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What? Is Joe Biden putting his foot in his mouth again?
Does anyone realize just how dangerous a shotgun at close quarters is?
The crazy at Newtown could have Killed many more innocents with a double barrel 12 gauge. Reload time seconds... NO MISFIRES... NO MISSES.

Sick... I didn't vote him back in!

GLENNY J wrote:What? Is Joe Biden putting his foot in his mouth again?
Does anyone realize just how dangerous a shotgun at close quarters is?
The crazy at Newtown could have Killed many more innocents with a double barrel 12 gauge. Reload time seconds... NO MISFIRES... NO MISSES.

Sick... I didn't vote him back in!

Actually, Glenny... Dangerous is a subjective term... How about:

"Does anyonee realize just how 'effective' a shotgun at close quarters is?

PaperDog wrote:

GLENNY J wrote:What? Is Joe Biden putting his foot in his mouth again?
Does anyone realize just how dangerous a shotgun at close quarters is?
The crazy at Newtown could have Killed many more innocents with a double barrel 12 gauge. Reload time seconds... NO MISFIRES... NO MISSES.

Sick... I didn't vote him back in!

Actually, Glenny... Dangerous is a subjective term... How about:

[i]"Does anyonee realize just how 'effective' a shotgun at close quarters is?[/i]

Yes, as a matter of fact I do. That's why my new girlfriend is a 5 shot 20 ga pump with #2 shot for spittin on uninvited intruder's.

Biden is actually right for once. Shotguns are the most effective defense weapons. We start firing our "personal defense weapons" which is what the govt pigs call those deadly black rifles when they buy 'em - well you may end up kissing your neighbors goodby.

Same with 9mm pistols. (Use Glaser 'meat sensitive' safety slugs if a pistol is all you have) High velocity weapons are terribly dangerous in urban settings.

I've always thought it a terrible mistake to take the .38 revolvers away from the cops and to give them automatic pistols and assault rifles (oops - Personal Defense weapons) which can wreck a whole neighborhood.

Recent events have proven pretty darn conclusively that what ever gun you give 'em - they'll hose down the whole town if they are concerned for 'officer safety.' Since that is their only bottom line - then Katy Bar the Door. (and hide your dogs!)

Yeah, I have high velocity weapons but still, I but totally believe in the shotgun as first line of defense. Sure - it turns people into hamburger meat but that's the point, and perhaps more importantly, it's penetration power drops off radically after it hits the first wall.

Being a gentlemen I left my mossberg with my ex for her protection. Looking to replace it with an 870. My scary (to sissys) rifle is more fun and more deadly but i genuinly like my neighbors.

Talbot

The two weapons serve different purposes. Shotgun can be effective based on the situation. If your being fired on from cover, you need the penetration of a rifle caliber.

But honestly that is irrelevant to the issue.
We the people choose how we are to be armed.
Not pin head politicians.

sanshouheil wrote:The two weapons serve different purposes. Shotgun can be effective based on the situation. If your being fired on from cover, you need the penetration of a rifle caliber.

But honestly that is irrelevant to the issue.
We the people choose how we are to be armed.
Not pin head politicians.

I'm defiantly not concerned with firing at someone who hasn't violated the sanctity of my home. If it comes to snipers firing at me from a distance it doesn't matter anyway. Only a fool would think that it does. With the high powered rifles used by them, and the body armor they wear along with their sheer numbers, along with the high tech surveillance such as drones and devices that can see through your walls, I doubt that any of us would be a match. Besides, they would simply need to have an drone with some serious firepower annihilate me along with my house with the push of a button.

But inside the home, a shotgun is a fairly good equalizer for any bad guy breaking into your home to harm you or your family. And the bigger the better. (If you can do your own dry wall)

A man firing a weapon into your home from a vehicle in your drive way would be but one of a myriad of possible scenarios where a shotgun would be all but useless.
Not even in consideration of "governmental agencies " of others whom may violate the sanctity and safety of your domain.
I can accurately fire a handgun well beyond the effective range of most shotgun loads. And I am far from being an expert.

Besides, and no offense intended, but considering oneself out numbered and or out gunned is a poor excuse to surrender ones liberty.
And should not even enter into the equation or the warrior mindset.
For if it does.
You have already lost.

The simple truth is those whom demand liberty are never truly alone.

The whole point is far more complicated than what I was pointing out.
First it starts with high velocity weapons... confiscate them,you will be fine with a shot gun.
That is all you NEED. You can even go deer hunting with a 3 inch rifled slug. Good to a 100 yards. Bird shot, 2 and 1/2 inch shell, 12 gauge tolerable kick... Great for close quarters home defense.

This is just the first round to change the fundamental societal view of guns. This will be a long slow process, but the total grab for power can not occur when so many guns are in private hands.

Unfortunately for the takeover politicians... The economic breakdown is happening faster than expected. The guns are still in place, in private control.
This is big problem... What to do?... Get rid of the rifles... then the hand guns... then the shot guns. The ones that Biden says are O.K. for YOU!!!
(for now).

So be it.

