General Music Chat

I disagree with the consensus that says that music isn't as good as it used to be. I think I'm in the minority that thinks that not only are there is a lot of good music out there in different genres, but that the conditions in the music business are as good as they have been in the last two decades. People are just giving mainstream radio way too much credibility.

Independent labels are becoming more important, and many of them give their artists/bands more freedom to do things the way they want to do them. The average music-minded teenager today is probably much more aware of music that is left of the radar than say when I was a teenager in the late 90's/early 2000's because it is easier to learn about new music. There are more outlets than radio and MTV and people are getting a bit of good stuff in between their prefabricated pop.

What are your thoughts... agree or not?

Excellent points.

I agree, Theres good music with any era. It is a major influence on the next generation of music. Not to sound arrogant, But I would think to state that one certain style, era, etc. of music history "Has no talent". Well....Common knowledge combined with common sense would be my suggestion. There will always be great bands & plenty of talent to go around. Of course, from the Seattle era until now 'Is one of my favorites'. Just a personal opinion, Thats all.

There is some great music out there. The problem is, it's getting harder to find among the sturm and drang of new pop music characterized by perfect looks (latest Vidal Sassoon products included), high powered PR and pervasive marketing that can easily cloud the diversity of the spectrum.

I have been working with other musicians since I was 16, and I have never seen such a lackluster range of instrumentalists, musical disciplines or attitudes in players, as there is today. Search the databases of musicians available and you will get tons of people who pretty much all play the same instruments and want to do music in the same few limited genres (pop, metal, punk, classic rock or *GAG* tribute bands). So what I'm saying is that we are drowning in a sea of biege.

If you dig really hard you can find some amazing stuff out there. I long for the day that "the scene" is much more diverse and friendly to these daring new music forms and players.

I agree and disagree. If popular music is just as good as it was 20 years ago then that isn't saying much. Sure, 20 years ago we saw the near-end of alternative rock but what's happened since? There was good Rap throughout the '90s but that was a culture plagued by misogynism, gangs, violence, and murder (hardly a good thing for society to accept).

I agree that some artists have more freedom in the studio now then they used to. This would be an amazing advantage for a person/group with vision - most of the groups out there, no matter what genre, sound just the same.

It is easier to learn about new music but it's also easy to acquire music illegally. I'm guilty of downloading music for free from time to time but it ruins careers if an artist can sell millions of records but not make any money. Any artist will tell you it's not all about making money - but certainly every artist would rather make money doing something he or she enjoys rather than working a miserable job and only creating in what little leisure time they have.

I've literally combed nearly every rock/pop record made in this decade so far (the 2000s) and I haven't discovered anything great. There's been some good, a lot of bad, but nothing great. I believe it's a bad time for pop music but hopefully that will change. I think the only masterful records being produced in modern times are in the classical genre and nowhere else.

There is some talent out there, though talent doesn't automatically mean this person or group will make something great. The problem with the younger crowd (my generation) is that we all think we are artists of some sort. It may have happened by being raised on the media, or MTV, or whatever, I don't know, but it's a sad state for the arts to be in.

there's almost nothing redeeming about what is mainstream music today. What's real popular is driven mainly by videos. I can't think of a single unattractive female music superstar today. I've even been asked by some of the bar owners that we're trying to get jobs from if I have a picture of the band. I tell them that the band members are all ugly midgets. I guess if you can't show off your belly button you won't get signed to a major label. We'll have to be satisfied to put out a local CD and play for a few appreciative audiences occasionally. Before we played at the international blues challenge in Kansas City one of the judges asked if there's any attractive black guys in the band. Isn't the only thing that matters the music? I think we sound really good for a bunch of over-fed midgets. Later...

Remember Mama Cass, from the "Mommas & the Poppas?"
She had a wonderful voice, and the group had a lot of really great songs; many of their songs were #1 hits . . . and deservedly so . . .
But she was real big, and so today's shallow audiences would reject them, on appearances alone. The Mommas & the Poppas wouldn't get far, today. And, they were one of the best . . . .

.....Before we played at the international blues challenge in Kansas City one of the judges asked if there's any attractive black guys in the band.

LOL - are you kidding me??

