J-HALEY wrote:When I was in Vegas recently I noticed they don't sell beer by the bucket there! I was heart broken!
Yeah but the drinks free in the casinos...arnet they? (Last Time I went they tried to get me drunk that way)
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The latest project is the only one where I can give you real numbers because it's the only one I have total control over administration.
Went into a studio with 4 jazz players on Oct 31st. We recorded 10 songs live over 7 hours. The next day, Nov 1st, I redid some vocal parts and recorded clarinet and viola on a few songs. The next day, Nov 2nd, we mastered. The next day, Nov 3, it went to manufacturing.
Total numbers from start to 1,000 finished copies was $8,200. It took a couple of weeks to manufacture and I stopped touring for a week for Thanksgiving. Did a 3 week tour in December and now 3 weeks into a tour that goes through April. So far I've sold 900 of that first run and ordered the next batch today.
Practically none of my audience knows I have a new one out because I haven't promoted, advertised, or distributed yet. I honestly didn't make the decision to produce a new CD until Oct 29th, only 2 days before we started recording, so all I've sold is from the gigs I've done over the recent 6 weeks of touring.
This new one gives me the opportunity to start my own distribution network so I'm building a wholesale business and have no doubt that it will succeed if I am faithful in the small things; like calling places that sell my older projects and getting them to take the new one. I'll hire a girl to spend 2 days a week on the telephone as soon as I've printed all the forms she'll need.
So here are the numbers: This first run (1,000) cost $8.20 each when you include production costs. I'm selling at gigs for $15 which nets $6.80 each. Wholesaling them at $9 nets .80 cents each.
However the next 1,000 run will only be $1.39 each (below $1 if we press 5,000) and will net $13.61 each retail and 7.61 wholesale.
Last Monday in Tacoma I did almost $1,300 in merch sales without any product from the former label on my table. It takes a lot of merch to make money on it. I seem to average between $200-400 merch per gig, and maybe once or twice a month I'll hit a good one like that one.
With sales of only 900 so far, cost has been recouped and it's pure profit over the price of pressing disks now. BTW, also still selling 2 indie projects from the late 90s (though I never play those songs)
It's always a matter of trusting the outcome of investing all your time in music verses the pull of paying the bills now and keeping finances consistent with a day job.
If it takes you 5 or even 10 years to got to a point where you are your own boss, what else would you rather be doing in 10 years??? On the other hand if you've got bigger aspirations than riding in a bus all day long for the rest of your life, I totally get that too. This ain't for everyone or everyone would be doing it.
My only point is that no matter what you really want to do with your life, if you will take the time to make a plan and work at it more than the next guy, dreams do come true. It's the law of sowing and reaping.
Went into a studio with 4 jazz players on Oct 31st. We recorded 10 songs live over 7 hours. The next day, Nov 1st, I redid some vocal parts and recorded clarinet and viola on a few songs. The next day, Nov 2nd, we mastered. The next day, Nov 3, it went to manufacturing.
Total numbers from start to 1,000 finished copies was $8,200. It took a couple of weeks to manufacture and I stopped touring for a week for Thanksgiving. Did a 3 week tour in December and now 3 weeks into a tour that goes through April. So far I've sold 900 of that first run and ordered the next batch today.
Practically none of my audience knows I have a new one out because I haven't promoted, advertised, or distributed yet. I honestly didn't make the decision to produce a new CD until Oct 29th, only 2 days before we started recording, so all I've sold is from the gigs I've done over the recent 6 weeks of touring.
This new one gives me the opportunity to start my own distribution network so I'm building a wholesale business and have no doubt that it will succeed if I am faithful in the small things; like calling places that sell my older projects and getting them to take the new one. I'll hire a girl to spend 2 days a week on the telephone as soon as I've printed all the forms she'll need.
So here are the numbers: This first run (1,000) cost $8.20 each when you include production costs. I'm selling at gigs for $15 which nets $6.80 each. Wholesaling them at $9 nets .80 cents each.
However the next 1,000 run will only be $1.39 each (below $1 if we press 5,000) and will net $13.61 each retail and 7.61 wholesale.
Last Monday in Tacoma I did almost $1,300 in merch sales without any product from the former label on my table. It takes a lot of merch to make money on it. I seem to average between $200-400 merch per gig, and maybe once or twice a month I'll hit a good one like that one.
With sales of only 900 so far, cost has been recouped and it's pure profit over the price of pressing disks now. BTW, also still selling 2 indie projects from the late 90s (though I never play those songs)
It's always a matter of trusting the outcome of investing all your time in music verses the pull of paying the bills now and keeping finances consistent with a day job.
If it takes you 5 or even 10 years to got to a point where you are your own boss, what else would you rather be doing in 10 years??? On the other hand if you've got bigger aspirations than riding in a bus all day long for the rest of your life, I totally get that too. This ain't for everyone or everyone would be doing it.