If he were that close I could use a snubby and still hit him. I keep an XDx 5.25 for longer shots and they are quite accurate for much further than my driveway or across the street.. Besides the guy with the rifle would have to come in to get me if he unless he's Superman and can see through walls. . That is if he was a bad shot and missed me before I could take cover and grab anything around.

Like it was mentioned, different tools for different jobs. But I live in the city where shooting a rifle could be harmful to others not involved. Even if I were behind sand bags and needed to use a rifle I'm not smart enough to know how to poke my head up above the barrier so I could aim it fast enough to find the target and pull. And if there were more than one I'd just look for a white handkerchief and a stick.

Yeah Glen.
First the "assault weapons" that are by no means that. (Including squirt guns that look like assault weapons.) Then the pistols because of the magazines, then the wheel guns, then the the small derringers that you actually have press against someones head to actually do much. Those too. If they are double barrel

Then they come for the rubber band and nail home made zip guns that kids liked to make in shop class in school.

Hey, what can I say? I grew up on the East Bottoms. Now I live in a M13 neighborhood. The funny part of that is that they aren't a threat to me. At least I don't perceive them as a big threat.

On the other hand there's my own government... and they scare the hell out of me.


But what would you expect? They're lawyers. First they stick their big toe into the pool to test the water. Then they jump right in and begin swimming all around their neighbors pool.

MikeTalbot wrote:Biden is actually right for once. Shotguns are the most effective defense weapons. We start firing our "personal defense weapons" which is what the govt pigs call those deadly black rifles when they buy 'em - well you may end up kissing your neighbors goodby.

Same with 9mm pistols. (Use Glaser 'meat sensitive' safety slugs if a pistol is all you have) High velocity weapons are terribly dangerous in urban settings.

I've always thought it a terrible mistake to take the .38 revolvers away from the cops and to give them automatic pistols and assault rifles (oops - Personal Defense weapons) which can wreck a whole neighborhood.

Recent events have proven pretty darn conclusively that what ever gun you give 'em - they'll hose down the whole town if they are concerned for 'officer safety.' Since that is their only bottom line - then Katy Bar the Door. (and hide your dogs!)

Yeah, I have high velocity weapons but still, I but totally believe in the shotgun as first line of defense. Sure - it turns people into hamburger meat but that's the point, and perhaps more importantly, it's penetration power drops off radically after it hits the first wall.

Being a gentlemen I left my mossberg with my ex for her protection. Looking to replace it with an 870. My scary (to sissys) rifle is more fun and more deadly but i genuinly like my neighbors.

Talbot

You totally get it! Testosterone divised pistols and rifles are too much for urban settings. However, there are those that live close to the border, for instance, that should have their constitutional right to bear the arms that will protect their right to their pursuit of happiness, (instead of their fear to let their children out in their ranch). The guns that were used in Columbine were purchased by law abiding citizens. To protect their rights in a just manner. Without a chance of being outgunned. They forgot or was remiss one important thing. With guns, we have a responsibility to be sure that our guns don't get in the hands of those to whom they do not belong. It alone is the most common thread to all murders in the United States. There are at least 3 points I'm making here... We the people should be feared for arms we MAY have. We must not be thought of as stepping stones to the next firearm a trespasser could get. We should have the firepower to subdue any confrontation that could exist. Including an attempt by illegals to over run you. Or, politicians attempting attacks on your constitutional rights. Borders, including the edge of our yards may not be the end of our chain. When laws about freedom to protect us and ours is diminished to the interior of your vehicle, we want an effective response. Guns have different purposes. Our president should never need an "Assault Weapon". We the people may. How much trust in gun control can you invest into someone that is always behind bullet proof glass and an army of concealed carrying federals? Remove the blinders from the eyes of idiots. Don't let idiots determine your defense.

So you should be able to shoot illegal aliens? Or politicians who are trying to change laws? Is that why you need guns Crunch? Not to hunt or protect your home? But to enforce your own vision of law? I can see why you guys are afraid of gun control, most of you are so crazy you wouldn't be allowed to own weapons if the right controls were in place.

When you say "most of" us, and "crazy", doesn't that put you in the minority? Who put you up to being a psychologist? That you can determine who is crazy, and who is not. You have dillusions of your own grandure. Please, tell us when it is time to wake up! Illegal aliens often carry firearms- I am pleased to be the one to inform you. No one I wouldn't want good practice with an accurate firearm that is occupying my space with my children illegally. And Oh, "The Right Controls". You profess that you know the "Right Controls"? You can't control your own insults on a debate. In a controlled debate at a city hall, you and your inexcusable mouth would be thrown out. The only Danger you present is to yourself and anyone you can convince you're right! Go back to sleep Jimmy, you may have 5 people to entertain this weekend.

Yes it definitely puts me in the minority. Crazy isn't all that bad, it's very entertaining.

Really? A Fender? I would hide the head of that guitar too so no one could see Made in JAPAN!@

crunchysoundbite wrote:Really? A Fender? I would hide the head of that guitar too so no one could see Made in JAPAN!@

more ignorance from the village idiot. the japanese are great instrument builders....their copies of american instruments were so good in the 70's that at half the price of their american counterpart....people couldn't buy 'em fast enough.

and today...they're quite valued and sought after.

damn, you ARE proud of yer iggnence aintcha son?