General Music Chat

Okay gang,

In my quest to keep some music topics on this board, here's my week #2 question:

How do you handle venues (bars) that don't want to pay?

I'm not asking this for bands that are pros or have established asking prices - I know you folks just skip.

But supposed you're new, you want to be heard, you want to play and you have an opportunity to play a place, but you're not going to get paid or play for the door. The owner says, "If it's good we can talk about pay for the next show and getting you in here on a regular rotation."

Your thoughts community?

Around here original bands play for the door. Period.

Cover bands can negotiate a hard price but unless you're really good it will be in the $300-400 range. Only the top echelon bands make $1000 or more a night.

Play everywhere you can and don't worry about the money so much. If you're good it will come. If you're not you don't deserve to be paid.

I'd say...DO IT!!! You have to get out there and make a name for yourself somehow, and that's a perfect way to do it. I've been in many bands and almost every single one did free shows here and there just to be heard (this band included). It's even better to open up for a band that thinks that they're really something and worth a certain amount of $, then obliterate them while doing your part for free. The next time around, you'd be the big dog. Been there...done that, and it's awesome every time.

I agree with jimmy, to a point.

Imho, you should always try to get paid, some sort of guarantee. I realize that there are areas where this just isn't feasible, but in my own area, yeah, I'll play for a lesser amount, once. But I want to be sure i'll be paid at least a certain amount.

This is true both for any band I'm in, & my solo work.

Solo stuff - there is no "door," so I expect a guaranteed amount.

This question cropped up before I think? GLAD YOU DID IT THOUGH.
I haven't played out yet but I imagine I'll play for anything I can get in a band or solo, hoping a band in any case.

I live in a highly competitive area, you cannot throw a stone without hitting a band. Venue owners know this and therefore make the rules. If you live in an area that doesn't have as many bands/musicians you might have more 'hand'.

Colors I know you want to play but what I found thru the year sis that the places that I played for free always wanted us for free, DIdnt really matter how good we did.

I dont know how you handle this. If you need to hone your live act then you can look at it as reahearsal I guess. Maybe get a video that you can use for other gigs or even bring other club owners in to see you play live.

It seems that once you set your price you are stuck.

Thats just my opinion.

Im fighting this issue right now with a couple of venues that have changed hands. Im talking places that we draw good crowds too, they want us to come in an play so they can see us. One of them actually used to come see us himself all the time, but he has bought 3 bars in our market so everything changes.

We may have to resort back to playing for the door again just to get a little more pay than the norm.

Im with Jimmy in my market cover bands play for 200-400 a night. Original bands benerally get put on a multi band deal and the main group may get the door but at a lot of the places they dont pay them anything.

We were playing 3-5 times a month a year ago, we raised our asking price to 650 and have only booked a couple of gigs. One place closed the night before we were supposed to play.

I always say this but the goal shouldnt be just to play a gig, if thats all you want set up in your neighbors yard and have yur own gig. If you are going into a bar they want people if you can produce people on a regular basis then play for the door and make all you cna make.

Good Luck

For me really so long as who I am with are settled in the knowledge that it takes time to get both a following and finance support together by way of paying gigs it should be ok. I know everyone isn't the same but you have to start somewhere. Back when I didn't have the tools I do now, I never had a problem getting bums on seats since I was on the ball with letting people know about stuff.

Come to think about it I don't think I've ever done a pay at the door gig? We've always settled for a price first which was always minimal at the start, then created a proving ground of sorts.

In any case this will be an interesting thread to look back on when I'm there once more. Forewarned is forearmed so to speak.
Nice one Colors.

with a can o gasoline

*(;>)-~



"I know my sh*t stinks"

This question comes down to entirely different answers depending on what your band does, Jimmy is right about that-

My originals band does "showcases" (for free) on weeknights to get weekend gigs. Most of the gigs we've showcased for end up being paid (the resulting gigs, that is), although certainly not all. For an originals band, we play mostly paid shows now, but that was after 1.5 years of playing every open mic, showcase, coffee house, bistro, and brewery from here to NJ, many more than once...

And even still, we sometimes get paid less than $100 per show. Try splitting $60 4 ways.. it's almost sad, but original music comes with that price. You absolutely must establish yourselves as desirable and able to bring a crowd if you want to get paid. The generous application of a tip jar and merch sales are our real bread and butter. Many of you might be amazed at how much you can earn with a tip jar, and a little humility and honesty in asking for donations.

My covers band? We get paid a standard rate, or on a rare occasion will play for a reduced fee + door if they don't know us and don't want to pay for a "maybe". We never play free unless it's charity. We're getting $500 next month for ONE 40-minute set at a local festival But like the originals, it's also about being established.

A cover-band is basically hired to be a "live" jukebox and "paid" to entertain a crowd or client base. It's insulting to any musician when a venue expects a cover-band to play for free.. ever! unless it's charity, of course.

LOL!

with a can o gasoline
*(;>)-~

Colors I know you want to play but what I found thru the year sis that the places that I played for free always wanted us for free, DIdnt really matter how good we did.

I dont know how you handle this. If you need to hone your live act then you can look at it as reahearsal I guess. Maybe get a video that you can use for other gigs or even bring other club owners in to see you play live.

It seems that once you set your price you are stuck.

Thats just my opinion.

Oh, don't worry about me JW We've made our choices in the bands I work in, each band being different, so they are different choices.

I was bringing the question up so (a) we get some musical content on these boards and (b) because I'm generally curious how everyone else is handling it and what their experiences have been.

And the answers so far have been good reading So thanks everyone!

It's insulting to any musician when a venue expects a cover-band to play for free.. ever! unless it's charity, of course.

No offense to anyone here, but I never understood this philosophy. It actually makes me ROFLMFAO.

We're in a little different situation than most you guys.
We play for the love of playing and because it is a mission of ours.
We accept "love offerings" as they are called, and some have been pretty nice.
We also play for food.