General Music Chat

Something New for me, that I must learn to master for the sake of keeping the guitar's intonations correct...
Any comments, tips, suggestions?

PS My Guitar is a Gretsh 5120 Electromatic Hollowbody (As shown in the profile pick. The Bigsby bar is Kewl!, I love the Road house sound it produces and It realy plays well...Clean action... (I'm teaching my self Voodoo Child on it)

I'm not sure what a " floating bridge" is.

Picture ???

If you are speaking about bridges that have a sliding wood base, I haven't had any problems with them. However, when using a Bigsby or any other vibrato you should use the beveled saddle mount that tilts with the Vibrato so it gets back into proper intonation. Gibson makes a tuneamatic bridge for that purpose. It works with most arch tops and it keeps intonation pretty good. I had an Anniversary model Gretch (Archtop) and I used a Gibson bridge on it. I also have a full sized Epiphone Zenith, their biggest archtop similar to Gibsons Super 400, and it also has the Gibson tuneamatic on it.

Without the rocker saddle holder the bridge would sometimes slide with heavier Bigsby action, but the rocker saddle mount helps to avoid that problem. The bottom of the rocker is beveled in a V shape so it will rock, as opposed to the standard flat bottomed unit.

I always had a vibrato on my guitars as I like the effect you can get with it. That and the fact that the Ventures were an early inspiration. I still use a vibrato a lot, but now I play mostly Strats. Light Strats made with Poplar using rosewood fingerboards sound quite a bit like an archtop to me. However I prefer Swampash and Alder Strats with Maple fingerboards these days. (But I still love those big "F" hole archtop guitars.}

Did I miss the boat or was that what you were wondering?

Slacker

I got a Strat Lonestar with some mods that include a floating bridge and a metal nut. I have no idea how this stuff works. It goes out of tune about as much as my old fashioned Tele Esquire - which means not too much.

since my action is sweet and the sound is fine (maple neck) I remain ignorant but not content with being clueless. I took it to the Music store to have a pal look at it and he said 'its fine - you've got it exactly right." Whatever "right" may be...

thanks for the info
Talbot

If you are speaking about bridges that have a sliding wood base, I haven't had any problems with them. However, when using a Bigsby or any other vibrato you should use the beveled saddle mount that tilts with the Vibrato so it gets back into proper intonation. Gibson makes a tuneamatic bridge for that purpose. It works with most arch tops and it keeps intonation pretty good. I had an Anniversary model Gretch (Archtop) and I used a Gibson bridge on it. I also have a full sized Epiphone Zenith, their biggest archtop similar to Gibsons Super 400, and it also has the Gibson tuneamatic on it.

Without the rocker saddle holder the bridge would sometimes slide with heavier Bigsby action, but the rocker saddle mount helps to avoid that problem. The bottom of the rocker is beveled in a V shape so it will rock, as opposed to the standard flat bottomed unit.

I always had a vibrato on my guitars as I like the effect you can get with it. That and the fact that the Ventures were an early inspiration. I still use a vibrato a lot, but now I play mostly Strats. Light Strats made with Poplar using rosewood fingerboards sound quite a bit like an archtop to me. However I prefer Swampash and Alder Strats with Maple fingerboards these days. (But I still love those big "F" hole archtop guitars.}

Did I miss the boat or was that what you were wondering?

Slacker, you nailed it. Sans, if you catch this post, the Floating Bridge is the part of the guitar where you typically thread your strings over. Tellys and strats have fixed bridges, meaning they don't slide or move. Floating bridges slide and move...and are actually held down to the body of the guitar by the tension of the strings. Becuase floating bridges 'move' and slide...This can effect the intonation of the string, which in turn, can make keeping the strings tuned a bit difficult. Its actually quite annoying...

Slacker is referring to Arch-top.. If I'm not mistken , that means that the base of the bridge is shaped to contour the body of the guitar (as opposed to resting a flat rectangle piece of wood across the body of the guitar) This is especially important if you have a hollow body with that classic shape. In my Case I have the arch-top as well.

Slacker, you may already know this but I recently found out how to start the reference position of the Bridge...

1) Distance of the floating bridge from 21st (or 22nd) fret on the finger board should equal the same distance as the distance of the neck bridge, from 21st (or 22nd) fret on the board. if that made any sense...
2) Then to tune, start with Low E (6th) to pitch, then tune its False harmonic (upper fret) to pitch
3) Repeat step 2 with Hi E (1st) , same way...

