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#78150 by Hayden King
Mon Aug 10, 2009 8:39 pm
Highlights of the Updated 2008/2009 Senate Minority Report featuring over 700 international scientists dissenting from man-made climate fears:


“I am a skeptic…Global warming has become a new religion.” - Nobel Prize Winner for Physics, Ivar Giaever.

“Since I am no longer affiliated with any organization nor receiving any funding, I can speak quite frankly….As a scientist I remain skeptical...The main basis of the claim that man’s release of greenhouse gases is the cause of the warming is based almost entirely upon climate models. We all know the frailty of models concerning the air-surface system.” - Atmospheric Scientist Dr. Joanne Simpson, the first woman in the world to receive a PhD in meteorology, and formerly of NASA, who has authored more than 190 studies and has been called “among the most preeminent scientists of the last 100 years.”

Warming fears are the “worst scientific scandal in the history…When people come to know what the truth is, they will feel deceived by science and scientists.” - UN IPCC Japanese Scientist Dr. Kiminori Itoh, an award-winning PhD environmental physical chemist.

“The IPCC has actually become a closed circuit; it doesn’t listen to others. It doesn’t have open minds… I am really amazed that the Nobel Peace Prize has been given on scientifically incorrect conclusions by people who are not geologists.” - Indian geologist Dr. Arun D. Ahluwalia at Punjab University and a board member of the UN-supported International Year of the Planet.

“So far, real measurements give no ground for concern about a catastrophic future warming.” - Scientist Dr. Jarl R. Ahlbeck, a chemical engineer at Abo Akademi University in Finland, author of 200 scientific publications and former Greenpeace member.

“Anyone who claims that the debate is over and the conclusions are firm has a fundamentally unscientific approach to one of the most momentous issues of our time.” - Solar physicist Dr. Pal Brekke, senior advisor to the Norwegian Space Centre in Oslo. Brekke has published more than 40 peer-reviewed scientific articles on the sun and solar interaction with the Earth.

“The models and forecasts of the UN IPCC "are incorrect because they only are based on mathematical models and presented results at scenarios that do not include, for example, solar activity.” - Victor Manuel Velasco Herrera, a researcher at the Institute of Geophysics of the National Autonomous University of Mexico

“It is a blatant lie put forth in the media that makes it seem there is only a fringe of scientists who don’t buy into anthropogenic global warming.” - U.S Government Atmospheric Scientist Stanley B. Goldenberg of the Hurricane Research Division of NOAA.

“Even doubling or tripling the amount of carbon dioxide will virtually have little impact, as water vapour and water condensed on particles as clouds dominate the worldwide scene and always will.” – . Geoffrey G. Duffy, a professor in the Department of Chemical and Materials Engineering of the University of Auckland, NZ.

“After reading [UN IPCC chairman] Pachauri's asinine comment [comparing skeptics to] Flat Earthers, it's hard to remain quiet.” - Climate statistician Dr. William M. Briggs, who specializes in the statistics of forecast evaluation, serves on the American Meteorological Society's Probability and Statistics Committee and is an Associate Editor of Monthly Weather Review.

“The Kyoto theorists have put the cart before the horse. It is global warming that triggers higher levels of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere, not the other way round…A large number of critical documents submitted at the 1995 U.N. conference in Madrid vanished without a trace. As a result, the discussion was one-sided and heavily biased, and the U.N. declared global warming to be a scientific fact.” - Andrei Kapitsa, a Russian geographer and Antarctic ice core researcher.

“I am convinced that the current alarm over carbon dioxide is mistaken...Fears about man-made global warming are unwarranted and are not based on good science.” - Award Winning Physicist Dr. Will Happer, Professor at the Department of Physics at Princeton University and Former Director of Energy Research at the Department of Energy, who has published over 200 scientific papers, and is a fellow of the American Physical Society, The American Association for the Advancement of Science, and the National Academy of Sciences.

