General Music Chat

I know what you guys are saying here about evolution. I just don't think humanity was birthed from a tadpole or anything, otherwise that would still be the way human lives were formed. That's just what I believe about that.

Human evolution is interesting though. People are living longer, children develop faster physically, and everyone just seems to have adapted to living a faster way of life. In the past twenty years things have changed dramatically. Even the English language is different. I wonder what things will be like in another twenty years...heck, even ten years from now.

The most misunderstood and miss quoted scientific study of all time would be Darwin's work.
And taken way out of it's original context to the extreme.

All one needs do is try to get into a suit of armor from the dark ages to know that man is evolving.

Evolve or parish is the way of nature.

I know not what form we were originally created in other than " in God's image"
( and I interpret that as having a immortal soul )

The grandeur of nature over millions of years, like the creative process itself, is beyond my comprehension in it's magnificence & beauty.

And I can live with that.

The great thing about you and Craig, George is that you guys still have logical, open minds even though you a religious. Unfortunately there are many others who are not as logical or open minded. Their minds are shut tighter than a steel beaver trap.

Hey Craig,
Geez, long posting!

I don't feel like quoting your comments, as it is a little late and I'm tired, but let me address a few points, and please repeat anything else specifically you want me to address!

But, you took the time to write all THAT? Wow! I’d hate to see you after a few cups of coffee!

You have assumed a definitive position, based on probability, due to lack of evidence. This is often a reasonable approach, for example... superstitions generally have NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER to back their claims up... e.g. 7 Years of bad luck for breaking a mirror. The big problem in your position, of course, would be your INCONSISTENCY! I am suspecting, that as a rational, scientifically grounded individual, you leave open the POSSIBILITY that aliens and alien spaceships may exist, yes? And yet there is NO PHYSICAL EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER that has proven that this is true! Yet you still likely accept the POSSIBILITY of it! I would agree with you completely! I also, believe it is POSSIBLE! Where we differ however, is that you are not CONSISTENT, as proven by the fact, that you do not extend the same courtesy to "God" as you would to "Aliens".

My positions, on most things, are subject to change with new evidence. As I said, no one should REALLY take a 100% position on ANYTHING. But, 99.999% will do. I TRY to be consistent. As far as being unfair to God, there’s just a higher probability of the existence of extra-terrestrials.

This would indicate that BIAS rules your decision on this, rather than FAIRNESS and LOGIC and CONSISTENCY.

It is arguable that experience colors our perceptions to such a degree that SOME bias is inevitable in everything. Logic and consistency help guide us around it. I do my best. But, life isn’t fair.

You mentioned something about God's unwillingness to reveal Himself to the uninitiated or unbelieving... let me address that briefly...

If I had a parent that was out of country, and communicated with me through a shortwave radio on a daily basis, but YOU, did not have a shortwave radio, and consequently could not interpret the signal being sent, through your walls, and through your home, and THROUGH YOUR BODY as well, then... you may very well doubt my claims that I regularly receive messages from an invisible parent that you never get to see! However, clearly, if you LEARNED to obtain the necessary tools, and gained the necessary UNDERSTANDING of how to use those tools, then... you wouldn't doubt at all! You would be EXPERIENCING EXACTLY what I do! But until that occurs, you will understandably, continue to doubt my own experiences.

While that is a very limited analogy, I think you could understand my point.

ONE person receiving such a signal, using your analogy, would cast doubt. MILLIONS of people receiving CONTRADICTORY signals stresses incredulity.

God created the PHYSICAL WORLD to run AUTOMATICALLY! That is why heavenly bodies rotate, and why there is such an exact and measurable science to everything we observe in the cosmos. God created the PHYSICAL WORLD as a HOUSE or DWELLING PLACE for HUMANS. He did this, because He intended to give HUMANS a particularly powerful gift... the gift of FREE WILL. He created humans with the intention of their being able to have GOD-LIKE powers, over... THEMSELVES! He gave us FREEDOM to CHOOSE the directions of our own lives. Because all people will not use that freedom for GOOD, and LOVE, then it becomes a potentially DANGEROUS POWER, because we can instead CHOOSE to do EVIL and to HARM OTHERS and to HATE and be DESTRUCTIVE, etc... Therefore, he created a NEW WORLD.... A NEW PLANE OF EXISTENCE, where this "experiment" (creating autonomous beings that can defy God and spiritual law) could play out, without bringing harm to the ETERNAL and PERMANENT EXISTENCE of the SPIRITUAL WORLD (which is actually MORE REAL than this world)

It is actually almost like placing a mentally ill person, in a padded room, where their damage (if they choose to be violent) is limited to THAT SPACE and THAT SPACE ONLY!

