Musician Forum - Band Discussion Board - BandMix

Of course in tune is the best, but let's say the rest of a band is in tune, and either the singer, or one instrument is a wee bit "pitchy", if it's flat it's much less jarring to my ears than a part that is the equal amount sharp. I find this particularly true with vocals.

If you always C sharp you'll never B flat.


Sorry couldn't help myself.

Dajax wrote:Of course in tune is the best, but let's say the rest of a band is in tune, and either the singer, or one instrument is a wee bit "pitchy", if it's flat it's much less jarring to my ears than a part that is the equal amount sharp. I find this particularly true with vocals.

I think it depends on the situation. At times in the studio (or live setting), when the musicians are recording a composition with a major progression, a very upbeat brightness in the tempo and tone, you might be able to slide with having your guitar or vocals slightly sharp and sound good. The opposite with minor progressions with dark, foreboding energy and being a little flat maybe even beneficial. I also feel that instruments with melodic roles such as guitars and vocals have more artistic license with consonance and dissonance. As for the lower register instruments with the fundemental pedal notes, like bass guitars, it is important to be in tune. I hope that makes sense.

'Out of key' is out of key, man.
Doesn't matter a whit if it's flat or sharp.
Bad is bad; who cares if it's bad for this reason, or bad for that reason.
.
If someone sounds out of key, everyone who notices always say that they're singing flat.
I had a singer who sang off key.
And - always sharp, never flat.
The point should be - an off-key singer makes the whole band look bad.
.
Sharp, flat, sirening up, sirening down . . .
Who cares, eh?
.
Bad is bad; learn to sing, - or get replaced.

RhythmMan wrote:'Out of key' is out of key, man.
Doesn't matter a whit if it's flat or sharp.
Bad is bad; who cares if it's bad for this reason, or bad for that reason.
.
If someone sounds out of key, everyone who notices always say that they're singing flat.
I had a singer who sang off key.
And - always sharp, never flat.
The point should be - an off-key singer makes the whole band look bad.
.
Sharp, flat, sirening up, sirening down . . .
Who cares, eh?
.
Bad is bad; learn to sing, - or get replaced.

SAME!!!

My ears are twitchy and if you are flat/sharp I am the very first one to notice. PLEASE BE ABLE TO CARRY A TUNE EVEN IF YOU NEED A BUCKET, DO WHAT YOU HAVE TO DO.

if a person is singing out of tune, I doubt they can control which end (sharp of flat) they hit, otherwise I'm sure they would opt for in-tune. As such, you'll get natural flat singers and natural sharp singers cuz they can't help it, so really, you're just being prejudiced against sharp singers!

I'm kidding

Nope RM in spite of what you say, sharp bugs me more

Some of the most famous rock vocalist of our time could not sing for shyt if held in an classical context.

Just saying:

I have no problem with that at all. It's just I don't have the range, Yeah play me a note and I can make the lights light. Doesn't mean I am a singer however.

RhythmMan wrote:I actually helped train a singer by using a guitar tuner.
I played a note on the guitar, and had them sing it.
Then I showed them the tuner reacting - Waaay in the red.
.
You think you can sing pretty good?
Yeah?
Pull out your guitar tuner, hit a note on your guitar - and hit that same note with your voice - and HOLD it in key.
.
Sound easy?
Ha!
Yeah - you just watch that tuner go sharp and flat and sharp and flat again . . .
It's hard as hell for most singers. But - keep trying for a few days, and the biofeedback you get WILL improve your singing.
It doesn't take a real lot of time to fix a problem when you first admit there IS a problem, learn how to fix it - and then actually practice.
.
And - yeah, some singers are probably beyond help . . .

when I was talking sharp as better than flat I was talking cents,,,, 1or 2 . most instruments will never play in that exact range,especially fretted instruments were intonation must be maintained more by added pressure.
Also J santos raises an interesting point about flat in minor keys.
Older tunings were different and that is the reason why compositions were written in specific keys, in the good old days.... any other thoughts anyone.

I have never been able to use a guitar tuner for voice. There are too many tones involved with a single voice, so yeah, it wanders all over the place. I'm not teaching or being an opera singer, & the machine can't work for me.

As far as the sharp vs flat thing - there are neural reasons that sharp sounds "worse" than flat to most of us. In fact, for some singers, slightly flat (far less than a 1/4 tone) sounds best to the human ear.

Now, I'll admit that I read these things somewhere, but I don't remember where, & I'm not gonna go on an internet safari to refind it all, cuz I remember it & accept it (&, for that matter, I apply it.

Think about the piano. It is purposely tuned slightly out of tune. Why? It sounds better than way! It sounds more in tune that way.

Phil it does work. RM is right. What I was trying to say very badly and no offense to RM is that, OK I can reach it and sustain it, but it doesn't teach me how to get around musically.

philbymon wrote:I have never been able to use a guitar tuner for voice. There are too many tones involved with a single voice, so yeah, it wanders all over the place. I'm not teaching or being an opera singer, & the machine can't work for me.

As far as the sharp vs flat thing - there are neural reasons that sharp sounds "worse" than flat to most of us. In fact, for some singers, slightly flat (far less than a 1/4 tone) sounds best to the human ear.

Now, I'll admit that I read these things somewhere, but I don't remember where, & I'm not gonna go on an internet safari to refind it all, cuz I remember it & accept it (&, for that matter, I apply it.

Think about the piano. It is purposely tuned slightly out of tune. Why? It sounds better than way! It sounds more in tune that way.

Phil I just relistened to your bass playing and I don't think you realize that the overtones you generate are a bit sharp. really splitting hairs but that is why you have such a rich tone, it really makes your bass sing,and fill out the whole band.
I can't listen to my last song unless I go back and fix the parts that are slightly flat.
And yes flat playing does have it's place, I.E. the blues.