General Chat (Non-Music-Related)

improvising away and losing it; reverts to rock music with perplexed looks on all their faces, cause they lost their "direction" LOL,,simplify it to pull out of the jam and to save their sorry asses.. funny stuff..

I lost it, here, but kept plowing ahead slathering and slopping my way through it..1st 1:24 is brilliant though
https://soundcloud.com/dayne-nobody-iv/starshine

We all lose it from time to time. In one of the shows of Fallen Angel ... we had a great ending on the third song and instantly the Drummer launched into the fifth song. We all smiled and just went with it and no one noticed ... even the Drummer ! We actually had to show him the live video to prove it. But more often than not when the way is lost, a bit of floundering occurs, etc. Our shows go into each musical piece, one right after the other with no hesitation. The leads are composed and played the same each time. In this way it is more like an orchestra with a great amount of discipline ... no "free style wandering improve or confusions".

Even then at times we lose our way, rarely but it does happen despite all the rehearsals and method. That is why to me it is amusing when "Jazz" musos bumble about and find themselves out of alternatives. Just saying. I readily admit that it takes a good muso to improvise in an intelligent and impressive fashion ... but why handicap yourself and make any "expression" a watered down noisy meandering of unrelated notes when you can have the direction and power of a Panzer or the pleasure of fading rain ? To each his own.

Great Post Dayne and you were honest and fearless by putting up the link. Ta

I owe you credit for this post Vampier, I read your reply to Planetguy, about improvising and losing control and hurriedly switching to a more base rock format.. I laughed my butt off when I read your post.. Planetguy never plays the same piece of music the same note for note, and I have wondered does it ever end up a train-wreck? only Planetguy knows
I can see it now, PlanetJazz is improvising along, and suddenly Planetguy senses something amiss harmonically, the bass line is not exactly jiving with the six-string, and he has some sort of hand signal he throws up and all smile now their faces showing relief and relaxing and they all in time without a hitch, start doing The Thrill Is Gone to end the number as if planned out.. LOL

Good Points but a "Hand Signal" ? Is that not a bit too regimented for the "Free Jazz" mobs ? I have always been told that when you "jive" with other musos then you all just have to look into one another's eyes and you "instinctively" know precisely what to do ... like when a girl looks back at you and you know she wants to "do the wild thing".

in no way am I suggesting Planetguy is nothing but a great musician, I wish there were a few musicians of Planetguy's level of excellence living within a few miles of me.. life would be good.. when me and my buddy jam at swap meet or the laundromat we keep it all blues-lick based,, that way, we never veer off course trying to come up with runs for an uncomfortable jazz chord combination sequence..although I will fill you in on some rules..

1.a chord with an altered fifth or ninth can be substituted for a dominant chord if the next chord is a semi-tone lower..
2. a chord with an altered fifth or ninth can be substituted for a dominant chord if the next chord is a fourth higher

as long as my buddy gives no hint of having the wild thing gesture - look in his eyes we will be ok..

Dayne...first things first.

1. I enjoyed your tune and liked both your gtr and bass playing. Excellent tone on both. funny because I'm not usually a fan of chorus/phase/flange (sorry, not sure what effect you used) but I found the tone most agreeable.

2. Where in the world did you get that ridiculous notion that i never play anything the same way twice????? From the zero gigs you've been at? No. From listening to multiple different live recordings of me playing the same tune differently at different gigs. No. I have to wonder where anyone would come up with such silliness.

3. Sorry, no crash and burn moments forcing a jazz tune to morph into a rock jam-out...again i have to ask where would get such a silly notion?

4. it's no surprise that our sleeper rooskie would take potshots at jazz as it is considered to America's greatest contribution to the world of art... and along with baseball (of which i'm not a fan) to be one of America's most beloved exports. i do understand that people don't like what they can't understand, and especially so among those who turn their nose up against anything that involves improvisation and veering from a tightly regimented script.

it should be pointed out that improvised solos also occur regularly in blues, rock, bluegrass, and other music besides jazz. and so the opportunity to crash and burn lies not merely in jazz but in all music and art that isn't 100 % scripted out. and this is the difference between "art" (or the OPPORTUNITY to create "art" and mere "craft" as i see it.

yes, it does take talent to play a part well the same way over and over again ( i know, because that IS something i have to do as well) but that is simply "craft"....RE-creating the same thing over and over. i agree that does take talent and skill....but so does being a good accountant. the thrill of being in the moment and having the INTELLIGENCE, knowledge, chops, and most importantly something worthwhile and interesting to say... IN THE MOMENT within the discipline of following some very complicated rules that you must navigate.....well, it cracks me up when those who don't get to exp that try to pass off it merely playing whatever you want... or dismiss it as noise. they show their ignorance.

