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Years ago the U.S. government sent an agent to an Indian reservation to interview an Indian chief who was reported to be well over 100 years old. The agent asked this venerable chief what he thought of all the aspects of civilization brought to North America by the white man. Here's his response: "Before white men came we had plenty of buffalo to hunt, much beavers and fish to catch. Indian wifes stay home and raise young ones. Indians free, no taxes, we follow game freely and avoid bad weather. Medicine men successfully treat illness, no fees. No alcoholic Indians. Very few wars among Indian tribes. Life good for Indians. Now we have high taxes. Reservation like prison. High crime. Bad pollution. No more buffalo, water polluted. Global warming. Many wars all over the world. Only the white man dumb enough to think he can improve Indian system."

Amen Great Cheif!

Historicaly inaccurate. But cute.
The indians were constantly at war with each other (not all tribes but most) Disease was rampant, as was starvation. The tribes along the Texas coast were giants among men 7ft tall was not unusual. They were canabalistic. Not only did they kill and eat anyone they could catch, but they ate there own dead as well.
The noble red man is a TV myth.
People are people. We were all created by the same, and the same.
Nobility comes from the heart of those whom choose to be noble.
It has nothing to do with race.

sanshouheil wrote:Historicaly inaccurate. But cute.
The indians were constantly at war with each other (not all tribes but most) Disease was rampant, as was starvation. The tribes along the Texas coast were giants among men 7ft tall was not unusual. They were canabalistic. Not only did they kill and eat anyone they could catch, but they ate there own dead as well.
The noble red man is a TV myth.
People are people. We were all created by the same, and the same.
Nobility comes from the heart of those whom choose to be noble.
It has nothing to do with race.

That may be true, but based on what has happened to native Americans and the gigantic mess we're in the Indians would have been better off pushing the first European settlers into the ocean.

I wont argue that point Bob. It's too bad my germanic ancesters didnt kick off in the Romans asses as well.
I could roam the Black Forest and be happy too.

What kind of diseases were the indians dying from before the white men came? I think the big diseases and viruses were imported. And let's not forget the spanish men --they started all of this crap

I thought it was gonna be an actual joke ....waiting for the punch line

Crip2Nite wrote:I thought it was gonna be an actual joke ....waiting for the punch line

The actual joke is our system of governemnt. We are trying to create by artificial means what the native Americans had achieved thousands of years ago, a society that existed in harmony with the Earth. WE are the joke.

One thing for sure is housing was much more affordable.

EasyKill, I am not going to treat you like a child and try to list all of the native diseases of the North American Continent.
You are a grown man, and well traveled apparently.
I would request you step away for a moment from propaganda, and look at history and the natural world through the lens of reality.
The peoples indiginous to the American continent suffered many parasitic diseases and STD's that were unknown to the european world.
We always hear about how they suffered small pox etc. But the true historical record shows that the trade was pretty even.
The earliest settlements, and settlers from europe suffered from the diseases that the indiginous peoples had developed some immunity and medical treatment for. The earliest settlement in what is now Canada was saved when the indians showed the europeans where to obtain citrus, thus preventing their death of scuvey.
Any forensic excavation of the indiginous peoples of the world show a very high mortality rate due to diseases related to poor nutrition and parasites.
Just like today, the waters the Mexicans drink daily will make you ill if you drink them, because you are not acclamated to them.
The trot is often fatal in the reality of the natural world, not just a nusence and waste of perfumed toilet paper used in an airconditioned home.

My lens of reality says we have BIG problems that ARE NOT anything but our own fault. Disease or no disease, our "civilization" is anything but civilized based on how we treat this Earth and each other. Despite whatever diseases they may have had, the indigenous people in North America got along far better with this Earth than the invading white men.

Perhaps Bob. For sure we have a mess on our hands.
It's my opinion that if the indiginous peoples of the new world had been industrius enough to invent a chain saw there would not have been a tree left when we got here.
It must be noted however that any peoples whom live, shall we say, less insulated from the harsh realities of nature, are more efficent as stewards of our environment.
It does not take long to figure out to not crap in your drinking water, when you have no hospitals.

Why does everybody have to sh*t on the "white man"? Is EVERYTHING our fault?? Especially stuff that happened over 200 years ago!?!? I wasnt even born yet! You look white, Bob, from your pic ..are you taking responsibility for this mess that we're in?

I believe I was shitting on all men.
After all, we are all the same.
And as far as the mess.
It may not be my "fault" But it is my responability.

Why is anything that happened over a generation ago blamed on anyone? The past is what keeps racism alive. I try not to be racist, and when I say "try" I mean that I was raised as a racist. Not in the sense that I was taught to hate anyone of a different race, just segregation of the races and that's a high hurdle to get over. I'm not sure that I ever will, but I try. I'm 54 now and about 5 years ago was the first time I ever had a black person stay over for the night. It was a black guy that sings at some of the festivals that I run sound for. He had come over one evening to talk music and we ended up talking until about 2 in the morning. He said he'd better go and that he'd have to be quiet so as not to wake his parents when he got to their house (he lived out of town and was staying with them for the weekend). I told him, if he didn't mind the couch, he could just crash here, so he did. The next morning we were drinking coffee and it hit me and I told him, "Man, you're the first black dude I've ever had stay over." I guess it just hadn't ever happened before because the situation had never come up. Anyway, it got me to thinking about my life and how I had grown out of racism to a point, but, to be honest with myself, I know it's still there a little bit however hard I try to hide it. My son, on the other hand, wasn't raised that way and doesn't have a racist bone in his body. But we were talking about "reparations" one day, and how far back should they go, and he said, "When black people talk to me about reparations, I tell them 'Sure, we'll pay you back for the 200 years of slavery, as soon as you pay the Jews back for the 2000 years of slavery.' because ancient Egyptians and Africans all kept the Jewish slaves." He wasn't being anti-black or pro-Jew, just looking at it from a logical point of view. The same could be said about the white man and the Indians, as the Indians did war with each other and take slaves and land from each other way before white men got here. We can't focus on the past and try to lay blame. We can only look to the present and the future and try not to let history repeat itself, so that our children and their children can live in a better world.
Peace, Ya'll!