My only point is that no matter what you really want to do with your life, if you will take the time to make a plan and work at it more than the next guy, dreams do come true. It's the law of sowing and reaping.
It is what it is until it isn't
I don't think I'd give numbers out to anybody,
but that's just me. Your genre Mr Yod seems to
be all over the board. I've (I think it's you) seen
you in a wig doing a rocking number, and I watched
another video, that had me singing Havi Nagli all
weekend. Perhaps that is part of your appeal.
I'm glad everybody's enjoying their bar gigs, I just
can't take playing them regularly. I'm not much of a
honky tonker anymore, but into the music more than
I've ever been.
Seems like it's the money or the audience that musician's
crave in the bars (maybe the beer and skanky hoes).
The only reason you're not making more money in the
bar's is cause you ain't selling yourself to them. Flattery
and charm will get you everywhere with men and woman.
There's better paying places than bars, you as a musician
have to find them, band promotion. People that regularly
perform at these festivals around here always play in front
of the biggest audiences. Everyone that I know that does it,
does it for free, but sometimes play in front of crowds as
large as 20,000, tho not the draw they are part of the show.
It's probably a fact that making money in music is no different
than making money in selling imported goods, those that make
the most money at it, work it the hardest, like 24/7.
A woman calls the music store and asks the manager if he has
the new single by Hot lips and the & kisses? The manager already
drunk, said no but, I've got hot nuts and seven inches, the woman
asked is that a record, the manager said no, but a damn good
average.
My Grandpa loved that joke.
but that's just me. Your genre Mr Yod seems to
be all over the board. I've (I think it's you) seen
you in a wig doing a rocking number, and I watched
another video, that had me singing Havi Nagli all
weekend. Perhaps that is part of your appeal.
I'm glad everybody's enjoying their bar gigs, I just
can't take playing them regularly. I'm not much of a
honky tonker anymore, but into the music more than
I've ever been.
Seems like it's the money or the audience that musician's
crave in the bars (maybe the beer and skanky hoes).
The only reason you're not making more money in the
bar's is cause you ain't selling yourself to them. Flattery
and charm will get you everywhere with men and woman.
There's better paying places than bars, you as a musician
have to find them, band promotion. People that regularly
perform at these festivals around here always play in front
of the biggest audiences. Everyone that I know that does it,
does it for free, but sometimes play in front of crowds as
large as 20,000, tho not the draw they are part of the show.
It's probably a fact that making money in music is no different
than making money in selling imported goods, those that make
the most money at it, work it the hardest, like 24/7.
A woman calls the music store and asks the manager if he has
the new single by Hot lips and the & kisses? The manager already
drunk, said no but, I've got hot nuts and seven inches, the woman
asked is that a record, the manager said no, but a damn good
average.
My Grandpa loved that joke.
It's a good day to die
#163482 by jimmydanger
Thu Jan 26, 2012 2:29 pm
Thu Jan 26, 2012 2:29 pm
Yod, seems like you spent $7,000 recording (and mixing and mastering) your CD (reproduction costs should be around $1,200). That's not an outrageous amount but more than many on this board could afford. What was the biggest part of this cost? Did you have to pay the studio musicians a lot? I try to keep costs down since I'm the guy writing the check.
Lynard, most bands are slogging it out in bars and lounges. The really good paying gigs are out there but usually taken by an 'A' list of bands. My friend's band 50 Amp Fuse gets such jobs; they charge a minimum $1,000 for bar gigs and $1,500 to $2,500 for corporate and wedding gigs. They're really good but nothing I would aspire to. To me they've accepted that they have nothing to create and are musical whores. I would rather burn my guitar.
Lynard, most bands are slogging it out in bars and lounges. The really good paying gigs are out there but usually taken by an 'A' list of bands. My friend's band 50 Amp Fuse gets such jobs; they charge a minimum $1,000 for bar gigs and $1,500 to $2,500 for corporate and wedding gigs. They're really good but nothing I would aspire to. To me they've accepted that they have nothing to create and are musical whores. I would rather burn my guitar.
"You know I may be a sinner but I'd rather spend my money on women and booze that tastes like paint thinner.."
(not really true, but it sounds like a good lyric) lol
(not really true, but it sounds like a good lyric) lol
If you don't like what I say, you can
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLqsfwRvYtU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLqsfwRvYtU
RhythmMan-2 wrote:I've hears this many times, but this fellow says it best.Musicians shouldn't be paid, shouldn't even need money, we should all be taken in by aristocrats and noblemen wherever we live at the moment, fed and catered to, our every whim satisfied, our every comfort supplied!
.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/78468650/La-Club-Owners
.
Great article, about 5 -10 min of reading.
.