And we used to have an attractive black guy in the band a few years ago, maybe somehow she remembered him. Anyway, it's a shame what mainstream music has turned into. I definitely agree about Mama Cass. She wouldn't even get a second look from the big labels. For that matter what about Janis Joplin? You think she would make the finals on American Idol? Why would anybody pay attention to Britney Spears? What has she got to do with music? Later...your friendly neighborhood bluesman fisherman bob

It's the increasing shallowness of American culture.

Oddly enough, that happened with other great empires who were decaying. The Roman Empire went through its era of "Bread and Circuses" (trivial, shallow entertainments of the populace as the walls started crumbling down around it) right before their fall.

look at the flood of illegals coming into our country and our shallow government seems helpless to stop it. Maybe the shallowness of the general population is a reflection of the shallowness of our government or vice-versa. Later...

I agree that our civilization is in decline.
There is little control over people's value systems. TV probably has a lot to do with it; but - that's besides the point . . .
What would have to occur for great music to become prevelent in the main-stream again?

Everything would have to change: values, ethics, social norms, education, honor, etc. (there's much more but that's all I can think of for now). I think when people change and hold themselves up to a higher standard, that will be reflected in their art.

.....
What would have to occur for great music to become prevelent in the main-stream again?

What would have to change? The disappearance of media technology.

It used to be, up until some time even in the last century, that the mere act of performing live music was a real event. People would get word it was happening and they'd swarm to it. They would listen to it, and watch the musician(s) doing it. It wouldn't have to compete with giant screen sports TVs, pool tables and people who didn't even know they were there at nigthclub venues. It wouldn't have to compete with cable TV, DVD, Xbox or Tivo.

In short, I think that we as humans have been demanding more sensory input at higher and higher rates of speed, and losing track of our heartspace when it comes to music. "Soul" doesn't mean what it used to....just give us more cars blowing up! The problem is, we are going to hit (or we are hitting) a barrier with this sensory intake. There is only so much of it that our brains can handle before it all just turns into a blurr and our senses begin to shut OFF. It's like the pro "standard" when it comes to bit rates and frequencies on recorded music. Software and hardware makers keep pushing it up to dizzying heights....32bit 96bit etc...but audiologists will tell you that the vast majority of humans cannot even TELL a difference in sound quality about about 21bit sound. Thats why so many recordings are still in the 16bit 44.1k range. Simply put, thats about the limit of the human ear to discern a quality difference!

A glass ceiling of sorts has been hit. Are we approaching one with our collective other senses? Is this contributing to the minimization of music as a performance art? I guess we will find out.

You have to write a book. I've been saying for years what you said about sensory and knowledge overload, but not so eloquently as you. It may be impossible at this point to turn back the clock and simplify our lives. Everything is too complicated. We're being bombarded wth more and more and more stuff, I don't know how much crap homo sapiens can handle. I watch the old TV shows once in a while (Leave It To Beaver, Mayberry, All In The Family, etc.). As much as we make fun of some of these shows, I'm jealous of how simple life was back then. Could you imagine a modern day re-make of Leave It To Beaver? Could you imagine Beaver asking his brother "Hey Wally, is our new neighbor Mr. Smith a sexual predator?" "I don't know Beaver, let's go on the internet and find out." Or how about "Hey Wally, Eddie Haskell says he wants to kiss mom's beaver, why does he want to kiss me?" "I don;t know Beaver, Eddie must have been watching some porn on the internet." One of my most admired musician's teenage son committed suicide awhile back. I never saw that kid when he wasn't watching some horribly violent video game. I'm talking hours and hours of mindless viewing of the worst violence against all kinds of people. I think he became completely numb to any normal feelings of self-worth. Somehow we need to go back to simpler times. Getting back to the utterly worthless music in the mainstream today, I believe it's due to sensory overload. People have to have a video attached to any song, and every video has a bunch of females showing off their belly buttons or butt cheeks or cleavage. What the hell does any of the videos have to do with music? Absolutely nothing. I don't know what the solution is. I guess all I can do is keep playing what I'm playing and once in a while I get to play in front of somebody. Later...your friendly neighborhood bluesman fisherman bob