true to the guitar hooks while putting their own stamp on the song. I do still like the original track with Randy best but I appreciate the efforts by the other guys to explore the solos a bit creatively and I am grateful they chose not to cop Randy's solo note for note. The trick is knowing when and where to stretch out.
Last edited by Cajundaddy on Tue Dec 13, 2011 9:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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