“Nature's regulatory instrument is water vapor: more carbon dioxide leads to less moisture in the air, keeping the overall GHG content in accord with the necessary balance conditions.” – Prominent Hungarian Physicist and environmental researcher Dr. Miklós Zágoni reversed his view of man-made warming and is now a skeptic. Zágoni was once Hungary’s most outspoken supporter of the Kyoto Protocol.

“For how many years must the planet cool before we begin to understand that the planet is not warming? For how many years must cooling go on?.” - Geologist Dr. David Gee the chairman of the science committee of the 2008 International Geological Congress who has authored 130 plus peer reviewed papers, and is currently at Uppsala University in Sweden.

“Gore prompted me to start delving into the science again and I quickly found myself solidly in the skeptic camp…Climate models can at best be useful for explaining climate changes after the fact.” - Meteorologist Hajo Smit of Holland, who reversed his belief in man-made warming to become a skeptic, is a former member of the Dutch UN IPCC committee.

“The quantity of CO2 we produce is insignificant in terms of the natural circulation between air, water and soil... I am doing a detailed assessment of the UN IPCC reports and the Summaries for Policy Makers, identifying the way in which the Summaries have distorted the science.” - South Afican Nuclear Physicist and Chemical Engineer Dr. Philip Lloyd, a UN IPCC co-coordinating lead author who has authored over 150 refereed publications.

“Many [scientists] are now searching for a way to back out quietly (from promoting warming fears), without having their professional careers ruined.” - Atmospheric physicist James A. Peden, formerly of the Space Research and Coordination Center in Pittsburgh.

“All those urging action to curb global warming need to take off the blinkers and give some thought to what we should do if we are facing global cooling instead.” - Geophysicist Dr. Phil Chapman, an astronautical engineer and former NASA astronaut, served as staff physicist at MIT (Massachusetts Institute of Technology)

“Creating an ideology pegged to carbon dioxide is a dangerous nonsense…The present alarm on climate change is an instrument of social control, a pretext for major businesses and political battle. It became an ideology, which is concerning.” - Environmental Scientist Professor Delgado Domingos of Portugal, the founder of the Numerical Weather Forecast group, has more than 150 published articles.

“CO2 emissions make absolutely no difference one way or another….Every scientist knows this, but it doesn’t pay to say so…Global warming, as a political vehicle, keeps Europeans in the driver’s seat and developing nations walking barefoot.” - Dr. Takeda Kunihiko, vice-chancellor of the Institute of Science and Technology Research at Chubu University in Japan.

“The [global warming] scaremongering has its justification in the fact that it is something that generates funds.” - Award-winning Paleontologist Dr. Eduardo Tonni, of the Committee for Scientific Research in Buenos Aires and head of the Paleontology Department at the University of La Plata.

“Whatever the weather, it's not being caused by global warming. If anything, the climate may be starting into a cooling period.” -Atmospheric scientist Dr. Art V. Douglas, former Chair of the Atmospheric Sciences Department at Creighton University in Omaha, Nebraska, and is the author of numerous papers for peer-reviewed publications.

“But there is no falsifiable scientific basis whatever to assert this warming is caused by human-produced greenhouse gasses because current physical theory is too grossly inadequate to establish any cause at all.” - Chemist Dr. Patrick Frank, who has authored more than 50 peer-reviewed articles.

“The ‘global warming scare’ is being used as a political tool to increase government control over American lives, incomes and decision making. It has no place in the Society's activities.” - Award-Winning NASA Astronaut/Geologist and Moonwalker Jack Schmitt who flew on the Apollo 17 mission and formerly of the Norwegian Geological Survey and for the U.S. Geological Survey.

“Earth has cooled since 1998 in defiance of the predictions by the UN-IPCC….The global temperature for 2007 was the coldest in a decade and the coldest of the millennium…which is why ‘global warming’ is now called ‘climate change.’” - Climatologist Dr. Richard Keen of the Department of Atmospheric and Oceanic Sciences at the University of Colorado.

