General Music Chat

Perhaps bob or Kramer can tell me more about this stuff.

Lyme disease seems to be running wild around these parts. I know several ppl who claim to have it, & I frequently get these lil educational emails on the subject from them.

This is the 1st I've heard of this, though...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

July 3, 2008 Lyme disease may play a role in causing autism according to a recent study published in Medical Hypothesis, a peer-reviewed scientific journal.

A team of five physicians led by Robert Bransfield, M.D., analyzed the two diseases and discovered a connection based on epidemiological findings, symptom similarities, case reports, and laboratory test results.
The Lyme-Induced Autism (LIA) Foundation has paved the way for studies such as this one. Led by Tami Duncan, herself the mother of an autistic child, the LIA Foundation was established in 2006 by a group of parents who suspected the connection but recognized the need for scientific research.

Collaboration on the Medical Hypothesis study began during one of the LIA Foundation national conferences, which have attracted top physicians from around the country.

Charles Ray Jones, M.D., considered the nation's leading pediatric Lyme specialist, was one of nine presenters at a recent LIA Foundation conference held on April 12, 2008 in Fort Lee, New Jersey. "I've treated over 10,000 children with Lyme disease," Jones said during his presentation. "A good many of the children, we've found, have had autism-spectrum disorder."

Warren Levin, M.D., was also present at the New Jersey conference. He described the case of "a terribly ill autistic kid...who tested positive for Lyme disease." Subsequent to that case, Dr. Levin "started screening all autistic patients...and nine in a row tested positive for Lyme disease."
The LIA Foundation hosted their most recent conference on June 27-29, 2008 in Indian Wells, California.

To educate the public about the Lyme-autism connection, LIA Foundation president and co-founder Tami Duncan recently co-authored a book on the topic with author Bryan Rosner. Rosner has written three books on Lyme disease.

"Lyme disease is not the only causative factor in autism," Rosner says. "We know that many other environmental and genetic triggers are involved. However, Lyme disease is the fastest spreading infectious disease in the United States, with an estimated 200,000 new cases per year. Autism cases are also exploding. If Lyme disease can contribute to the onset of autism, then we are onto something big here."

In their book, Duncan and Rosner describe a correlation between the geographic incidences of the two diseases. "The ten states with the highest incidence of Lyme disease are the same states with the highest incidence of autism," Duncan says.

"Research also suggests that Lyme disease can be congenitally transferred from mother to child during pregnancy, even if the mother is unaware that she is infected," Duncan continues. "This can account for the early onset of Lyme-induced autism in young children."

Duncan and Rosner do not believe that the Lyme-autism connection hypothesis is new. Their book states that parents, caretakers, and researchers have long suspected the link. But the recent conferences and peer-reviewed studies are important because they attract the attention of the medical community, which can lead to life-saving research.

"New medical truths do not have significant impact until they are packaged and presented according to accepted guidelines," Rosner says. "The connection is not new, but it is finally receiving proper attention."

To learn more, visit the LIA Foundation website at

http://www.liafoundation.org. Rosner and Duncan's book, "The Lyme-Autism Connection," can be ordered from

http://www.lymebook.com/lyme-autism-connectionor

http://www.amazon.com.

The publisher is BioMed Publishing Group, South Lake Tahoe, California, (530) 541-7200.

Sounds like to me a GIANT red herring. The country of China (a billion plus people) had almost zero cases of autism before 1990. Before 1990 there was virtually zero vaccines administered to children there. In the early 90's China began massive vaccinations. Now there's hundreds of thousands of autistic children in China. I say DO THE MATH. I'm 100% sure that vaccines are the cause of autism. My child was perfectly normal until he received a vaccination. RIGHT AFTER THAT he showed immediate signs of autism. I say B.S. to the lyme connection, anything to let the pharmaceutical companies off the hook will be wildly exaggerated. Neither my wife or myself ever had lyme disease. What a bunch of B.S.....

Thanks, bob. I'm not trying to spread propaganda, you understand, but trying to learn.

Your informed response is most appreciated.

I do find it odd that many doctors & insurance co's refuse to allow for the diagnosis of "Lyme disease," though. They seem determined to either ignore it, or to give it other names in order to avoid the huge payouts the disease seems to require, as it seems to attack so many areas of the body, seemingly at random. In some cases they won't even allow for the tests to be done to prove one way or another whether a patient has the disease.

I am convinced that it is vitamin D deficiency. Vitamin D deficiency is the most common deficiency throughout the world and autism diagnosis rose considerably following the importance of slathering sunscreen...about 20 years ago. My niece is autistic and her mom is deficient in vitamin D.

http://www.ei-resource.org/myblog/Autis ... mates.html

Autism was almost non-existant in medical history until vaccines were introduced that had mercury in it. Do the math...blaming it on anything else is a diversion from the blunt truth....

I'm with Bob on this one, that the connection is bullcrap.

