General Music Chat

I've done studio tracks with and without a clicktrack. I prefer wthout. I prefer rehearsing the tunes until they are airtight, then recording the entire band live with the instruments isolated and the vocals are a "scratch" track. Then the vocals are dubbed in and solos dubbed in (if necessary). To me this gives the tunes more of a live feel. When presenting a demo to a prospective venue I want it to be an honest representation of what we sound like live. There might be minor tempo changes but to an untrained ear it's hardly noticable. I believe recording with a clicktrack (metronome) makes a tune sound too sterile. Just my opinion.

I've done studio tracks with and without a clicktrack. I prefer wthout. I prefer rehearsing the tunes until they are airtight, then recording the entire band live with the instruments isolated and the vocals are a "scratch" track. Then the vocals are dubbed in and solos dubbed in (if necessary). To me this gives the tunes more of a live feel. When presenting a demo to a prospective venue I want it to be an honest representation of what we sound like live. There might be minor tempo changes but to an untrained ear it's hardly noticable. I believe recording with a clicktrack (metronome) makes a tune sound too sterile. Just my opinion.

Click tracks can sometimes come in handy...I think of em as training wheels for certain kinds of songs, metered with certain types of tempos and rythyms. They are especially helpful in situations where a new band mate has to adapt to new original material. They would never do in a blues song arrangement...Kinda the antithesis of the 'feel' that we strive for in that type of music.

My view on recording... To me , the CD should represent the absolute, utmost well formed package of entertainment that you can commercially provide... Funny thing about audiences.. You never hear about them getting shit-faced when they sit down to listen to a CD... No Bic lighters in the air there... ...But in a live performance, they are more likely to cut loose ...and your best efforts get lost on em. (SOmetimes)...

I use a click track in everything and before I master, I just remove it.

The only way I wouldn't use a click is if we're recording the whole band (and most of the parts) at the same time..but if the drummer is competent with a click, they don't mind one running and the rest of the band can play to him/her. It shouldn't be a problem unless you've got a band of people who can't play in meter. If the band is the least bit sloppy with the meter, they will sound amateur because meter matters.


It doesn't make a band sound sterile unless you're quantizing a lot of midi keyboards, but it does make sure that everyone is playing in the same the same time zone. It also helps to have a reliable standard if you have to do any corrections or editing on someone's parts.

The only way I wouldn't use a click is if we're recording the whole band (and most of the parts) at the same time..but if the drummer is competent with a click, they don't mind one running and the rest of the band can play to him/her. It shouldn't be a problem unless you've got a band of people who can't play in meter. If the band is the least bit sloppy with the meter, they will sound amateur because meter matters.


It doesn't make a band sound sterile unless you're quantizing a lot of midi keyboards, but it does make sure that everyone is playing in the same the same time zone. It also helps to have a reliable standard if you have to do any corrections or editing on someone's parts.

Heres a q: If the drum track is pristine time, and a guitarist cant keep in line...then would a click track be any use?

Not saying I have perfect timing but one time years ago a trumpet player who was a conservatory of music graduate said the bass(me) and drummer in my band were speeding up and slowing down all the time. So we brought a metronome to the next rehearsal and the trumpet player tested us with the metronome. PERFECT timing on every song. He couldn't believe it. The outcome of all my studio work without the clicktrack has exceeded the few with it.

Being a novice and not being accustomed to the click track it really just threw us off.

Now if we'd been rehearsing to one it may have worked better, but no, no click track for me / us.

The engineer was astounded on how easily we fell into the grove to record some of the little insert fixes without the click track. Especially our drummer.

But that is how we practice ... "OK I screwed up on the last stanza of the bridge lets go from there"

I guess it's all about what your accustomed to.

Not saying I have perfect timing but one time years ago a trumpet player who was a conservatory of music graduate said the bass(me) and drummer in my band were speeding up and slowing down all the time. So we brought a metronome to the next rehearsal and the trumpet player tested us with the metronome. PERFECT timing on every song. He couldn't believe it. The outcome of all my studio work without the clicktrack has exceeded the few with it.

Trumpet players are not rhythm players, especially ones from conservatories. The big thing is exciting parts can be speeded up in thought when actually a good rhythm section is just pumping it up.
Your studio work with out a click track probably includes timing that is so close it only adds a natural feel to it,cool.

What really blows is when you try to come up with a studio version, and the live version is sooo much better because of the feel.

Well my best answer is... it depends. I have recorded both ways and the music style and quality of players matters a lot. I would probably never use a click track on the blues. It demands a little ebb and flow to the tempo as long as there is not too much drift. Led Zeppelin were pretty famous for ebb and flow in their recordings and it was part of their groove.

On a more technical piece like Satriani, Dream Theater, or Al Dimeola, I think a basic click track is required. The goal is technical precision here instead of feel and groove. No room for variation.

I have thrown out tracks that we invested a lot of time and effort in, only to get into mixdown and realize the tempo drift is unacceptable. My fault for not checking tempo carefully during the basic tracks. I have also thrown out tracks that were completely sterilized by strict adherence to the mighty click. We could never find the groove.

Of the tracks currently up on our site, none were recorded with a click and you can hear some ebb and flow. They were recorded quickly as live demos in our rehearsal studio with only vocal and a few solo or percussion overdubs. These tracks were intended to sound as live as possible and not to represent precise, polished studio recordings. So far they have served their purpose well.

So yes, click tracks can be useful but it depends on the music and the players.

Well said J7!!!!!!!

I'm using a Fender G-Dec with a metronome preset loud as I can (its only 15 watts) and I'm loving it. Recording my prac sessions and songs have convinced me that having something like that is necessary.

Oddly enough - it wasn't a problem when I was playing bass. It all just seemed natural. Guitar is a bit different. (at least for me)

Guitar has something I had not considered before - sound decay. You hit a real sweet sounding chord at high volume and can often mistake the time of the sound decay for the meter. It ain't. i caught myself waiting up to two or three beats longer than I should have to make changes. I'm adjusting.

Talbot

Bob, I'm gonna put up a scratch track that I threw together yesterday. Spent about 5 hours playing all the parts. It is about 2 BPM to slow. As I was recording the tracks the biggest thing that kept SMACKING me in the face was the perfect timing and boredom of the drum loop. I tried to add some guitar licks but there was NO feeling. Called rigged & ready.

I need that REAL drummer more than any other player. Just the feel.
Funny you can actually see it on computer.
J7 kinda send it all.

Nope, no click track the tempo becomes too mechanical and not organic as humans playing music are, who said that robotic precision drumming translates to better listening pleasure, Def Leopard recorded and play live with metronome never liked the final results of their playing.

Click track is a practicing tool and IMO should never be part of a recording or live performance.

Stay cool people take a day off and go swimming, it’s too damn hot.

I'm so out of practice, it's a must right now. But i work alone. I believe the click track helps someone like me. To be able to tweak the tempo till it matches what I'm playing without it being a debate is alright by me.
But I think it has more to do with how seasoned you are and how well you jell with one another as a band.
Also by using one, it leaves no question if the drums are right imo. If the drums are off everything else follows. Little nuances are one thing (Blues) but playing a floating tempo is never good.

So

It took you 20+ years to perfect your playin' and it took all that time to perfect the sound you want for that 3 min 28 sec song.

and now you want to spend 4 min's to record a lifetime achivement.

I don't frikken think so.

The recording proccess is just as important. Period.

Damm


I think I almost got pissed off thinking about this.

I need a beer.