General Music Chat

On the homerecording forums some guy is posting about his Zoom (can't remember if it is a 3 or a 5) and all of a sudden it is buzzing like crazy, bad input is what it sounds like.

I bought a 1st-generation Zoom multi-FX pedal last year off ebay for $23. The sounds were terrible, I resold it for $28.

Thanks for the input Mike.
I just got back from YouTube surfing some of the demos.

I'm sticking with my Marshall amp . . . they all just sound so thin to me.
I'm no sound engineer, something about a true tube distortion is just thicker.

That's what I want, the urge to have absolute control over volume sometimes gets the best of me.
But then I come to my senses.

On the homerecording forums some guy is posting about his Zoom (can't remember if it is a 3 or a 5) and all of a sudden it is buzzing like crazy, bad input is what it sounds like.

I bought a 1st-generation Zoom multi-FX pedal last year off ebay for $23. The sounds were terrible, I resold it for $28.

I agree, the 1st gen Zoom's sound terrible. Actually, I'm not a fan of any Zoom Multi FX processors or most multi FX processors in general.

Thanks for the advice on the Fender, looks like my search continues!

cheers

John

On the homerecording forums some guy is posting about his Zoom (can't remember if it is a 3 or a 5) and all of a sudden it is buzzing like crazy, bad input is what it sounds like.

I bought a 1st-generation Zoom multi-FX pedal last year off ebay for $23. The sounds were terrible, I resold it for $28.

Thanks for the input Mike.
I just got back from YouTube surfing some of the demos.

I'm sticking with my Marshall amp . . . they all just sound so thin to me.
I'm no sound engineer, something about a true tube distortion is just thicker.

That's what I want, the urge to have absolute control over volume sometimes gets the best of me.
But then I come to my senses.

Sticking to Marshall instead of those multi fx boxes eh? AMEN!

cheers

John

[
John[/quote]

JMZ, you might check out the Carvin X100B read the reviews a lot of Jazzers use this amp because the clean channel is so good! I have the V3M and the X100B and that X100B with the graphic EQ assigned to the clean channel IS Jazzer Bliss! [/quote]

Thanks for the recommendation. Always liked Carvin products.
Will need to track one of these amps down for sure

John

i concur w the notion expressed earlier....ya don't see many jazz gtrsts using 4x12 cabs. i mean ya could, but why would you want to?

also, as was mentioned earlier it's not enough to toss off the term "jazz" as one generic all encompassing deal. you wouldn't do that with rock would ya?

charlie christian's jazz is not the same as kenny burrell's, nor larry carlton's nor john abercrombie's, nor Johnnie A's.

a lot of posts seem to be (over)emphasizing "clean". yeah, that IS an important component of jazz gtr, but some of the best jazz gtr tones were laid down using small watt tube combos that had just the right amt of breakup and dirt to really make it sing like a horn. (c christian and earlier k burrell are two examples that come to mind.)

if ya must go the route of a seperate head, you might consider the Acoustic Image line. very popular among current day gigging jazzbos. they're mainly known for their combos, but they also do stand alone heads and cabs ...no 4x12's though!

http://www.soundpure.com/p/acoustic-ima ... Mgodx0EA1g

For cleans, Peavey made a couple of good ones. My Peavey MX is probably the cleanest amp I've ever played, and it's a head, in a factory road case, 30 or 130 watts. Solid state preamp into tube power amp. Have fun finding one...they also made a combo version, 60 watts. You can hear my 130 watter on my player, the song "While We Cry" was done with that amp and a Peavey Patriot guitar, no effects but reverb and slight echo.

Then there's the Classic. Not the modern one, but a 70's combo, 50 watts into a 2x12. 4 inputs, so it can be run series or parallel, really good clean sound but I'[m not sure if they ever made a head. Here's one on youtube, I didn't watch, just checked to be sure it's the same amp. Mine's in need of repair now but I used it onstage for a couple of years, did a great job.

If you want to use a Fender, it can be done, just get the highest wattage you can find and keep the volume down around 3 or 4, that's how Eric Johnson gets his clean sound. A pair of Twin Reverbs, volume very low. His lead sound is a pair of Marshalls. A really high powered Fender at low volume will get a great clean sound. I can get some awesome cleans with my Super Reverb, but not at stage volume, it's only 45 watts. It starts to break up if I set the volume above about 5 or 6. But at 3 to 4 it's nice and clean, sounds great.