5. as for being a Panzer tank (rolling over everything in it's path)...no thanks. I prefer striving to be a Lambourghini, Ferrari, or Lotus....quick on my feet and negotiating twists and turns w style and grace.

there's nothing like the satisfaction of improvising a good solo that works... and not only making it across the wire w/o falling flat on your keester, but doing it w panache and humor. that is my definition of art....NOT playing a solo or piece EXACTLY the same way every time.

Jazz affords the freedom to create art upon a very closely defined canvas w a lot of very complicated rules.

once again...nicely done dayne. keep 'em coming.

it should be pointed out that improvised solos also occur regularly in blues, rock,

Yep, definitely in rock. Both me and the other guitarist in my band do both improv and 'scripted' leads in our tunes - whatever the song requires. Sometimes its both in one song.

Dayne...first things first.

1. I enjoyed your tune and liked both your gtr and bass playing. Excellent tone on both. funny because I'm not usually a fan of chorus/phase/flange (sorry, not sure what effect you used) but I found the tone most agreeable.

2. Where in the world did you get that ridiculous notion that i never play anything the same way twice????? From the zero gigs you've been at? No. From listening to multiple different live recordings of me playing the same tune differently at different gigs. No. I have to wonder where anyone would come up with such silliness.

3. Sorry, no crash and burn moments forcing a jazz tune to morph into a rock jam-out...again i have to ask where would get such a silly notion?

4. it's no surprise that our sleeper rooskie would take potshots at jazz as it is considered to America's greatest contribution to the world of art... and along with baseball (of which i'm not a fan) to be one of America's most beloved exports. i do understand that people don't like what they can't understand, and especially so among those who turn their nose up against anything that involves improvisation and veering from a tightly regimented script.

it should be pointed out that improvised solos also occur regularly in blues, rock, bluegrass, and other music besides jazz. and so the opportunity to crash and burn lies not merely in jazz but in all music and art that isn't 100 % scripted out. and this is the difference between "art" (or the OPPORTUNITY to create "art" and mere "craft" as i see it.

yes, it does take talent to play a part well the same way over and over again ( i know, because that IS something i have to do as well) but that is simply "craft"....RE-creating the same thing over and over. i agree that does take talent and skill....but so does being a good accountant. the thrill of being in the moment and having the INTELLIGENCE, knowledge, chops, and most importantly something worthwhile and interesting to say... IN THE MOMENT within the discipline of following some very complicated rules that you must navigate.....well, it cracks me up when those who don't get to exp that try to pass off it merely playing whatever you want... or dismiss it as noise. they show their ignorance.

5. as for being a Panzer tank (rolling over everything in it's path)...no thanks. I prefer striving to be a Lambourghini, Ferrari, or Lotus....quick on my feet and negotiating twists and turns w style and grace.

there's nothing like the satisfaction of improvising a good solo that works... and not only making it across the wire w/o falling flat on your keester, but doing it w panache and humor. that is my definition of art....NOT playing a solo or piece EXACTLY the same way every time.

Jazz affords the freedom to create art upon a very closely defined canvas w a lot of very complicated rules.

once again...nicely done dayne. keep 'em coming.

thanks, but it pretty much sucks in my opinion, but I would like to keep the first 1:22..

Planet Jazz gig last.....as usual i amused myself (mostly) and one or two others dropping some quotes into my solos. "My Sharona"...."Andy Griffith Theme"...."Windy"...."Georgie Girl" . Always fun to drop a quote from a pop tune into a straight ahead jazz tune.

But try as I might...i could NOT find a way to slip "Thrill is Gone" into anything!

Thanks Dayne ...excellent chatter going on here so I will resist any Post as I do not desire to contaminate it will you know what.