Musician Gear & Tech Discussion

I just came into possession of a Fender Super Six Reverb cab with the stock 6x10"s and a Fender Twin Reverb Chassis in it.

"The Super Six has six speakers of 8 ohms each. These are connected in a series/parallel combination, resulting in a speaker impedance of 5.3 ohms (16 through 3)".

"The Super Six is, as a matter of fact, a Twin Reverb chassis put into a 6 x 10" combo housing. It's exactly the same circuit. So if you get a Twin housing with speakers you could swap at will.
Two channels, both with Inputs 1 & 2(1 is louder), Bright switches and controls for Volume, Treble, Mids and Bass. Second channel also features controls for Reverb, Tremolo Speed and Intensity.
There is a Master Volume knob that adds a few decibels of preamp gain if you pull the knob. Earliest versions of the SF Twins / Super Sixes might not have this feature. Talking of which: models that had been built in the first half of the seventies have 100W of power, later on ones have been pushed to give 130 W.
The real treat with the Super Six is it's 6 x 10" cabinet."

So after inspection and dissection, the master volume switch (spdt) 1 meg pot, log, push pull, CTS brand is TOAST. (needs replaced)

Do you advocate the use of the original to replace or should I go with a dpdt switch that clicks in at 10, so that it gets removed from the circuit completely or yet another unknown choice? (I remember a PPIV mod that does this)

It's also running 2 6l6's of 4 right now and 1 is a slow heater.

I can get sh*t tubes of soviet manufacture (think Sovtek but not) for 23$ for a matched quad. Or I could spend the 100$ some and get a custom new tube set like JJ's or the equivalent.

What should I do to make this usable? AS it is, it just needs help, as I do currently in deciding what do do here..

I am thinking of blackfacing it as well (ab763).

Capt as far as tubes the 6L6s are power tubes, personally i dont find a big difference with what power tubes i use in my amps. I dont find huge differences with preamp tubes to tell the truth. I think you could go with the lower priced set and not notice a huge difference.

The tone pots, if you know of a change you want in this amp then change it, but if your not sure I would go back with something more stock.

Are you using pedals these days? I guess that factors in also.

I had an old Sunn Cab that had 6 speakers and I used to have major problems blowing speakers. I may have messed the wiring up, that was a long time ago.

Good Luck sounds like a cool find.

Ah it's ok, nothing to write home about yet.

It's going to need some real work, as the right top corner is smashed.
(mental note to call my good friend the carpenter)

Just the same 3 pedals as usual; fuzz face, octavia and a vibe.
I tossed the wah because after I fixed it, it just sounded like crap.

Vibrato is toast as well and so is the reverb.
I took out the tank and tested it on a working amp and it seems to be okay, thus it's going to be something deeper inside (gulp) the chassis.
All pots are dirty enough to be growing plants in them and I still have to isolate the correct master volume switch, as the one I have has the stem broken off. (waive good bye to the push pull until I find one) I am still thinking of using a better switch that will click off at 10 and remove itself from the circuit. (ppiv) (dpdt)

I.e. This one is going to be a while before it sounds like anything I could use functionally and more importantly, in a way that sounds good.

I think it's going to get "blackfaced" or reset to an AB763 circuit as well. You know that this one will never be resold once it gets done as it will be way past "slightly modded" once I get it to sound decent.

I was looking at JBL D-130's, but I don't know much about them other than they are usually 15". I wish I could get (6) 10" D-130's or a an idea of what would be the equivalent.

OOH and don't let Shredd hear you about the difference in tubes.
I am unsure at this point, although I KNOW I have heard Sovtek 5881's and they do sound like utter sh*t. Unfortunately, there are 2 of these tubes in the amp right now.