There may be real similarities between the two, as far as increases in occurrence and other shared factors, but the bottom line is that most likely, the similarities are merely coincidence. Juvenile diabetes is also up an equal percentage, but nobody is claiming (yet) that it's related to autism.

That article looks to be published by a foundation that centered around Lyme disease, and IMO, they are just trying to "ride the coat-tails" of the autism movement, which is currently one of the largest movements in the medical community (otherwise soon to be known as the "I told you so" movement).. new numbers finally two years overdue, and SKEWED by the DHHS and CDC put autism at 1/92 (the original # was 1/66, which is why they took two years to throw out individual cases and deny more).

I, like Bob, agree 150% that autism is in all probability caused by vaccinations (in most cases), although I don't know if the mercury is the outright culprit, or just one part of the "toxic cocktail", check out this site for more info on what vaccines have in them (it's damn disturbing)
http://www.informedchoice.info/cocktail.html

Also, our ENVIRONMENT is totally contaminated, especially with mercury (notice all the warnings about eating fish?!?, that's a pretty damn eye-opening thing if you really take the time to think about the implications of that.. ALL 50 states now consider their fresh water fish to be of toxic mercury levels, and ALL 'predator' fish from the ocean are considered to be toxic) And by toxic, I mean above the FDA "safe dose" level.

Thanks for that link again, Kramer, I looked at it a few days ago and it's a real eye opener. Mercury is not the only thing, and notice how they even gave it another name so it's not immediately noticeable as mercury...but they still use it and kids are still required to get these vaccines, which I'm convinced they know are dangerous. As always, all you have to do is follow the money...food corporations are doing the same thing, their food makes people fat and is seriously unhealthy, contains a number of chemicals that they are not required to list on the labels, but it makes them millions so they still do it.

MSG for example - linked to a number of health issues, but it's addicting and makes you LIKE the food, so they lobbied congress and got MSG officially classified as a spice, and now they can still use MSG and simply list "spices" on the label. Follow the money....

Ditto for pharmaceutical companies. Drugs kill more people than the diseases they supposedly are trying to treat, and if you check on it, the people on the FDA who approve these drugs usually move on to high paying jobs with the same companies, or already work for them. Vioxx in particular, killed over 20,000 people before Merckk was forced to pull it off the market. But only after they made some 15 million on that one chemical alone. Follow the money...

I fully agree with Bob here, Autism didn't exist until mercury laced vaccines appeared, and I seriously doubt that Lyme disease is connected, if they check a little closer though they might find out BOTH are connected to mercury, which would explain the apparent link between the two.

Like I said, follow the money...that's the key. So what if kids become autistic, so what if people die, as long as we make lots of MONEY, who cares? When someone gets suspicious and starts to try and bring it to public attention, it's easy enough to pass them off as hysterical fanatics, which has been the standard corporation response for the past 30 years.

that's exactly what happened when someone discovered women were having miscarriages and linked it to pesticides in the local water supply. Oh, they're just a bunch of fanatic, hysterical old women...sorry but I can't find the link right now, I'll try again later. too sore, gotta get off here.

I also wonder if those vaccinations have anything to do with the outrageously high number of ppl diagnised with diabetes, or even if "Type II" is a real chronic condition, as the medical community would have us all believe it to be, or if it's just another excuse to keep us paying for services that we may not really need, if we ate & drank & exercized better.

My wife's doc told her that once she went on those pills, she'd be stuck with them for life. Are they really just making junkies out of all of us?

I find myself becoming paranoid to the point that I won't go to a doc until I'm feeling like death, & even then, I only take part of their advice &/or medications.

Aside from these damnedable ear-aches, followed by bronchitis, occasionally followed by pneumonia, I think I'm pretty healthy.

I've noticed a much higher amount of seasonal allergies, too, & wonder what we've been doing to cause these reactions to a more natural environment. it doesn't seem natural to me...but what do I know?

Philby-
You might also try looking up info on Cerebral Palsy - I've always felt that it was pretty much a similar 'birth defect' to autism in the sense that both are the "product" of a brain that doesn't properly form as it should

I've always believed that CP was a result of 'in-utero' mercury (or other toxin) poisoning.

Pete-
You are correct, of course. Corporate america has been paying off our politicians for the last 30+ years. rampant de-regulation since the early 80's has only compounded our problems since-

The FDA spends more time protecting the food business than the victims.

The DHHS (department of health and human services) and CDC have completely FAILED our society by doing nothing and openly denying obvious corporate poisionings throughout the country, everything from dumping DDT into water supplies, rivers, lakes, to smog, mercury being pumped into the air, etc.. theres NO enforcement from even the most visible polluters.

The three branches of government have broken down with no oversight, mostly within the supreme court (responsible for the breakdown), congress, white house, DoJ, CIA, FBI, NSA, DHS, etc... they've miserably failed on every possible level.

If not for our amazingly strong infrastructure (which IS crumbling), we wouldn't have ever made it this far. Sometimes I wonder how much more the dam can take before it explodes and floods the region.

