General Music Chat

This is something that bothers me a bit and I wanted to get other people's takes and see how they do things.

We've been trying out a lot of bass players recently and I'm bothered by their approach to practice...

In our band (cover band), we use practice as a time to get in sync together. We expect band members to actually learn their parts on their own time; to practice the songs at home and get their parts down before they show up to rehearsal. We expect each person to do their own research and figure out what they need to know before they show up to band practice (and we don't consider this a hardship - with the internet and web sites like UltimateGuitar.com, it's easier than ever to find music & tabs and be prepared). When we all get together, we all should know our own parts and be able to play through a song start to finish.

A lot of the people we've been trying out lately seem to think practice is a time to actually learn the song. So my band mates end up spending a whole lot of time sitting around doing nothing. I'm the guitar player, so a new bassist will want me to run through the verse, the chorus, the bridge, etc., so he can learn the basic parts. Meanwhile my drummer and vocalist are sitting their twiddling their thumbs waiting for the "lesson" to get over so we can actually play.

We consider our time very valuable. We're all working professionals and it's often difficult for us to meet, due to work schedules, more than one time a week. We like to make the most of our time together. And that's a large reason why we expect people to show up knowing their stuff. When people come unprepared it slows down the whole rehearsal process and we wasted valuable time.

Anyway, I'm wondering how other bands do it. How do you make the most of your time? Do you consider it unprofessional when a new person comes in after 10 days or so to prepare and they don't know a single song, and they expect you to teach them all of the music? We're talking about covers here - I know it's a totally different issue if you're an original band.

Hey, Colors, I'm always preaching the same thing, often to no avail. Unfortunately, in my area there isn't exactly a surplus of good musicians that aren't already playing in bands so you can't give them the ol' "Learn it at home or we can't use you." routine. Sometime, if it seems like the right person for the band, you have to baby them along a little. Pick about 5 new songs a week in advance and put them on a CD for them along with charting it out. Also explain to them in depth about how important it is that they absolutely know the songs by the next rehearsal for the good of the band and that others in the band don't have time for learning the songs from scratch at rehearsal time. Point out that the sooner you get enough songs down, the sooner you'll all be gigging and earning some pay. Don't let any of this sound like a threat, just as matter of factly the way the band operates. I know it sounds like more work on your part, but if you already know the song, it's easy, and if you don't, chart it as you learn it yourself. It'll be worth it if it gets him on track. If you do all of that and they still don't do it, they never will and it's time to give them the boot. If they wonder why you're kicking them out, explain it again and if they sincerely want one more chance, give it to them, but let them know then how serious you are. At least, that's how I'd handle it.

Hey colors and RA-

We've all had these issues, and from what I've learned, I now (well, when we need someone), put right in the ad that we "learn" and "practice" songs at home to "rehearse" with the band at 'rehearsal'... making that distinction lets them know that you know the difference, and it doesn't hurt to specify that learning songs at rehearsals wont tolerated.

Both my bands operate on this philosophy, and it works great... usually we can work out the kinks within 3 plays and be stage-ready within one rehearsal night. That is also because we've all been working together for going on a year now (in both projects) and have a feel for each others timing, style, etc.. so new songs aren't really intimidating as they are with a new band.

Sounds like your having all kinds of fun:) Unfortunatly all of these issues are as old as music itself...

If you are auditioning a new member.... and you gave them a couple songs that you wanted to use for the audition ahead of time.. (hopefully a few days to a week) Here is how it would go with me...

"Hey dude... nice to meet you... so did you get both the songs down?"

"Umm no, I listened to the one.. but I didn't have time to work it out"

"Tell you what bro, lets go ahead and reshedule the audition for a later time so you can learn the songs"

And if they did ANY BS, I wouldn't bother... the only catch is, you should make sure that EVERYONE you audition knows up front that you expect them to show up prepared.

Yes, real players always show up prepared... only unprofessional weekend warriors would ever show up not knowing the material... but it helps to weed those out if you make it clear up front that you are serious.


I'll come play bass for you... of course you will have to pay the travel costs and keep me in sunflower seeds...

LOL

X!

Being predominantly an original band our rehearsals are often creative or curative in nature. Some of the most fun nights are the building of the structure for a new song. It can be a drag waiting for the singers to come to gripswithhow they will handle new material. But I am quite sure they get tired of hearing wank myway through a new lead as well.
When training for a gig we run the gig set as if playing live and record it to play back so we can fix problems at the next rehearsal.
Every one has bad days man. Just shake it off and move foreward, ever foreward.

