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Why Gun Control Makes No Sense

PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2016 5:23 pm
by DainNobody
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/cop ... mo-n530982

unless they are able to mandate that all gun stores are to be in protected underground bunkers or vaults, they(gun control advocates) have no case against a law-abiding citizen having the right to own a gun.. watch the video and see where the guns end up, in the hands of criminals

Re: Why Gun Control Makes No Sense

PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2016 7:16 pm
by t-Roy and The Smoking Section
Dayne Nobody IV wrote:unless they are able to mandate that all gun stores are to be in protected underground bunkers or vaults,




dude, don't think they wouldn't try it! Stop giving them ideas. :o


I'm glad that they got some of them. Hope this leads to find all the weapons in all the previous smash-n-grabs that happened.


.

Re: Why Gun Control Makes No Sense

PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2016 10:29 pm
by DainNobody
jimmy, since it was a Constitutional right written in the Constitution that it is legal for a citizen not a felon to own a gun, I wonder what the writers of The Constitution had in mind when they wrote it as a guaranteed right?.. I can only imagine it was for the purpose of citizens to defend themselves against invaders, whether it be British soldiers or modern day muslim alqaida embedded terrorist celss within the U.S. borders.. could you imagine a society with no guns if it ever came to Chinese, muslims, or other enemies invading after a electro-magnetic pulse bomb knocked out our infrastructure including but not limited to, the internet, hydroelectric plants, stock exchanges, food distribution, electrical grid, and need I go on? it would be nice to keep some invaders at least partially at bay with a 12 ga. pump shotgun? :D

Re: Why Gun Control Makes No Sense

PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2016 11:15 pm
by ANGELSSHOTGUN
All criminals were once non criminals.

All non criminals kill as many as criminals. Then they are accounted for as criminals.

Suicides, domestic violence, and accidental shootings, are done by criminals.

A persons past history is no proof that they do not have the ability to kill.

The solution... NUKE this planet, kill everyone, and let the cockroaches evolve into something better a million years from now.

Re: Why Gun Control Makes No Sense

PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 12:08 am
by ANGELSSHOTGUN
Sorry for my little comment. What I meant to point out was 43,000 people were killed by autos. 10,000 people were killed by falls on stairways.

Following Jimmies logic... All cars and stairs should never be manufactured because they cause more deaths than illegal and legal guns in the hands of all people, including criminals.

No I'm NOT! Figure it out.

Re: Why Gun Control Makes No Sense

PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 2:34 am
by MikeTalbot
There is nothing in the Constitution about felons. if there was it would nullify 'divine right' etc. Just to clarify.

Let me present a problem I'm encountering in this debate on guns. No bumper stickers please because the real world is a lot more complicated.

My books show a libertarian society morphing into a police state. Everybody has guns. That is a very tenous police state which because of the guns, could become a civil war very easily. Meantime, ptsd from fighting zombies is almost as much of a threat to human viability as the Zs - suicides, accidentals and homicides all over the place.

does this influence how I personally think about gun rights? Or how you think about it? Would you wish to be unarmed during a Z-poc? Of course not.

Would you wish everybody in the state to be suffering from ptsd, probably on chill pills and armed to the teeth. Maybe not...

Can't have one without the other. I'm struggling with this.

Talbot

So let's talk about guns...

Talbot

Re: Why Gun Control Makes No Sense

PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 3:01 am
by RGMixProject
Americans use guns in self defense 2,500,000 times per year. In more than 1/2 of the self defense gun uses, the would-be victim was under attack by 2 or more criminals, making a firearm the only viable means of self defense. The overwhelming majority of these defensive gun uses were never reported by the news media. Gun ownership protects 65 lives for every 2 lives lost. Do you want any of your friends or family to be a part of the lost life? Get a gun and learn how to use it to protect yourself, your family and your friends. I have a hand gun, rifle and a shot gun to protect us from wild animals and wild people.

Re: Why Gun Control Makes No Sense

PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 5:01 am
by DainNobody
The Second Amendment to the constitution, as ratified in 1791 by that real life American super hero, Thomas Jefferson, says this: "A well-regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."

Re: Why Gun Control Makes No Sense

PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 5:13 am
by RGMixProject
RUI Musik wrote:Ridiculous. You lie almost as much as Trump himself. It's less than 68,000, not 2.5 million.

"The problem is: The 2 million figure — often inflated to 2.5 million in N.R.A. literature — is bogus. Defensive gun use is actually quite rare.

A new paper from the Violence Policy Center states that “for the five-year period 2007 through 2011, the total number of self-protective behaviors involving a firearm by victims of attempted or completed violent crimes or property crimes totaled only 338,700.” That comes to an annual average of 67,740 — not nothing, but nowhere near the N.R.A.’s 2 million or 2.5 million."

http://takingnote.blogs.nytimes.com/201 ... -use/?_r=0


Let me get this right. You and this V P C know more about this than three different universities and the FBI. You should stop reading the National Enquirer.