The COSMOS... is "OUR SPACE"

This would be the Jewish version of God, who set things in motion and now waits on the sidelines somewhere until the apocalypse. That still leaves thousands of other deities.

It is only the PHYSICAL WORLD that allows for the possibility of sin to exist, and so God created it to function INDEPENDENTLY and AUTOMATICALLY! Heavenly bodies rotate, in constant circular motion, to perpetuate it, along with the laws of thermodynamics, and everything else that science and physics have discovered about our physical state of existence.
God is NOT physical!

So, no miracles? Not very God-like.
And it doesn’t address all Earthbound explanations of a Supreme Being or Beings (in polytheistic cultures).

People who communicate with God (and spiritually too I presume) are deluded or mentally ill in some way, or having hallucinations, etc...
I have had such experiences, and I am not deluded or psychotic in any way.
Mike... that is a TRUE STORY about my own family. I would NEVER use anyone's death, as a TOOL for making up or telling a false story.... PARTICULARLY not about my own deceased uncle, who I loved!
Now... YOU EXPLAIN that to me, and tell me where DELUSION fits into it!

Not to disparage you or your relatives but, grief does affect memory, and a LIAR wouldn’t admit being one would he? So, I should just have faith in this story at face value? Nope.
Also, this seems inconsistent with your prior hypothesis of the supernatural’s role in the universe.
Let’s just agree to disagree and drop it. At least you’re more logically-minded than many others.

I know what you guys are saying here about evolution. I just don't think humanity was birthed from a tadpole or anything, otherwise that would still be the way human lives were formed. That's just what I believe about that.

You've never seen a picture of a sperm cell?

Human evolution is interesting though. People are living longer, children develop faster physically, and everyone just seems to have adapted to living a faster way of life. In the past twenty years things have changed dramatically. Even the English language is different. I wonder what things will be like in another twenty years...heck, even ten years from now.

Yup.

The great thing about you and Craig, George is that you guys still have logical, open minds even though you a religious. Unfortunately there are many others who are not as logical or open minded. Their minds are shut tighter than a steel beaver trap.

Thanks Jimmy.

I don't consider myself "religious" I guess because by definition, many of the things I've studied are considered religions.

I mean really how many Christians do you know who see no conflict of interest in practicing Buddhist breathing techniques or Taoist meditation principles ??

I also don't like the modern fad of calling oneself "spiritual".
Hell, if I was " spiritual " I would not be in daily struggle with my own demons. I remain in the flesh with all it's weakness ... for now.

I'm just an average guy who knows that Christ died for me so that I may live with the Father for eternity.
Incapable of keeping the law, the Gospel is the good news of my salvation.
Amen!

Wow, you guys have been having fun here while I've been away.

I have my own beliefs which I'll just keep to myself. It isn't going to matter if I share them anyway.

However, I will say this:

(a) You want truth, you needn't look further than your own heart. If you want to know right from wrong, it's embedded inside of us. We don't need books, laws and all that other b.s. You want to feel The Wonderous All or God, you close your eyes and you can feel that Spirit, that Essence flowing through you. It's a beautiful thing.

(b) Anyone who claims that they know the Truth, and offers you that Truth through threats and fearmongering are suspect and full of sh*t in my book. Here I'd like to refer to Jiddu Krishnamurti when he voiced his "Truth is a Pathless land speech" when he dismantled the Order of the Star back in 1929. http://www.jiddu-krishnamurti.net/en/19 ... hless-land

(c) I don't think any human can fully understand the scope or what is the Being that was responsible for the creation of the Planet and the living things in it. It's through my limited knowledge of physics and science that shows how wonderful everything flows together and the synergy of nature. God can't be personified into a mere human male with human personality. There are intelligences out there in the Universe that we have to evolve to in order to fully understand the nature of them. As a human, I am too inferior to do so. Therefore, all I can do is go with (a) follow what my heart tells me.

So I'll stop there.

Chaeya