aka

PULL > > > > boom.. I got it. Ok, launch the other 1 now.. lol

Those Super Six Fender amps are monsters. The only famous players I heard play through them was Freddie King and Albert King. It's generally understood among Fender amp collectors that the mid to late 70's high powered Fender amps were not so great sounding, compared to their earlier blackfaced bretheren. They were loud, but Fender had gone to those ultra-linear transformers and the master volume push pull switches that sucked most of any good tone left out of those amps. They are not considered collectible nor desirable. I would not put much money into getting it up and going. As for tubes, just to get it going, a matched quad of Sovteks will work. JJ's, Svetlana's or NOS GE's would be better of course. Fender calls for 7025's in most of their pre-amp locations, except the reverb driver. Any quality 12AX7 will work. The stock speakers are Oxfords or CTS, nothing special. One could get JBL 10's as an upgrade. What a beast! With the standard speakers it weighs in at 98 lbs. Imagine it loaded with six 10" JBL D110F's and those large alnico magnets. As for "blackfacing" it, to some, that means changing the values on a few resistors. To others, it means getting period correct components. If yours were an early 70's model and not the later 135 watt model, the trannies maybe decent enough to warrant you "blackfacing" it. If it's a later model, I wouldn't bother. In fact, if it were mine, I'd probably just get it up and running and sell it on Craig's List. I could not imagine trying to move that thing around.

lol I am a large guy and the super six reverb is not even 70lbs ish.

If you are a wispy lil guy, yeah you don't need to drag this around.

It's a 72', turns out it already had a non-linear trans and some Sprague orange drops installed, as opposed to the chocolate drops etc.

As it ever is, don't listen to people who never HAD one.

It's so heavy huh? LMAO Lift some weights, bitches. Don't go through life as a p*ssy.

It's as heavy as a Super Reverb and I know you know that's not very heavy.

Listen less to what "they" say and try to find people that actually physically have touched one or played one or worked on one. It'll save you from the proverbial egg on your face.

I took it to my amp tech and he already had an amp that would be representative of what the ab763 mod would transpire to with 6 10" speakers.

I played that amp for nigh unto 2.5 hours.

Long story short, it might be expensive but the repair and mod will be fine.

And if you want to know the real deal, ask someone that knows. Don't take the word of the crowd at large, 9 times out of 10, they just don't know much at all.

lol I am a large guy and the super six reverb is not even 70lbs ish.

I do not have one to weigh. However, according to the Fender Amp Field Guide ( http://www.ampwares.com/amp.asp?id=103 ) they do weigh 98 lbs. IMHO, that is a heavy amp for a combo amp. Not to mention bulky. A silverfaced Super Reverb is stated to weigh 86 lbs. I have had one of those and it is one of Fender's heavier combos. But your point is well taken. If you are capable of moving it around and have no problem doing so, then that isn't a consideration. Not everyone is 6' + and muscle bound.

As to whether or not it is "worth it" to mod and or invest in one, that is a personal opinion. The Fender Super Reverb is considered to be one of Fender's best designs. It uses the favorable AB763 circuitry. The Super Six does not however, and is more closely aligned with the Fender Twin and Showman circuits. Those are known for high power and clean tones. If that is what an individual is seeking, then with a Super Six, one would get that.

Your question was:

What should I do to make this usable?

I simply gave you my opinion. It's based on collecting and using Fender amps for 30+ yrs. If you believe the amp is for you, then I'd say go for it. Have the mods done and make the amp gig worthy. After all, it is still a Fender, and those are some of the best designs for guitar amplification ever built.

Thanks Allthumbs for your advice, I do appreciate.

As for waiting? I already bought it. I already took it to the tech.

It's already being cleaned and setup for what I need it to be.

Also, it's not my 1st fender combo.

I own a 1977 Fender Bassman Ten
a 1976 Fender Twin Reverb w/ master vol.
+ now a 1972 Fender Super Six Reverb, albeit came in bad shape, going to need much TLC.

I also have an assortment of other amps and crap that pales in comparison.

I guess I have equipment that covers all of my past stages and preferred sounds.

Not my first fender combo, but hopefully the last. If the six comes out like the combo the kind gent had me practicing on loudly in his shop, I think I am good to go.

I have to laugh though. I have heard that the super six amp and the twin reverb amp are extremely similar. Eventually, both amps will be "blackfaced/ab763'd".

Now the tech I use said the BASSMAN TEN was damn close to being ab763 already. He mentioned the tube rectifier and the trans, some other minor changes having to do with power.

The twin reverb chassis, on the other hand needs more help to get to ab763.

The super six reverb, he said, was close because someone already started the refit. You mentioned that it's very close to the ab763 already right?

I wish these things were a little more straight-forward.

All I know is tone/voicing. Do I like it or do I not?

I am not even adjusting my own amp anymore because I get a better signal/tone/voice when I let the other band members adjust my setup.

I figure my hearing is on the getup and go.. I know I have a little damage in my right ear, but that's what you get when you play with naked ears and you play loud.

