General Music Chat

Kramerguy,
You said, ". . . First, it's time consuming. . . . this has been done to death. . . . you ask for credible proof, and then when presented with it, just completely denounce it with shameless rhetoric without actually addressing the facts, or you just never respond, and then 3 months later, it comes up and you demand sources and cites again.
. . ."
. . . .
Hmmm . . . yeah, I've seen that real a lot . . . never commented on it . . .
(I'm not commenting about anyone specifically, guys . . .)
I have seen this in several interviews, also . . . .
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You just reminded me why I don't waste time talking politics . . .
. . . no one wins, just one guy gets pissed off and leaves, letting the other guy thinking he won, even if he didn't . . . everyone loses . . .
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Ok, later, guys, I'm removing myself from this conversation. I'm going to go write a chorus for a new song I've been working on, instead.
Later . . .

.
You just reminded me why I don't waste time talking politics . . .
. . . no one wins, just one guy gets pissed off and leaves, letting the other guy thinking he won, even if he didn't . . . everyone loses . . .
.

Yeah, that pretty much sums it up.

My final word on politics is just to beg people to get informed. America has become divided, and there are powers in this country that not only benefit from the infighting, but that actively support and encourage it.

The more we fight with each other, the less our leaders have to fear from a united and informed public.

In the end, we're all americans, and generally all want the same things for ourselves and our kids. These "hot-button" issues are thrown in our faces every election to avert our attention from the real, solvable problems.

We will never all agree on abortion, death penalty, immigration. But I bet we could all find common ground on foreign policy, energy independence, diplomacy, infrastructure. And the lobbyists in Wash DC represent none of that. They represent the top 3% of the wealth in this country, which really doesn't give a crap about anything except $$ and power.

I'm guilty of throwing my own harsh words into these frays. Sometimes we need to take a step back and look at the bigger picture. And with that, I bid this thread goodbye!

Who left the pulpit out here in the meadow..?? lol I smell preachers..

Supporting any human by voting for him/her is putting faith in a broken system. Republican. Democrat. Two sides of the same worthless coin.

Here are some more examples:

Sunni - Shiite (Middle East / Muslim world)
Catholic - Protestant (Ireland / Christian world)
Conservative - Labour (UK)
Tutsi - Hutu (Rawanda)
Serbs - Croats (Balkans)

Political, religious, cultural, ethnic, tribal, racial

Monarchy, dictatorship, democracy, socialism, communism, feudalism

People will hate. People will kill. People want solutions. People don't agree on solutions. Reliance on a system made up of imperfect people is pure folly.

So, are you saying that the average Democrat may be speaking before thinking, and the average Republican, being older & more experienced, might be wiser?

Republicans and Democrats?

I think I was talking about "Liberals" vs "Conservatives"

There are liberals and conservatives on BOTH sides of the aisle. Joe Lieberman, was a well known "conservative" Democrat, before he became Independent.

"If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain."

This quote is misattributed to Churchill, but is one often quoted.

Also, I did not say that ALL liberals speak without thinking, but the most liberal among them generally do. They are confrontational. Diliberately provocative and inciting. This is generally not the nature of conservatives.

Having said all that, conservatives and liberals NEED one another. They balance one another out. Many conservatives lose the willingness to try new things, to believe there may be a better way to reach a goal. They often get set in their ways, and are unwilling to try untested things. They tend to be willing to enforce their religious or moral beliefs on adults that should have the right to determine their own lives in the privacy of their own homes, etc.. etc...

There are things to be valued in both liberal and conservative thought.

Obama quotes.

While I realize that struggling with identity of being half black and half white, has been a journey for Oabam, nevertheless, some of these quotes I found, attributed to his first book, are a little troubling. Can anyone confirm these with page numbers? I may be doing a 360 on Obama, YET AGAIN!

Also, the context would be helpful, as I can't know whether some of these were only thoughts or a direction he took, which he may explain further down the paragraph why they were wrong, or something that balanced these statements out?


Dreams Of My Fathers:

"I ceased to advertise my mother's race at the age of 12 or 13, when I began to suspect that by doing so I was ingratiating myself to whites."

"It was my father's image, the black man, son of Africa, that I'd package all the attributes I sought in myself, the attributes of Martin and Malcolm, Dubois and Mandela."

"To avoid being mistaken for a sellout, I chose my friends carefully. The more politically active black students, the foreign students. The Chicanos. The Marxist professors and structural feminists and punk-rock performance poets."

"There were enough of us on campus to constitute a tribe, and when it came to hanging out, many of us chose to function like a tribe, staying close together, traveling in packs."

"(I)t remained necessary to prove which side you were on, to show your loyalty to the black masses, to strike out and name names."

"white people – some cruel, some ignorant, sometimes a single face, sometimes just a faceless image of a system claiming power over our lives."

Ok, I think see . . .
So, are you saying that the average Democrat may be speaking before thinking, and the average Republican, being older & more experienced, might be wiser?

I am laughing my guts out over this!