“I have yet to see credible proof of carbon dioxide driving climate change, yet alone man-made CO2 driving it. The atmospheric hot-spot is missing and the ice core data refute this. When will we collectively awake from this deceptive delusion?” - Dr. G LeBlanc Smith, a retired Principal Research Scientist with Australia’s CSIRO.


The full quotes of the scientists are later in this report: http://epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm? ... 9FAF4DCDB7

#78152 by jimmydanger
Mon Aug 10, 2009 8:45 pm
Dave Couture wrote:So, I'm still failing to understand your points :?


I am not surprised.

#78154 by Dave Couture
Mon Aug 10, 2009 9:05 pm
jimmydanger wrote:
Dave Couture wrote:So, I'm still failing to understand your points :?


I am not surprised.


pfff, aren't you pathetic!!! Maybe if you would have showed some coherence in your comments and throw some REAL facts!!! You spent a whole lot of time writing things that don't mean sh*t!

#78155 by CraigMaxim
Mon Aug 10, 2009 9:17 pm
Dave,

Jimmy didn't deserve that bro.

Saying:

"You didn't read my comments"

Is not the same as saying:

"Aren't you pathetic."


And your quoting of Jimmy seems to bear him out, that he did not say that "plants would die" because of increased co2. He said that they only use what they use. Not the same thing. You INFERED something he did not say.

And when he said:

"This isn't plant food"

When he had already agreed that they take in co2, then...

Isn't it more likely he is saying:

"This isn't MERE plant food, it isn't harmless!"

I think that was more in line with what he was saying, cause he had already stated himself, that they absorb co2 and release oxygen.

I find Jimmy to be downright unpatriotic at times, and yet, I still like him, and respect him as a musician. I listen to the CD he sent me FREE from time to time, and he is a good guy.

We just differ politically on certain issues, yet agree on others.

Alot of us here are like that. You'll also find some guys who disagree with me on alot of issues, suddenly be surprised to find me on the same side with them on others.

We're all brothers (and sisters) here!

#78163 by Dave Couture
Mon Aug 10, 2009 11:53 pm
Sorry, I see his comments differently! He accused me of being blinded by my political views. I just wanted him to back it up and he miserably failed!!!

I'm not going to pretend that I know everything about this topic and its variants, but I did study them and I've wrote my share of papers about them. I'm a GIS Specialist now, because I got a great job offer, during my grad studies. But, if the offer would have never happened, I would have finished my grad studies and I'll most likely be doing research, while teaching at some university. One thing for sure, I would have been one of those scientists who volunteered for the Minority Report...in a heart beat!!!!

Now, this may not mean sh*t to you and you might think that I'm being cocky, or something. That's fine, really! Personally, I'm just stating my qualifications to debate in this thread. I don't just Google stuff up and post them; while knowing I can't back it up...because I don't fully understand what I just posted! :lol:

This topic means a lot to me because politicians, the media and greenies have been twisting the real science around, to fit their personal agenda. Now, we are going to be taxed for our CO2 emission. What's next, breathing emission tax????

I'm just sick and tired of being called names, because I believe in something that goes against the flavor of the decade!!! It's not like I woke up one day and I've decided, just like that, to be a skeptic. I'm a skeptic because of all the science that I've learned, studied, read and wrote about, go against what politicians and alarmists are saying. Yes, the pollution level is alarming, yes the over-deforestation is bad and yes, over population is getting extremely dramatic (now at 6.8 Billion). So, let's fix those for now and leave the CO2 alone, for the time being...until further SCIENTIFIC STUDIES, not MODELS, can be made. And, when I say studies, I mean looking at every single variables that affects our climate, directly and indirectly; while leaving politic out of the equations!!!

Anyway, I guess it's like beating a dead horse!

#78164 by CraigMaxim
Tue Aug 11, 2009 12:24 am
Dave,

I didn't think you just googled a bunch of stuff. It seemed clear to me that you were knowledgeable on this issue. I respect your position on it, and your knowledge of it. On global warming I WOULD HAVE TO GOOGLE stuff. LOL - So I don't talk much about it, cause I don't know enough about it, and I agree, that some of the scientific community is still divided over it.