Watch out for the silverface Fenders, changes CBS made were not well liked by most guitar players. Mine had really boomy out of control bass, I had to swap out the capacitor that filters bass to tame it down. Stock, bass at 2 1/2 was boomy and too much, now with a simple cap swap I run it around 6 and it's excellent. I made a couple of minor modifications, that and also removed the caps in top of the power tubes that took the highs out, the really high frequencies that give it that chime Fenders are famous for. That's all I did, I couldn't really "blackface" mine, that would require a transformer replacement and a lot of work and expense, just the couple of things I did made it a great sounding amp. The only recording I have of it right now is on Southern Cross, mostly clean. I'll have more later, I'm working with these guys now but for now we're concentrating on getting ready to gig, no recording going on at the moment.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKnqSKQCIs4

Look up Pat Matheny on youtube, you might be able to see wahty amp he uses. I looked up Alan Holdsworth, the few I looked at he was running through a Hughes and Kettner. Oh what the hell you need to hear this guy anyway...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMi2mCe7CKg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIdhhAjMTLw

I think the key to a good clean sound with a tube amp is a lot of watts, I get a pretty good clean tone out of my triple rec, no breakup, just clean, if I want a little breakup on that channel I kick in the Tube Screamer, which would probably work for some of the jazz with a little breakup in it.

On the mesa I just keep the gain on the clean down around 9-10 oclock, and it does pretty good.

But the best amp I ever heard was a Roland Jazz Chorus, those amps are just a staple of carthage companys, and you can run a preamp or pedals into them and make them sound anyway you want.

I remember at one point Alex Lifeson of Rush used them with his processors.

Exactly. That's why I made this comment

If you want to use a Fender, it can be done, just get the highest wattage you can find and keep the volume down around 3 or 4, that's how Eric Johnson gets his clean sound.

A high wattage tube amp at low volume level will almost always get a good clean sound, even a high gain Marshall or Peavey 5150. IF you keep the pre control low. I've done it plenty times on master volume type amps. Keep the channel volume low and the master just high enough to get the overall volume level you want, almost any tube amp can get a good clean sound. For onstage use though, you need plenty wattage so you have loads of headroom. Ditto for straight tube amps with no master volume control, get one that's at least 100 watts and keep the volume low, like below 5 and you will most likely get a clean sound. Most Fenders start to break up around the 4 to 5 range at least a little, regardless of their reputation for clean sound, my Super Reverb does. But keep it below 4 and I get a great clean sound.

If you need onstage volume and clean sound, get the highest wattage tube amp you can find. Keep the volume low, it should get a good clean sound and tubes can't be beat for good tone...no matter what style of music.

Oh yeah, almost forgot...David Gilmour and Pete Townsend both have used Hiwatt amps for years for their clean sound at onstage volume, and I've played a couple of older Gibson tube amps that were still clean at onstage volume. Gibson amps were made closer to hi fi than guitar amp, so they stay clean at higher power/volume levels. I'm not sure if they ever made a head, the ones I played were both 2x12 combo amps but very clean at any volume level we could stand in the store...and I've played Super Reverbs maxed out in there...so I'm talkin LOUD...and still clean...but have fun finding an older Gibson...

Billy I still have my old SUNN MODEL T head, lately Ive been using it for bass when we practice, but its more of a fender circuit from what I remember, has 4 6550 tubes, which makes it around 150-180 watts. It is a great clean amp, hell it will cut glass at a hundred paces!

Sounds like my MX...at 130 watts it will hurt you, I've never had it cranked past about 7 and that was way loud...but I played clean leads on top of a maxed out Marshall stack...the guy couldn't believe it...and I still had headroom...

Those old Sunns were great, I found an interview a while back with Leslie West, when he started out with Mountain they showed up at one of their early shows and the outfit supplying the equipment sent a Sunn PA instead of the guitar amp he needed, so he had to improvise, and found out the PA worked like a current Master Volume amp, and that's what he used to record Mississippi Queen...

There was a screwed up gig in Underground Atlanta where we had to use the other band's gear.

I was used to an SVT. They had a Sun Coliseum. I kept leaning into it trying to hear myself. What I did was destroy the midrange in my left ear.

Talbot

Wonder . . . I've got an old SUNN PA we picked up at a garage sale . . .

hummmm . . . food for thought.

thanks for the tips guys.

My search continues. I like the suggestion of the overpowered fender cabs. I will try those out this weekend and see if I can sound like Eric Johnson

cheers!

John