Musician Forum - Band Discussion Board - BandMix

he can literally smoke Eddie or Malmsteen..>(2:25-3:01)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLukR6J-06o

Good stuff, but I preferred his tone on this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwDnNGskWUY

well he's better than me

But I disagree he's better than Malmsteen. I think what always set malmsteen apart from most of the others wasn't technical ability so much as phrasing.. malmsteens solos (most, not all) tended to have a much more concise start-middle-ending. they seemed to be going somewhere, where players like vai, holdsworth, satch.. all just seemed to be blazing up and down scales with no concept or direction. I think cliffs of dover might be one of the few songs where the solo was memorable- in the sense that I remember the notes and licks and how they fuse together.

In both the examples above, I could listen to the solos dozens of times and still not make the connections.

Like I said, not to knock them, but here's a couple of malmsteen solos that (in my opinion) have a much better art behind them-

Fire - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JNxJ313B9cQ
solo 2:23-3:21

Queen in love- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrgMfLm-djU
solo 1:46-2:45

Never heard of Holdsworth until I cam across him on the CARVIN CHANNEL

They make a signature guitar for him as well.

Just a little trivia . . . not that it matters much.

Kramer

I'd disagree about Steve Vai. Not to say he doesn't wander off into the shred jungle sometimes but when he is one he really gets it done.

Here's a proof: For the Love of God - with the Holland Metropole orchestra.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IrWyZ0KZuk

Talbot

and nothing wrong w AH's tone here..... i actually think i prefer this less processed tone he had back in the day.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZSSQ1q3HiY

Kramerguy wrote:well he's better than me

But I disagree he's better than Malmsteen. I think what always set malmsteen apart from most of the others wasn't technical ability so much as phrasing.. malmsteens solos (most, not all) tended to have a much more concise start-middle-ending. they seemed to be going somewhere, where players like vai, holdsworth, satch.. all just seemed to be blazing up and down scales with no concept or direction. I think cliffs of dover might be one of the few songs where the solo was memorable- in the sense that I remember the notes and licks and how they fuse together.

In both the examples above, I could listen to the solos dozens of times and still not make the connections.

Like I said, not to knock them, but here's a couple of malmsteen solos that (in my opinion) have a much better art behind them-

Fire - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JNxJ313B9cQ
solo 2:23-3:21

Queen in love- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrgMfLm-djU
solo 1:46-2:45

You had to go and do it Kramer! Just kidding, you guys are comparing apples and oranges here. IMHO both these guys are at the top of their game in "their genre" Yingvie is a classical rocker. Holdsworth is a Fusion rocker. Via well "for the love of god" all these guys are the best of the best!

J-HALEY wrote:
You had to go and do it Kramer! Just kidding, you guys are comparing apples and oranges here. IMHO both these guys are at the top of their game in "their genre" Yingvie is a classical rocker. Holdsworth is a Fusion rocker. Via well "for the love of god" all these guys are the best of the best!

You are correct, of course. It really all boils down to a bit of personal tastes, and you are also correct that it's two dramatically different types of music.

I've actually lost my taste for neo-classical, and rarely listen to yngwie anymore. I still can't help but feel the rest of them are just vomiting up the same licks/appregios over and over with no clear direction- something yngwie himself is very guilty of (nothing after his 3rd album seemed to go anywhere, or offer anything new).

I've been kinda waiting for the next EVH, Jimi, Yngwie- someone who will revolutionize guitar, but I wonder if there's even anything left.. it seems like it's all been done. SRV kind of ended the blues guitar for me, it all just became so formulatic, systematic. I hear great blues players today that all more or less sound just like SRV.

I don't think speed is the answer - I listed to dragonforce, agenged sevenfold, etc.. and it just does nothing for me. I'm thinking the page/clapton type solos (well built, creative) mixed with new and inventive tones (NOT VINTAGE) might be where the next great guitar players come from, if that makes sense.

I'm really sick of vintage... if you haven't noticed lol.

Kramerguy wrote:

J-HALEY wrote:
You had to go and do it Kramer! Just kidding, you guys are comparing apples and oranges here. IMHO both these guys are at the top of their game in "their genre" Yingvie is a classical rocker. Holdsworth is a Fusion rocker. Via well "for the love of god" all these guys are the best of the best!

You are correct, of course. It really all boils down to a bit of personal tastes, and you are also correct that it's two dramatically different types of music.

I've actually lost my taste for neo-classical, and rarely listen to yngwie anymore. I still can't help but feel the rest of them are just vomiting up the same licks/appregios over and over with no clear direction- something yngwie himself is very guilty of (nothing after his 3rd album seemed to go anywhere, or offer anything new).

