General Music Chat

You missed the analogy because I said "anyone" can strike a G note on a bass, and wasn't talking about a musician. To use another analogy, anyone can take a scalpel and cut flesh, but it doesn't make them a doctor.

I know what you meant.
But, the analogy was a little flawed...and offensive.

Mike, I'm sorry you've only seen legalistic religion. I hated religion when I was an atheist and I hate it even more now. Though I'm sure it's hard to understand the difference, I'm talking about faith.

Oh, don't get me wrong.
I've seen all types.
But, the really nasty ones hide behind the protection of the nicer ones.
Blending in with them gives the illusion of respectability (in THEIR mind anyway).
The common thread between them is a flaw in their logic.
It's holding the curtain up over "THE GREAT AND POWERFUL OZ", if you get my meaning.
Pull on that thread.
Then, the whole thing comes crashing down and they are exposed for what they really are.

I kinda hate to shatter the illusions of decent people.
But, they are being used as cover by the REAL targets.

You've never heard me say "you need to go to church" or "you need to become a christian" or "you need to stop being a sinner" because I don't think that is what anyone needs. They need to take a step of faith...and God will take care of the rest.

I have not once ever condemned pagans for being pagan, drunks for drinking, or sinners for sinning. What else would they do? To browbeat someone into doing something they don't want to do is not God's way and never has been.

My decision of faith was made in spite of the church. I'm famously outspoken in churches and prefer hanging out with musicians, to being in a christian discussion group. I try to respect all people...but that doesn't mean I'm good at being a floor mat. I have rebuked churches from their own stages for being legalistic pinheads. I have been barred from more churches as a believer than I ever was as a pagan.

But the stereotypes you portray don't represent "real" christians. They represent people who draw power of manipulation from religion, or people who have been taught that by legalistic pinheads. That comes from a long history of greek (humanistic) philosophy that entered the church in the 2nd century. The early church fathers were already corrupt.

EVERYONE always says, "Oh, those aren't REAL Christians."
Well, someone needs to clue THEM in to that.

I am glad that you haven't said things like "you need to get saved, Mike", "you need Jesus in your heart."
I am sick of those people.
I don't even TRY being polite anymore.
I just tell 'em to leave me the f*ck alone and avoid them.

In the late 60s there was something called the Jesus People Movement. Hippies started getting saved and found that they weren't welcome in the (legalistic) church because of their appearance. They began a reform movement that is still in the minority, but it rejects anything that is based on cultural morality as opposed to the biblical mandate given by Jesus to love our neighbor and bless those who hate us. We are a community without walls.

Admittedly, what I'm doing in this conversation might not seem like blessing to you but if I didn't care at all, I'd just ignore you. But you're exactly like I was so I understand where you're coming from.

Don't get me started on Jesus freak hippies!
I blame them for Ronald Reagan, Jerry Falwell, The PMRC, and the current state of things.

I'm sorry if I always come off sounding like I'm browbeating everybody.
But, these sort of arguments often start because of something very simple being taken the wrong way.
FishermanBob just about accused me of being a Stalinist, just because I posted a list of beliefs that I happen to agree with.
The political discussions often drag this into it too.
Jeff claimed that Robin Hood was not a hero, but just a thief who deserved every punishment the kingdom could dish out to him.
Not very "Christian" if you ask me.

Mikey apparently our opinions of "not very christian" are polar opposites! The problem I have with "you atheist" is you believe man is in control of his destiny? My belief is man is SOOOooo insignificant in the grand scheme. Gosh I have spelled it out and deleted our insignificance and I can't even put it into words how REALLY small we are? Only an overly evolved APE could be so arrogant that WE BELIEVE we could effect mother nature even enough to cause "global warming"

Having said that you go ahead medicating yourself and hating for "your reasons" in ALL YOUR EMPTYNESS and trying to explain the DOMINANCE mankind has on the EARTH, Moon, Sun, and all of creation for that matter! I KNOW mankind WILL NEVER EVER figure it out! IMO we are here for but an instant and will be gone just like the dinosaurs. So why are we here? What do we matter? We are but an Ameba!

Mikey apparently our opinions of "not very christian" are polar opposites! The problem I have with "you atheist" is you believe man is in control of his destiny? My belief is man is SOOOooo insignificant in the grand scheme. Gosh I have spelled it out and deleted our insignificance and I can't even put it into words how REALLY small we are? Only an overly evolved APE could be so arrogant that WE BELIEVE we could effect mother nature even enough to cause "global warming"

Having said that you go ahead medicating yourself and hating for "your reasons" in ALL YOUR EMPTYNESS and trying to explain the DOMINANCE mankind has on the EARTH, Moon, Sun, and all of creation for that matter! I KNOW mankind WILL NEVER EVER figure it out! IMO we are here for but an instant and will be gone just like the dinosaurs. So why are we here? What do we matter? We are but an Ameba!

I never said man was in control of his destiny.
Never.
But, at least he can have an influence on the outcomes.
Better than nothing.
Better than chalking it all up to "God's will."

Man IS insignifigant in the grand scheme of things.
Only an arrogant Christian would believe that the universe was created just for him.

Global warming?
I'm sorry if science makes you feel insignificant.
I guess you missed the decades of the Cold War, when the United States and Russia had enough nuclear weapons aimed at each other TO DESTROY THE EARTH FIVE TIMES OVER.
Back then, every Christian claimed that was gonna be it.
That's how the book of Revelations ends.
We all go up in a radioactive cloud of smoke.
Well, we are still here.
Hiroshima & Nagasaki notwithstanding.

Yeah, I have to medicate myself.
People like you drive me goddamn crazy, that's why.
Would you rather I go postal on innocent people, before blowing my head off?

Why are we here?
Why do we matter?
What does it matter?
We're HERE!
Isn't that enough?
"Life is without meaning. You bring the meaning to it. The meaning of life is whatever you ascribe it to be. Being alive is the meaning."
- Joseph Campbell

I can hardly wait until you see the light, Mike. YOU are going to be great in the Kingdom and lead many to faith.

MikeN

Man IS insignifigant in the grand scheme of things.
Only an arrogant Christian would believe that the universe was created just for him.

ANd only a fool would turn down such an offer.

I can hardly wait until you see the light, Mike. YOU are going to be great in the Kingdom and lead many to faith.

You can lead a Christian to knowledge. But, you can't make them think.

I can hardly wait until you see the light, Mike. YOU are going to be great in the Kingdom and lead many to faith.

You can lead a Christian to knowledge. But, you can't make them think.

hahaha...yep...can hardly wait.

Fat chance. But you can daydream if it makes you happy Yod.

If it could happen to me, it can happen to anyone....even you!






wouldn't that be a hoot?

Then I hope you never get pregnant!





Oopps, just checked. I thought that was a female STD only, but evidently not.

Whew...one more thing I don't have to worry about since "that day"

Yod

' can hardly wait until you see the light, Mike. YOU are going to be great in the Kingdom and lead many to faith. '

I have been thinking the same thing. Our Mike just needs to take a little trip - say, to Damascus?

I was really pissed at God for a long time. Then a rare flash of insight and I realized that I was pissed at Someboby. Haven't been the same since and glad of it.

Is life still a pain in the ass? Yes. It rains on both sides of the street. Do I bitch at everyone about their 'sins?' No. Too busy bitching at myself about my own. Hard to stay pissed when you realize that Somebody is smiling sadly at you and wishing you the very best.

Frankly I believe someone who is actively pissed at God has a better chance at salvation than the cultural believers who just go to church because, well, just because...

Talbot