If they don't reconcile, you have to slide the bridge. SLide back If harmonics are Sharp, Slide Forward if harmonics Flat. ( I may have that reversed)


To me its a bitch of a process. My Guitar still gets out of tune by mid song of anything I play... (Especially if I use the Bigsby). I don;t know if its my new strings or not... But I'm afraid I got a show piece, and might have to run with a different model for performance.

Any tips?

I'm not sure what a " floating bridge" is.

Picture ???

If you look at my profilepic.. The guitar has 2 pick ups and a device behind them 9Toward back end of guitar) . That's a floating Bridge.

Well not to be an ass, but if your playing technique is getting the guitar out of tune, then I would move to something with a fixed bridge. years ago I used to play strats and I couldnt keep them in tune, so for electrics I use Les Pauls now, I do have a Gibson ES 175, that is pretty cool and might have the sound you are looking for with the guitar.

I guess Im lazy cause i quit trying to set my guitars up years ago, I have a friend whos pretty slick with all that so every few monthes or so I take him a couple of mine and let him change the strings and set them up.

Good Luck

The only tip I have is to use the Gibson rocker saddle holder on the bridge base. Other than that you could put a thin piece of double adhesive under each foot after making sure all the polish is off the sweet spot.

I played my arch top "F" hole for 8 years on a band stand with no intonation problems, and I used a vibrato a lot. I also have a ES355TD arch top that has a floating bridge. I never had problems with that either. If you are dive bombing not much will help.

Double sided sticky Scotch tape might help resolve everything. To do this set the bridge in the best position. Then put tape (Masking will do) along side of the trailing edge of the feet of the bridge, and a strip on the outer edge as well, so you can properly center it where it should rest. That way you know where to put it after you add the sticky tape to the bottom of the feet. By the way, I always had to cock the bridge to get perfect intonation. The low E was always about 1/8 to 1/4th further away from the neck than the high E string to get perfect intonation. I always set ALL the saddles at mid point, adjusted the bridge, and then used the saddle adjustments to tweak the intonation. It always worked for me. .

The only tip I have is to use the Gibson rocker saddle holder on the bridge base. Other than that you could put a thin piece of double adhesive under each foot after making sure all the polish is off the sweet spot.

I played my arch top "F" hole for 8 years on a band stand with no intonation problems, and I used a vibrato a lot. I also have a ES355TD arch top that has a floating bridge. I never had problems with that either. If you are dive bombing not much will help.

Double sided sticky Scotch tape might help resolve everything. To do this set the bridge in the best position. Then put tape (Masking will do) along side of the trailing edge of the feet of the bridge, and a strip on the outer edge as well, so you can properly center it where it should rest. That way you know where to put it after you add the sticky tape to the bottom of the feet. By the way, I always had to cock the bridge to get perfect intonation. The low E was always about 1/8 to 1/4th further away from the neck than the high E string to get perfect intonation. I always set ALL the saddles at mid point, adjusted the bridge, and then used the saddle adjustments to tweak the intonation. It always worked for me. .

Exactly.. Mine is just about 1/4 inch oblique, across the face of the guitar. I've been tweaking the saddles and had decent luck. I've agonized whether or not to adhere the bridge as a permanent fixture or to just mark it... (I shudder to think that I got the setting wrong and then went and made it permanent)
Whenever I start entering into the complexities, I botch it up. The tape idea is pretty common one ...Some folks have even alluded to using some wood or other resin...to make the foot stickier.

Well not to be an ass, but if your playing technique is getting the guitar out of tune, then I would move to something with a fixed bridge. years ago I used to play strats and I couldnt keep them in tune, so for electrics I use Les Pauls now, I do have a Gibson ES 175, that is pretty cool and might have the sound you are looking for with the guitar.

I guess Im lazy cause i quit trying to set my guitars up years ago, I have a friend whos pretty slick with all that so every few monthes or so I take him a couple of mine and let him change the strings and set them up.

Good Luck

I don;t think playing technique makes that much of a difference. More likely, its the String Gauge... Some guitarists use a really light gauge, and the action barely needs to be touched... So that would not put a lot of stress on the bridge.. Others use med or heavy gauge , hence more stress... Acoustic players, like my self, do need to adapt to a lighter touch over-all when switching to electrics. (I've been known to put death grip on many chords, where it was no longer necessary to do so)

Also, the Bigsby Vibrato/ tremolo bars..really beat the crap out of the tuning...cause the literally push on the floating bridge that's being held down by the strings. Floaters are inclined to cause drastic changes...

Slacker

I tried to play one of your songs and broke two fingers!

Talbot