Why it's in a club's best interest to pay bands good money.
jimmydanger wrote:Yod, seems like you spent $7,000 recording (and mixing and mastering) your CD (reproduction costs should be around $1,200). That's not an outrageous amount but more than many on this board could afford. What was the biggest part of this cost? Did you have to pay the studio musicians a lot? I try to keep costs down since I'm the guy writing the check.
I pay musicians well because I use only the best and want them to be happy when I call them about coming into the studio. I've used the same basic band since 1997, shuffling players based on who is not on tour once in a while. All my guys have a long rap sheet of super-pro dimensions.
One guy got $700 for the day, two of them got $800, and another took $500. Viola got $250 for 2 songs. I gave everyone more than they actually asked for. The studio and engineer made the rest and also did the mastering in-house because that is really their specialty. Graphic design was $300 (a real steal considering who did it)
I once spent 3 years recording a CD because I did as much as I could afford at a time...and it took that long to get the results I wanted. But it was worth something when I was done, and still cheaper than a college education.
Most people aren't willing to invest that much money in a recording. They don't trust that it will take them farther than playing bars will...and would rather invest their money in weed or beer. And that is what they will reap.
But for those who are serious about succeeding long term in the music business, the focus shouldn't be on live performance but producing product that can be sold in live performance, and performing it so people will buy. It makes absolutely no sense to me to go a play a concert unless there is a product I'm trying to sell. This is what being a "recording artist" means and those are the only people really making any money at this. There is a reason why the record labels usually only sign the songwriters in a band.
I'm not diminishing the sheer fun it is to perform and that's enough for most people who call themselves "musicians". No shame in that whatsoever....just trying to dispel any myths that might be held about how to make (real) money doing music.
Last edited by t-Roy and The Smoking Section on Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:43 pm, edited 7 times in total.
It is what it is until it isn't
this is certainly not unusual
if you want musicians in your studio but not in your daily life they have to be paid.
for original material this is the best way to do things, when you think about it.
most studios keep a list of session guys available.
not much different that my daughter is regularly paid for recitals and performances.
if you want musicians in your studio but not in your daily life they have to be paid.
for original material this is the best way to do things, when you think about it.
most studios keep a list of session guys available.
not much different that my daughter is regularly paid for recitals and performances.
Well the crowd was very small
For a country music show
So he faked a curtain call
Just like it was years ago
Then a lady grabbed his arm
As he staggered down the aisle
And with all his country charm
He addressed her with a smile
Would you catch a fallin star
For a country music show
So he faked a curtain call
Just like it was years ago
Then a lady grabbed his arm
As he staggered down the aisle
And with all his country charm
He addressed her with a smile
Would you catch a fallin star
It's a good day to die
Etu Malku wrote:RhythmMan-2 wrote:I've hears this many times, but this fellow says it best.Musicians shouldn't be paid, shouldn't even need money, we should all be taken in by aristocrats and noblemen wherever we live at the moment, fed and catered to, our every whim satisfied, our every comfort supplied!
.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/78468650/La-Club-Owners
.
Great article, about 5 -10 min of reading.
.
Why it's in a club's best interest to pay bands good money.
I find that comment to be very interesting, because the "tithe" was actually given to support the Levite Priests of the Temple. Most of them were musicians. So for a church to truly run on a biblical model, they should be supporting the musicians primarily. There were no preachers in the Temple.
I realize that doesn't mean spit to you, Etu, but I laugh when I hear preachers talking about receiving the tithe that rightfully belongs to the musicians.
I've been transparent about what I do because I always wished someone would answer those questions when I was coming up. If I told you guys my name you wouldn't recognize it. I am really a nobody except to a particular audience whom I serve with music written with them in mind. The point I'm making is that you don't have to be a superstar to make money as a musician, but you do need product to sell because venues are inconsistent and don't pay jack these days.
It doesn't take a lot of sales to make a decent living at it. I've raised 6 kids and have a nice home in a cheap neighborhood, all on songwriting and singing. Faith in the bible means "strong trust". It means you have strong trust in the outcome enough to start working toward that goal today. So c'mon...do you guys really believe that Lady Gaga is more talented than you?
No, she just has clever songs recorded well that she can sell...
Last edited by t-Roy and The Smoking Section on Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:45 pm, edited 3 times in total.
It is what it is until it isn't
Lynard Dylan wrote:Well the crowd was very small
For a country music show
So he faked a curtain call
Just like it was years ago
Then a lady grabbed his arm
As he staggered down the aisle
And with all his country charm
He addressed her with a smile
Would you catch a fallin star
Sung to the cadence of Hot Rod Lincoln
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X18mtr1nFsM
"You'll know it's me when I come through town.." lol
Lynard, send me a check for royalties !!! lol
If you don't like what I say, you can
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLqsfwRvYtU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLqsfwRvYtU
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