I remember this amp i had a quad reverb which was the same w 4 12 s around 72.I put jbl k120s in it, it was heavy! but as i remember it as a 40 watt 2 6l6 amp . " twist " ferguson of Twist & the groove machine ( joliet Il ) still uses a super six with a 65 mustang for a great blues sound

Ok,
I have owned a bunch of vintage Fenders over the years and have played thru a Super Six. Not my favorite Fender combo but if it were mine I'd:

1. Blackface it, lose the master volume, and use a nice set of tubes.
2. Consider losing the cab and creating a head/ 410 closed back cab setup.

This just might turn into a great giging tone monster. With the right speaker choices you could get Fender clean with a little British bite. I realize that lots of cool guys still enjoy dragging around heavy gear but after 20 years of moving 250lb bi-amped A7 cabs I am totally over it. Now days if it weighs more than 50 lbs it doesn't leave my studio.

Just one mans opinion. Others will surely disagree.

I like winged "c" tubes as far as jbls go I didnt think they made 10" "gtr " speakers , but Eminence has some great 10" speakers these days & celestion has a vintage 30 10" ( I have one in my princeton ) , they also have a gold alnico 10 " ( it has a similar sound to a jbl ) but its kinda pricey . duane allman live at the fillmore classic old marshall w/ 8 jbl d120s ( they have a sort of whining / crying dopler effect ) the old jbls are hard to find and 6 of them would make your amp weight close to 200 lbs or more.!

i meant d110s

how 'bout a red knob super sixtey from around 1990 pc board amp endorsed by gary moore ? not really very road worthy( front panel pots & tubes direct to pc board ) but great sounding Ive seen them available for as little as $125 2 6l6 3 12ax7 fx loop & 1 12, plenty loud for clubs!

Never played the Super Six, but do play a Super Reverb now, and have used other Fenders at times. Great amps.

The blackface job will be costly, if it uses a different rectifier tube, or transistor rectifier. That means transformer has to be replaced. Make sure every electrolytic cap in sight is replaced, if they are not dry now they will be before long. Lose the Master Volume, they suck.

Weight is not an issue with me, my Super is pretty heavy for me, I'm a small guy, but I'd much rather have a heavy tube amp then a lightweight crap solid state. My Peavey MX is around 75lbs and the Kustom 2x12 cab I use with it about the same, been lugging them around for almost 20 years and will continue to do so. I sometimes use both...

I'm not too picky about tubes, I've tried several in both amps and notice little difference. Crank it to 10 and it still sounds fabulous...I'm still using the stock speakers, either CTS or Oxford, I can't remember so I can't say much about replacements.

I didn't try to blackface my Super, it has the 5u4 rectifier instead of the earlier GZ whatever, and I'm too cheap to go for a transformer. I did replace every cap in it, removed the ones on top of the power tubes that suck out the ultra highs, and changed the one that controls bass response, so it has nice bass now instead of too much boomy bass. Sounds very good, It never had a master volume, I was glad of that, I hate master volume amps. Overall, I love the amp after a few minor changes.

If you want to spend the bucks to blackface it, go for it, that's your decision. I wouldn't, that amp just wouldn't be worth the extra expense to me. It might have the same boomy bass mine had, and the high sucking caps, those 2 changes made all the difference in the world, now it's a great sounding amp when before it was mediocre at best. Mine's a 73 model. One capacitor is all you need to change to make the bass controllable and sound great, removing two is all it takes to get the ultra highs back. They did that to control oscillation, I replaced that with one in the tone or vibrato section similar to the older Bassmans.

The reverb/vibrato problems could be bad tubes, could be fried caps or resistors. That would take some tinkering with a meter. My guess would be caps, the existing ones are most likely almost 40 years old and dried out.

I also replaced all the 1/2 watt resistors, the originals were flaky and created a "bacon frying" sound when the amp idled. Replacing the resistors fixed that.

First thing I did was replace the power cable with a grounded one. Tube amps develop too much voltage to risk running one without a ground, and the ground pin had been removed. Fixed that before I ever even plugged it in.

Pete,

I think the fender super reverb from 73 is already an ab763 or blackface circuit.

You do a cap job and that's about it, as it's already using the 5R4 rectifier.

Lots of confusion about what constitutes a Blackface circuit. This is the best source I know:
http://www.superchamp.dk/papers/dating_ ... e_amps.htm

My Super Reverb is an early 64 with AA763 circuit, all original Jenson10s and international touring voltage selector switch.