Re: Why Gun Control Makes No Sense

PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 10:55 am
by ANGELSSHOTGUN
RG, you don't lie as much as Donald Trump. That whole statement is just an attempt to start a reply with an insult and character attack.
Once again we slip into UNREASONABLE DISCUSSION. :roll:

Re: Why Gun Control Makes No Sense

PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 1:28 pm
by GuitarMikeB
RGMixProject wrote:Let me get this right. You and this V P C know more about this than three different universities and the FBI. You should stop reading the National Enquirer.


Cite your sources, don't just throw names around. Jimmy did. you can choose to believe it , or not.

Re: Why Gun Control Makes No Sense

PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 2:05 pm
by RGMixProject
http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/cdc ... -deterrent

There are approximately two million defensive gun uses (DGU's) per year by law abiding citizens. That was one of the findings in a national survey conducted by Gary Kleck, a Florida State University criminologist in 1993. Prior to Dr. Kleck's survey, thirteen other surveys indicated a range of between 800,000 to 2.5 million DGU's annually. However these surveys each had their flaws which prompted Dr. Kleck to conduct his own study specifically tailored to estimate the number of DGU's annually.

Subsequent to Kleck's study, the Department of Justice sponsored a survey in 1994 titled, Guns in America: National Survey on Private Ownership and Use of Firearms (text, PDF). Using a smaller sample size than Kleck's, this survey estimated 1.5 million DGU's annually.

There is one study, the National Crime Victimization Survey (NCVS), which in 1993, estimated 108,000 DGU's annually. Why the huge discrepancy between this survey and fourteen others?

Dr. Kleck's Answer

Why is the NCVS an unacceptable estimate of annual DGU's? Dr. Kleck states, "Equally important, those who take the NCVS-based estimates seriously have consistently ignored the most pronounced limitations of the NCVS for estimating DGU frequency. The NCVS is a non-anonymous national survey conducted by a branch of the federal government, the U.S. Bureau of the Census. Interviewers identify themselves to respondents as federal government employees, even displaying, in face-to-face contacts, an identification card with a badge. Respondents are told that the interviews are being conducted on behalf of the U.S. Department of Justice, the law enforcement branch of the federal government. As a preliminary to asking questions about crime victimization experiences, interviewers establish the address, telephone number, and full names of all occupants, age twelve and over, in each household they contact. In short, it is made very clear to respondents that they are, in effect, speaking to a law enforcement arm of the federal government, whose employees know exactly who the respondents and their family members are, where they live, and how they can be recontacted."

"It is not hard for gun-using victims interviewed in the NCVS to withhold information about their use of a gun, especially since they are never directly asked whether they used a gun for self-protection. They are asked only general questions about whether they did anything to protect themselves. In short, respondents are merely give the opportunity to volunteer the information that they have used a gun defensively. All it takes for a respondents to conceal a DGU is to simply refrain from mentioning it, i.e., to leave it out of what may be an otherwise accurate and complete account of the crime incident."

"...88% of the violent crimes which respondents [Rs] reported to NCVS interviewers in 1992 were committed away from the victim's home, i.e., in a location where it would ordinarily be a crime for the victim to even possess a gun, never mind use it defensively. Because the question about location is asked before the self-protection questions, the typical violent crime victim R has already committed himself to having been victimized in a public place before being asked what he or she did for self-protection. In short, Rs usually could not mention their defensive use of a gun without, in effect, confessing to a crime to a federal government employee."

Kleck concludes his criticism of the NCVS saying it "was not designed to estimate how often people resist crime using a gun. It was designed primarily to estimate national victimization levels; it incidentally happens to include a few self-protection questions which include response categories covering resistance with a gun. Its survey instrument has been carefully refined and evaluated over the years to do as good a job as possible in getting people to report illegal things which other people have done to them. This is the exact opposite of the task which faces anyone trying to get good DGU estimates--to get people to admit controversial and possibly illegal things which the Rs themselves have done. Therefore, it is neither surprising, nor a reflection on the survey's designers, to note that the NCVS is singularly ill-suited for estimating the prevalence or incidence of DGU. It is not credible to regard this survey as an acceptable basis for establishing, in even the roughest way, how often Americans use guns for self-protection."

(Source: Gary, Kleck and Marc Gertz, "Armed Resistance to Crime: The Prevalence and Nature of Self-Defense with a Gun," Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology 1995, Vol. 86 No. 1.)

FBI 2015 There were an estimated 1,163,146 violent crimes reported to law enforcement last year, along with an estimated 8,632,512 property crimes. Total 9,795,658 crimes in 2015