My son's mild form of CP was a direct cause of a forceps delivery, which was completely unnecessary, as far as I can tell, Kramer.

Perhaps the higher number of caesarian births are due to toxins, or maybe they're just a result of the medical profession's inability to understand how to proerly birth a human child.

In any case, I have very little faith in American medicine.

Mary,

That link didn't work for me. They may have moved the article? Thanks for posting it though. I'll search it on Google. And thanks to Bob and Kramer as well. I know that our best source for vitamin D is the sun, and diseases ARE caused from a lack of this vitamin, like Rickets and others. But supposedly, only 10 to 20 minutes in the sun, is sufficient to prevent this deficiency, and most kids play outside still don't they? Even if it during recess at school. Perhaps some parents apply sunscreen EVERY DAY and for EVERY SITUATION, but I doubt it. I would think that most, use it for pool and beaches, but not necessarily for playing outside in the summer, or before school each day. So I don't know. None of us do. There are many conflicting articles to be found on all of this.

So thanks for sharing Mary, and Bob and Kramer. Our best hope for knowledge is getting it all out there, and trying to find the answers somewhere in the middle of it all.

And Bob, one thing to think about, is just because something SEEMS to be an absolute corollary, does not mean that it is. Other factors could be at play. It takes a lot of investigation and weeding things out to be sure.

For example...

Remember how a glass of wine per day, is supposed to be healthy for us? Wine is made from grapes. We had this information, on it's health benefits, for many decades. But recently, it has been discovered that ANY alcohol is good for you, in moderation on a daily basis. One drink per day perhaps. But these other alcohols (scotch for example) are mostly GRAIN based, like barley, etc...

One is berries. The other is grains.

Why do they help us in the same way?

Maybe it is not the GRAIN or the BERRIES, but instead the FERMENTATION? The process that makes it ALCOHOL and makes us TIPSY?

Maybe a drink a day, calms people down enough, so that it is the EASING OF STRESS that is actually the real benefit, improving our health?

If this were the case, then there would be OTHER ways to accomplish the same thing. Like meditation, prayer, yoga, exercise, etc...

All I am suggesting, is that it is not always as cut and dry as we may think on first inspection.

I accept that vitamin D deficiency is bad for us. I also have no problem believing that some vaccinations could actually be harmful as well. Sometimes harmful results of things meant for good, are not realized until many decades later.

But how do we know that it is vaccinations? If China opened up to things like vaccinations at a certain time, maybe they also opened up to other things around the same time? What if it is some other chemical or some other cause?

Also, in general, what is a vaccine? It is usually a small amount of the micro-organisms of the disease itself. They are KILLED or MADE INEFFECTIVE and then put into the body, which attacks the virus, and "remembers" that virus, so that antibodies are formed against it, and protect someone in the future against it.

So in most cases, it would seem to me anyway, that if a VACCINE can cause something like Autism, then so could the actual DISEASE that the vaccine is protecting against. With the vaccine, many fewer people would get this disease full blown, whereas, without the vaccine, huge portions of a population can be infected when it spreads, but spreads in a full form, so that no one has time to develop antibodies against it. Meaning millions of deaths potentially.

So do we remove the vaccines, and thereby sentence millions of people to death from the illnesses vaccines protect against?

This is not a simple issue.

Not at all.

.

Craig, the problem isn't the vaccines themselves, so much as the active ingredients included, for instance:

They commonly include:

Thermisol (mercury)
Aluminum Sulfate
Anti-Freeze
Formaldehyde
aluminum hydroxide
aluminum phosphate
human diploid cells from aborted fetal tissue
benzethonium chloride
many more...

The real issue is that now you have combined vaccinations (MMR) which gives a child 4X the amount of those chemicals.

Testing (and safe dose recommendations) by the FDA was all done decades ago on individual dosages of each of the components, not the combination of those chemicals nor the culmination of the multiple vaccinations combined.

There's a national effort, mostly by parents of autistic children for the DHHS and CDC to "GREEN THE VACCINES"..

Vaccinations are great, so why are all those chemicals in them, you ask?

Simple: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Most, if not all of those chemicals are stabalizers and preservatives. They don't care enough to have to deal with a shorter shelf life, so they don't mind putting everyone at risk to enhance the shelf life of vaccines, and thus the green in their wallets.

they seem real bummed that my kid may never speak, or even be potty trained - she will never be able to care for herself, nor live anything remotely close to a normal life. She will never drive a car, she may never even ride a bike.

What did our government do for her?

Kicked her off SSI disability 15 months ago, saying we made too much money for her to qualify (even though my wife CANT work because my daughter needs 20/7 care), and sent us a bill for $600, claiming we were overpaid benefits back in 2005. (less than $100 a month we got, that sure makes up for my wife not being able to work)

I just took some vitamin D.

I just took some vitamin D.

LOL



When I was searching around, one of the articles I found detailed that Vitamin D as supplements, may actually make dieseases worse.

It was very logically laid out, and by a doctor.

Friggin' internet! LOL

What are we to believe?

Wow.

.