I prefer to stick to what I do believe strongly, and that is, that we are being unwise in our use of natural resources and are polluting the environment, to our detriment and to the detriment of future generations.

And...

Only Jimmy can speak for himself, but I perceived that he was being a little bit of a smartass, but not neccessarily as personally offensive as your responses were.

But I think you are both cool guys. And I know I have been personally offensive on here at times also, and usually regretted it.

We are often typing streams of conscious thought, and only later sometimes, realize that there may have been a better way of expressing something, that didn't require personal attacks.

Debates ger heated when people are passionate about an issue.

It's expected.

#78166 by Dave Couture
Tue Aug 11, 2009 12:33 am
:lol: I hear ya!

I like debating, but I hate being accused of something that I'm not :wink:

#78168 by ANGELSSHOTGUN
Tue Aug 11, 2009 12:52 am
You are in the wrong country DAVE . Last time you you crossed me I said let it GO. This time you go. See the the fourth line down ,Canada , Stay there and shut up, you don't live here and you have no right to sit in in judgement and tell us what the f**k to do. You CAN keep listening to all all our Great guitarists from THE USA, you might learn something.
Sorry I'm not going to to put up with some little I Know every thing asshole from canada like you.
REMEMBER ME. YEAH I' M THE GUY YOU WANTED TO PROVE YOUR SUPERIORITY OVER . You are a bully and and if you want a war YOU GOT IT BABY. :evil:

#78169 by ANGELSSHOTGUN
Tue Aug 11, 2009 12:54 am
YOU HAVE NO CONCEPT OF AMERICANS< YOU LOSE :evil:

#78170 by Dave Couture
Tue Aug 11, 2009 12:59 am
GONGHEAD wrote:Sorry I'm not going to to put up with some little I Know every thing asshole from canada like you.


WTF???

Dave Couture wrote:I'm not going to pretend that I know everything about this topic and its variants,



GONGHEAD wrote: have no right to sit in in judgement and tell us what the f**k to do.



And, for the record, I'm in no way telling ppl what to think or what to do. I'm only defending my points to a debate
Last edited by Dave Couture on Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:20 am, edited 4 times in total.

#78172 by ANGELSSHOTGUN
Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:07 am
No I'm not you are someone from out of our country interjecting all sorts of crap and from the last posts to me you are very quick to insult .GO HOME DAVE ,WE HAVE ENOUGH ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS TO DEAL WITH!! WE DON'T NEED ATTACKS FROM CYBERSPACE, AM I SHOUTING LOUD ENOUGH! :evil:

#78173 by ANGELSSHOTGUN
Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:12 am
YOU aren't making friends here with me after all the last sht you wrote. Go listen to TWIRL about the only good thing to come out of canada. Your whiskey ain't that good either. :evil:

#78174 by ANGELSSHOTGUN
Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:13 am
I AM SUCH AN IDIOT, KEEP GOING ASSHOLE :evil:

#78175 by Dave Couture
Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:14 am
GONGHEAD wrote:No I'm not you are someone from out of our country interjecting all sorts of crap and from the last posts to me you are very quick to insult .GO HOME DAVE ,WE HAVE ENOUGH ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS TO DEAL WITH!! WE DON'T NEED ATTACKS FROM CYBERSPACE, AM I SHOUTING LOUD ENOUGH! :evil:


You are such an idiot. First of all, this site is HOSTED IN CANADA, not the USA. So, I'm in my country...therefore, YOU ARE NOT, so shut the f**k up, you f**k lunatic!!!

The only thing you do well, is insulting ppl. Your mama must be proud of your accomplishments...you f**k ass wipe!

#78176 by ANGELSSHOTGUN
Tue Aug 11, 2009 1:14 am
OH YOU DELETED THAT ONE REAL QUICK :evil:

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