General Music Chat

Kramer your contribution to the band does not make you a dictators since your activities and potential disputes arising from them are related to band functions needed to ensure a successful outcome, I myself when working with bands get very active because we all know when in a bend is not about just show up and play, there are a myriads of chores that need to be done most of the time as by natural selection some band members take it upon themselves the responsibility, to these guys even when they get mad at times I have nothing to complain about, actually these guys should be appreciated.

What I was referring to is the band member that mouths off unnecessarily with uncalled outbursts, most often exaggerated due to their personality and the inability to relate differences in a civil or respectful way, their inability to adjust to the different situations without bringing forth their personal problems makes them unsuitable, these are the type of individuals everyone should run from when they start to impose arbitrary rules and barriers simply because they are in a bad mood or can’t escape their personal problems, financial, drugs, marital or simply because they are miserable by nature. Nobody is perfect to be sure we all have our short comings but if an individual has not reached a certain level of maturity he or she has no place in a group, if I had to make a rule for a band this would be it “you cannot join my band unless you are mature enough to voice differences with civility”

To the fellow who thinks that my opinion doesn’t count I’d like to point out to him that 40% of my financial income and security came from music not only because I play well enough to make money with it, also because my judgment and opinions although failed me at times, overall have served me well. But music is not the real point being discussed here, the topic has to do more with human nature then music or human nature in the context of bands… and when it comes to assess human nature my evaluations and opinions are just as valid as yours.

Hope you do not dismiss your band member’s opinion with the same shortness you’ve dismissed mine.

I wish you financial success and security with your musical career.

Well, I, for one, have never been shy about saying things that I felt needed to be said. If your tone sucks on a song, I'm likely to say something along the lines of how it just isn't working for me, rather than "Dude, your sound sucks!"

I have been known to tell ppl that they need to drink less, that they need to tune their axe, to turn down the volume, etc, when it's necessary, & I don't feel at all bad about that. At the same time, I've been gracious about accepting criticisms like I'm too loud or whatever.

I was working on one of my tunes one time with this hard-headed guy in a studio. After I told him what I wanted, he went in the complete opposite direction, & was very proud of his work & creativity. When it was over & we were listening to it, I looked at him & said "Well, that was exactly what I was trying to avoid." He asked what I meant, & I told him in no uncertain terms yet again exactly what I wanted, & where I wanted it. We did it again, & again, he missed it, preferring to go his own way. I finally just said "Look, this is the way I want it. Can you just please try it my way once, & if it doesn't work, I'll shut up about it?" He got all exasperated, rolled his eyes, huffed a bit & picked up his guitar. When we did it the 3rd or 4th time, I was much happier, even with the occasional slipped bad note, & told him so. He really hated having someone else tell him what & how to play. I never finished that recording, & quit working with him shortly after that. No sense wasting my time on ppl like that.

There was a time, though, that I walked across the stage, put my hand over the fretboard of this guy's axe to mute his playing right in the middle of his big intro on a song, & in front of god & everybody I loudly told him, for the umpteenth time, to tune his frikken guitar. I'm sorry, but ya know, it was one of the best things I ever did to a guy. Now he really tries to keep his tuning in mind when he plays with me. I wouldn't have it any other way.

It depends on the individual. Sometimes you hafta brow-beat 'em, & sometimes you just need to embarass the living hell out of them to get an important message across. There is little in this world worse than playing with someone who's continually out of tune, & I just won't do it. That guy knew it & used it to push my buttons until I stopped it in a way that told him in concrete terms that I wouldn't put up with those shenanigans. Now he tries other ways to push my buttons, but until he finds one that trips my trigger, I usually ignore his antics. Still, he's a jerk, imo, & I'd rather not put up with him at all, but I did, for the good of the band.

What I was referring to is the band member that mouths off unnecessarily with uncalled outbursts, most often exaggerated due to their personality and the inability to relate differences in a civil or respectful way, their inability to adjust to the different situations without bringing forth their personal problems makes them unsuitable, these are the type of individuals everyone should run from when they start to impose arbitrary rules and barriers simply because they are in a bad mood or can’t escape their personal problems, financial, drugs, marital or simply because they are miserable by nature. Nobody is perfect to be sure we all have our short comings but if an individual has not reached a certain level of maturity he or she has no place in a group, if I had to make a rule for a band this would be it “you cannot join my band unless you are mature enough to voice differences with civility”

My mistake. I've been in bands with some real aholes before, but never with the type of guy you just mentioned.

Hope you do not dismiss your band member’s opinion with the same shortness you’ve dismissed mine.

I wasn't sure if that was aimed at me or the other guy, but I figured I let you know that I never discounted what you said, only tried to point out that there are good dictators and bad ones. Something I now know that you already knew.

No Kramer the last paragraph was not directed at you.

I think we can all agree that criticism are necessary, disagreement and conflicts happen when one voices his or her opinions the wrong way or for lack of maturity, it takes the wisdom of a sage and the skills of a diplomat to keep 4 or 5 personality in check, but I still believe that whatever needs to be done to ensure the success and survival of a band can be done civilly including the dismissal of a band member.

Some attitudes and behaviors are easily tolerate when a band is formed by neighborhood, childhood or school buddies, but when a bunch of strangers form a band, then diplomacy becomes paramount, I’m not saying nothing new here, anybody involved with a band knows very well.
This topic important as it is has a depressing side to it, I think I’m going to let it die by not commenting further and go back to the real reason for being on this board I.E. post music talk about music listen to other members music which is my favorite part.