Max some of the best players I know are Weekend Warriors.

When Ive auditioned folks i give them 3-5 songs and I expect them to know them before they show up. If not, I assume thats the way they are going to be all the time, so theres no need in messing with them, NEXT!

A couple of years ago, I got asked to audition for a blues band. They said they just needed someone to pull them together and in a couple of practices they would be ready to get out and gig. These guys didnt know one song all the way thru, and Im talking basic blues songs. I just basically got to solo in different keys all night. I left and the guy that contacted me called the next day and said they wanted me in thier. I tryed to be nice, but he kept pushing. I said I dont think I could get you guys in shape to play out in 10 years.

Some people just dont get it.

Musically talented people don't always "get it".
Musicians always do.

I've had some times when it just wasn't possible to learn the stuff in time, so I ask for chord charts, when I sit in with ppl. It always amazes me how few folks can actually write 'em out.

Other times, after learning the stuff inside & out from original recordings, I show up to find they "don't do that one anymore," or they "do it differently," or in a different key. Why bother to gimme a song that you don't even do, or that you've changed? Gimme the info up front!

I'm a pro. I'll do my work if I have all the info I need, but most often it seems like I end up doing stuff on the fly, anyway, after the truths come out.

I would never give anyone more than 4-5 songs to learn for an audition, anyway, myself. I can tell from that if I'm gonna use 'em. Why expect anyone to learn your entire set list before you even audition them? (Yeah - I've run into that, too.)

The way we rehearse in TFRB is to distribute CD's with the covers on 'em, decide how many we're gonna do next week, & learn them at home, 1st. When we get together the following week, I invariable have to "fix" things for ppl who've used wrong chords & forgotten song structures...eh, I've done it for 10 + yrs, so why stop now, right? It's a good thing I know how to play guitar, I guess. I can also transpose for the singer, which is another thing many ppl seem to have trouble with.

I know it sounds like more work on your part, but if you already know the song, it's easy, and if you don't, chart it as you learn it yourself. It'll be worth it if it gets him on track.

Yeah, this is what I've been doing. I've been working up full lyric/root-note charts for the new bass players. I've done this for the last two guys to try out. It's time consuming because most of the stuff I get off the web is wrong, so I have to go through it with a fine tooth comb and make sure every little bit is correct. It can take me 25 minutes to do a complete chart for a song. It just burns into my time to practice for myself.

I've always burned disks for new people. I have no problem doing that; I want them to have the music. But dang, it sure would be nice to run into someone who actually takes initiative.

LOL thats probably why I'm no longer in a band... I am tooo uptight about stuff like that...

I show up prepared so anything less than that is unexceptable.... well everyone has a bad week, but we are talking about people who just roll that way... it never works out in the long run... unless I guess your an incredibly kind and patient person that doesn't mind doing everyone elses homework...

I should be like that..... umm... naw!

X!

Before I was married I had a really hot chick come down to audition on vocals... couldn't sing a note.... We still called her back a few times, though. It was the middle of the summer and I turned off the AC so she would come over with practically nothing on! It still helped keep the musicians tight till we got a real singer and we used to get her wasted after each rehearsal... Ahhhh..... memories....errr...mammories...

SON

You will meet a girl, and you will have a good time with her.
But after a short period of time, she will leave you for men who are 10 times better than you.

These men are called musicians.



Colors Fade, if you are doing covers maybe the stuff your trying to cover is too technical. I wouldnt fully chart a song out for anyone. I might write out basic key notes per measure and V-C-V-C-S-C-C out or something like that.

I know you wnat to play what you want to play, but in covers the KISS principle works Keep It Stupid Simple. Thats another thing weve found if you are playing the standard covers in your area, you can find sub players to fill in when the time comes. I have used a sub drummer, bassist and we had a singer come in and sing half the night in the last 6 monthes. I have phone numbers of groups in our area that play the same kinda stuff we do.

Good Luck

Colors Fade, if you are doing covers maybe the stuff your trying to cover is too technical.

To technical? Nah...

http://dayofrain.net/?page_id=3

I mean, I'd love to do a couple Rush covers someday. But we're not even close to that.

Looks pretty basic to me.

Your going to probably have to find someone in the right age group for that list.

Another I noticed is that you are loaded up on some groups AC/DC, Creed, STP were the ones I noticed, you might want to vary into a couple of more groups.

Just my 2 cents

I agree with the variance. And that's something we want to do. This band doesn't ever want to stop learning material. I've got at least a dozen more songs I'd love to do. That just happened to be the way the first 40 came out.