I've been kinda waiting for the next EVH, Jimi, Yngwie- someone who will revolutionize guitar, but I wonder if there's even anything left.. it seems like it's all been done. SRV kind of ended the blues guitar for me, it all just became so formulatic, systematic. I hear great blues players today that all more or less sound just like SRV.

I don't think speed is the answer - I listed to dragonforce, agenged sevenfold, etc.. and it just does nothing for me. I'm thinking the page/clapton type solos (well built, creative) mixed with new and inventive tones (NOT VINTAGE) might be where the next great guitar players come from, if that makes sense.

I'm really sick of vintage... if you haven't noticed lol.

I HAVE to believe there are LOTS of guitar players that can revolutionize guitar playing walking around and alive today. IMO it is mostly the record companies fault that these players haven't gotten the exposure they so deserve. The record execs. are always looking for the next Justin Beiber no talent and no substance over virtuosity. Just something pretty they can package and sell. But then again folks are buying it?

Vintage? I've got stuff written 300 years ago on my player lol.

jimmydanger wrote:Vintage? I've got stuff written 300 years ago on my player lol.

LOL

I meant everyone these days are raging all over vintage strats, tele's, les pauls, etc.. and then vintage amps.. everyone wants old tube amps, fender, marshall, ad neasueam.. and what you get is these beautiful deep warm sounds, shimmering highs, etc.. which all end up being completely redundant- we've heard these tones before, hence my comment about so many blues players being SRV clones- I wasn't referring to their style so much as their tone.

The next great players will not only breach new styles, but will embrace new and hopefully more unique tones- we need to stop living in the past.

Just my humble opinion.

One name, John 5. For me he is the freshest of the newer guitarist Ive heard.

I go thru phases where I listen to various guitarist, the shred fusion instrumental guys I ussually look them up on youtube and hit play its like back ground work music for me. I guess thats sad that I have relegated these guys to the Muzak category, LOL!

Band wise, in the classic rock vein Chicken Foot is cool to me.

But face it guys we all lean toward what we like, there is no better or best, just opinions, and I have learned that my opinion on whats good changes all the time, but I will never lose a place in my heart for Page in the Prime of Zep, for me is just doesnt get any better.

Kramerguy wrote:

jimmydanger wrote:Vintage? I've got stuff written 300 years ago on my player lol.

LOL

I meant everyone these days are raging all over vintage strats, tele's, les pauls, etc.. and then vintage amps.. everyone wants old tube amps, fender, marshall, ad neasueam.. and what you get is these beautiful deep warm sounds, shimmering highs, etc.. which all end up being completely redundant- we've heard these tones before, hence my comment about so many blues players being SRV clones- I wasn't referring to their style so much as their tone.

The next great players will not only breach new styles, but will embrace new and hopefully more unique tones- we need to stop living in the past.

Just my humble opinion.

i hear where you're coming from, k-guy but for me... i'm not looking for anyone to reinvent the wheel tone wise. i love hearing great strat or tele tone thru a Fender Deluxe amp or a bigass archtop thru a Twin....a LP cranked thru a Marshall.....all sounds we've heard a gazillion times. they'll always work for me.

it's much the same as dining for me. i don't need anyone to reinvent my favorite chinese or italian dishes.... a properly cooked steak and baked potato is always gonna work for me (even tho there's nothing new about it)

Well PG, for me it's not that I want my steak re-invented..

I want steak, but if steak were served the exact same way, let's say- steak diane.. a great steak dish, when done by chefs, is almost universally good, with few variations on the classic version of it. I could eat that for a long time, but even I would get sick of it. Not that I don't want to ever eat it again, but I've had enough of it that I would rarely ever order it again, other than to savor a memory or re-live it once in a while.

Why not steak on a stick, or a garlic-pepper steak once in a while?

To me, with the vintage thing, it's like every restaurant in town is serving a very similar steak diane.. and I'm getting tired of it- I wan't a classic t-bone with a hint of garlic and black pepper. I want a chef to come up with a new flavor profile on a steak. Hell, there's so many different cuts of meat (guitars), spices (amps), and PA's (cooking methods), if you want to take the analogy to the extreme

With new spice techniques, new cooking techniques (stainless steel vs. iron?), new cooking surfaces, etc.. why can't we have some inventive recipes out there? Steak is still steak (music, style), but there's a zillion ways to flavor and cook it. Again, why settle for the same cut/spice/cooking method in every restaurant in town?

Man Kramer now you went and did it!

Im starving, time for lunch!