General Chat (Non-Music-Related)

" BTW- the founding fathers weren't Christian 'fundamentalist'. They had different slants on religion as well as politics (mostly Christian)."

You are correct.

The reason American government could function is that individuals, for the most part, were Christian ands subject to God, a higher authority. And this is the same exact reason that democracy (let alone a republic) can not be successfully instated in any Godless nation. God has set into place rules that demand men think of their brothers above themselves. When men have no higher authority to account to for their behavior they become a law unto themselves, each working towards his own selfish desires with no consideration for others. Our tyrannical entrenched ruling class is a prime example, in this each member of government seeks to empower himself and make his own personal demands on the people they rule. This brings about the chaos that is seen in most nations today. When a man is a law unto himself, he is lawless to God, and when men are lawless to God, their lawlessness is used to lift themselves up and oppress their fellow man. This is the true nature of man for the heart of the carnal man is filled with all manner of evil. It is written of those who deny God:

Rom 1:28 And even as they did not think fit to have God in their knowledge, God gave them up to a reprobate mind, to do the things not right, having been filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, iniquity, covetousness, malice, being full of envy, murder, quarrels, deceit, evil habits, becoming whisperers, slanderers, God-haters, insolent, proud, braggarts, devisers of evil things, disobedient to parents, without discernment, covenant breakers, without natural affection, unforgiving, unmerciful, who knowing the righteous order of God, that those practicing such things are worthy of death, not only do them, but also approve those practicing them.

For this reason nations denying God are destined to destroy themselves.

actually, it (American foundation principles)was more based on Masonic virtue rather than Christian ideals.. we must worship our Lord Lucifer.

you tell me you have not seen George Washington with his Masonic Apron on? are you telling me you are not aware Washington D.C. is not laid out architecturally on Masonic planning? are you telling me, the reason for separation of church and state is based based on Masonic doctrine rather than Christian theology? come now, the powers that be will become quite annoyed if you believe Christianity and Freemasonry are cut from the same ball of wax.. come now..

" actually, it (American foundation principles)was more based on Masonic virtue rather than Christian ideals.. we must worship our Lord Lucifer"

There are a good many mis perceptions concerning the founding and beliefs of Freemasons. No one knows exactly where freemasonry originated, nor does it offer any particular God. However, I would suggest that a good majority of the people were Christians. The foundation of America was based on Christian principles, not as a church but in Godly principle.


Founding Fathers: Christians or Masonsns or Both?

http://www.endtime.com/blog/founding-fa ... or-masons/

George Washington, Benjamin Franklin and John Hancock were all Masons… Are my heroes also my enemies? America was founded on the Christian principles of our Christian founding fathers.


http://bessel.org/foundmas.htm

Number of FreeMasons involved in the founding of our country

In summary:
Category Total Number Involved Number & Percent Who Were Freemasons
Signers of the Declaration of Independence 56 9 -- 16%
Signers of the U.S. Constitution 39 13 -- 33%
Generals in the Continental Army 74 33 -- 46%


Is there a conflict between Freemasonry and established religion?

http://web.mit.edu/dryfoo/Masonry/Quest ... icult.html

Is Freemasonry a religion?

No, Freemasonry is not a religion. Masons who treat it as such are mistaken. Freemasonry strongly encourages its members to belong to an established religion, although that is not a requirement for membership (only that a candidate profess a belief in a Supreme Being). Masonry is a fraternal organization that encourages morality and charity and studies philosophy. It has no clergy, no sacraments, and does not promise salvation to its members.

"There is nothing in Freemasonry that conflicts with most religions. However, Freemasonry does insist on religious tolerance. To the extent that certain religious groups would wish to suppress other religions or persecute their followers, Freemasons would be in opposition to such activities, and adherents of such groups would be both uncomfortable and unwelcome in Masonry. It is also the case that certain religious groups are misinformed about Freemasonry and believe things about the Fraternity that are not true; basing their opinions on this false information, they then formulate opinions that create conflict."


http://www.msana.com/historyfm.asp

Over the centuries, Freemasonry has developed into a worldwide fraternity emphasizing personal study, self-improvement, and social betterment via individual involvement and philanthropy. During the late 1700s it was one of the organizations most responsible for spreading the ideals of the Enlightenment: the dignity of man and the liberty of the individual, the right of all persons to worship as they choose, the formation of democratic governments, and the importance of public education. Masons supported the first public schools in both Europe and America.

I was being sarcastic about the Lucifer part.I here that a lo,t that they are in league with the devil..I don't buy it.... I know there was a Anti-Masonic "party" or "movement" in the 1800s.. I personally believe the concept of Masonry takes a good man, and makes him a better man, without them(Masons) many inventions that make life more comfortable for earthlings would never have been invented, (air conditioning, air brakes on trains, building techniques, aircraft etc.. ..lest we forget, they will not accept people who do not believe in God, so I guess that leaves out some of the atheists here on bandmix.. for some reason, I have never come across a poverty stricken or morally corrupt Mason..

Did someone say lunch or launch?
Did someone say fire or fire?

Sorry Badstrat, this has turned into a ridiculous conversation.

Did someone say lunch or launch?
Did someone say fire or fire?

Sorry Badstrat, this has turned into a ridiculous conversation.

yes Glen, perhaps, but you must admit it, Obama looks cool with that fez on his head..

"Don't make me do it w/o the fez on!" - Donald Fagan

" Did someone say lunch or launch? Did someone say fire or fire? Sorry Badstrat, this has turned into a ridiculous conversation."

But Glen,

Isn't that the nature of most Bandmix threads? Who wants to keep on topic anyway? That makes boring reading. ( We dyslexics understand)

"The one that's driving has a bowler hat. The other has a fez on his head..." Country Joe McDonald, "Flying." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYcOkvGa5cA

Talbot